View Full Version : What snail for a planted tank?
Skittyfish
05-07-2003, 11:42 AM
I plan on getting at least one snail to hopefully help with algae control. What is best for a planted tank? I also have small loaches, so I don't want anything to tiny, although the ones I looked at were way to big to be eaten.
TIA
I find that Ram's Horn snail do well in my tank. They get to be a fair size and don't seem too interested n destroying my plants. They do breed quite quickly but I assume the loaches would take care of the small ones.
somefinnfishy
05-07-2003, 1:47 PM
i could send you some RED ramshorn snails.$3 each plus 4 bucks to ship.Have some extra plants now also.
Will send you some regular ramshorns for shipping cost only. :D
Loaches do not crunch snails as do puffers, they bite and slurp instead - the bigger the better. The only snail with a chance to survive is the MTS, Malasian Trumpet Snail - the loaches will get some, but the population will survive. In part the survival is from hiding during the light cycle under the gravel. In larger part it is because the have an operculum (which Ramshorns do not) and can shut the door when under threat.
Slip - 3 bucks for red rams - I obviously have been undercharging. Sheesh. :mad:
ChilDawg
05-07-2003, 2:07 PM
I'm thinking that $4 to ship to Canada isn't that bad of a deal, though...might make up for some of the difference in red ram prices (but not all...how much are you charging, RTR?).
I agree with the MTS idea. They reproduce like crazy (given sufficient nutrients) and do a credible job with algal control.
For more about them, check out www.skepticalaquarist.com
nvision
05-07-2003, 2:57 PM
http://www.jaudesign.com/misc/icons/%2B1.gif what RTR said.
also, malaysian trumpet snails don't procreate as fast as ramshorn snails (at least in my experience), which is a great thing. you'd probably don't want ramshorns if you use the nutrifin passive co2 diffuser. my snails just clog the heck out of that thing every few days. PITA.
Skittyfish
05-07-2003, 5:31 PM
MTS-o.k. Now if I can only find that around here. I almost hate to add snails after not having any in my tank, but I have algae that builds up between water changes that my bristlenose just can't keep up with. Could be because she would rather wait for an algae wafer...
ChilDawg
05-07-2003, 5:32 PM
Yes, I've heard that Plecs are not easy to wean back onto algae growing in the tank once they've been supplementally fed for a while. This is why my Oto gets Spirulina only monthly or so.
Skittyfish
05-07-2003, 5:44 PM
My four Ottos try hard, but they are small compared to the algae! I should get some more, or maybe some shrimp. I never have luck with shrimp. They always end up dead.
ChilDawg
05-07-2003, 6:33 PM
It may be the type of algae which is preventing the Ottos from finishing the job. I think that 4 Ottos are capable of finishing the algae in a 72 in less than a week...there may be algae in there which isn't too palatable to the little loricariids.
Skittyfish
05-07-2003, 7:16 PM
I know. Too much phosphate. I got lazy testing. My kh rose, pH rose, CO2 levels dropped, too much fert....and on and on. Now I will have to fight to get it right again!
Something's out of whack Skitty. You're dosing is off somewhere.
Water changes, and back to the parameters that were working before.
I never dose PO4 or KNO3 without testing. Keep plugging. You'll find the answer. And of-course you know I must give my opinion.....snails are not the answer. But hey that's just me. I hate the slimy little suckers.
Hope this was somewhat helpful.
Len
ChilDawg - I get a buck a pop at the LFS, have sent a few to folks I know via mail, small/young only, 8-12 (size dependent) for $5 plus shipping. Not worth the trouble, I gave it up.
Len- I love snails, commonly have MTS, red rams, and white common pond in my display tanks, along w/Amanos. They all look cool to me and earn their keep, even though I'm not much bothered by algae.
somefinnfishy
05-07-2003, 11:59 PM
No I'm not greedy just dont have that many of the good strain left and get 3 each at the auction for them.
RTR I'll buy some from you having a hard time with my strain here mixed with browns the person who sent them to me baged with:rolleyes:
My plan setting up new tank moving stock then letting 20 clown loaches loose on the infected tank.Then bring the fat loaches back to work when they have eliminated the brown ram threat.
BTW I did offer to send browns for shipping only:D and I live 20 miles from the PO:mad:
gnome
05-08-2003, 12:23 AM
I have MTS's, ram's horns (Planorbis sp), common pond snails, Amano shrimp, and red cherry shrimp. I used to have otos, too. Each of these critters dine on different types of algae.
The only thing I've seen MTS's eat is this light-green, fuzzy stuff that was growing on (and *blanketing*) the glass. I think some refer to it as "film algae." Once they reached a dense population, they cleaned the algae completely. But once they're in your tank, they're there forever, unless you dump the substrate into an acid bath or something. They can easily survive your typical 5% bleach bath. I don't mind them in my tanks, though.
My ram's horns are the ones that are sort of auburn-color with the dark leopard-like spots on them. I think maybe Helisoma trivolvis, which is a Planorbe. Now, this little gem managed to chew the BBA off of my Anubias without a single scratch on the leaves! I also put about a dozen in my tank that had BGA (I'd ripped all the plants out by that time) and they ate the stuff right up. I did notice a lot of them dead a few days later, but apparently, they had laid eggs before passing, so the species lived on. They also eat diatoms, which happily eliminated my need for otos. Can't keep an oto alive for more than a few weeks...
The pond snails are my most recent addition to my cleaning crew. I'm told that they don't have the same ability to rasp off tightly-adhered forms of algae, but I'm a bit suspicious that they're putting holes in the tender new leaves of my Anubias 'petite'. I've had the ram's horns long enough to "trust" them; I'm still leery of the pond snails.
I put two Amano shrimp into my 2.5-gallon tank that was infested with hair algae (mainly adhered to driftwood). In one night, they managed to "buzz-cut" a 2"x2" section of hair algae. A few days later, I tossed in two more and pulled out as much of the hair as I could. They've been picking off what they can, and now I can actually see most of the driftwood again!
The cherry shrimp are diligently eating *something* but they're in a tank that hasn't had much of an algae "problem" so I can't say if they're truly effective cleaners or not. I think that due to their size, you'd need quite a lot of them to keep algae at bay. They're not cheap, either.
Diatoms are usually only a temporary problem, but otos LOVE it. Like I said, any oto I buy is as good as dead, so I rely on the ram's horns. Aside from diatoms, otos do very little for cleaning, though my experience is limited.
I've never owned a SAE, but they're supposed to be the best at getting rid of BBA. Flag fish (Jordanella floridae?) and rosey barbs are reputed to be voracious hair/thread algae eaters, but both can get aggressive and/or start eating plants when the algae is gone.
Sorry - I went WAY off the topic. A concise answer would be "ram's horn snail." Just not the Colombian kind (unless you want to get rid of all of your plants).
nvision
05-08-2003, 4:03 AM
i've read somewhere that cherry red shrimps are supposed to eat a greater variety of algae, more effective than amano shrimps. but at about $5/each around my area, i don't have any personal experience with them. GREAT color on them, though.
MTS, you might want to ask around with your lfs. that's what i did and i got over a dozen for free, all 1/2" to 3/4" monsters.
ChilDawg
05-08-2003, 7:15 PM
Originally posted by somefinnfishy
No I'm not greedy just dont have that many of the good strain left and get 3 each at the auction for them.
Hey, sff, I don't know the prices, so I was just curious as to what price RTR charged. I never accused you of being greedy, and I hope that you know that. At some point, I would love to work with you in getting some of those unusual fish which you have for sale, so keep us updated on those...and I won't accuse you of being greedy then, either!!! :)
SFF - I "contaminate" my strain periodically with the browns. It seems to be only way I keep strong reds. Without back-crossing every few years the reds get paler than they should be. I am in a back-cross right now, as I thought the snails were not strong enough in color. I always do this in a new tank (really reset) so I have control, then it take a few months to weed out the baby browns that pop up.
I got whites again this cross also, but they are a very weak strain, die out fast. I see them only soon after a back-cross and then they fade away, even in isolation. Back-cross them with brown and they vanish - all brown offspring in future generations.
I'm playing with a white common pond strain that seems stronger than the white rams. We'll see if it holds or dies back. Normal brown shell and white flesh, they look cool.
Skittyfish
05-08-2003, 9:35 PM
Well, my LFS only had apple and mystery snails. I did come away with 4 snail shells for free...need them for the shelldwellers I'm gonna get.
They didn't even have ghost shrimp. I asked for Amano shrimp very plainly. She said "oh, you mean ghost shrimp." I said "no, I'm pretty sure they are called Amano, but if you want I will find out the scientific name."
Still, no shrimp. Somebody please tell me the scientific name so I can get her to ....well, get it.
ChilDawg
05-08-2003, 9:47 PM
If she won't look for Amano shrimp, you probably won't get them as very few know them as anything else, but the scientific name is Caridina japonica. HTH,
Matthew
Skittyfish
05-08-2003, 9:52 PM
Thanks Matthew. This place took 6 weeks to finally order Kribs for me. They had never heard of them. Scary. And this is a family owned store. One lady tried to tell my that Scats would live a perfectly enjoyable life in pure freshwater. No need for brackish. Oh well. I try to stay informed about what I want before I try to get it.