Blue Ram panting...Is this Ich!??!

[ChrisWalker]

Hi. Well, everything was going good, and then in the passed few days I noticed my male blue ram has slowed down a lot. He's been breathing very quickly and has been very lethargic. Nothing has changed in terms of water quality...

One thing I have noticed he seems to have got some white blobs that have appeared in his dorsal fin. Does this give anyone any ideas?

Someone at Cichlid Forum suggested this may be Ich...Having never really seen it in early stages I need your input.

Check out this pic, in the circles. What do you think?

Thanks.

0,0,0-5. Ph-6.8-7...125 Litres, shares with blovian rams, cherry barbs, dwarf gourami cory..

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y116/chriswalker2k/ICH.jpg

[liv2padl]

doesn't look at all like ich to me.

[12 Volt Man]

that is not ich.

a lot of times fish can get funny little 'blobs" on their fins that look like ich, but are thicker and stay there for long periods of time. My severum has had a few on his right pectoral fin for a year now. He was like that when I got him. I will post a pic if I can.

[ChrisWalker]

Ok...Cool. I think I'd have been happier if it was ich because now I'm clueless.

The thing is the blobs in his dorsal fin have appeared in about 4 days. Wierd.

He's not really moving, I don't think he's been eating either.

[volkl23]

I'm sort of new to blue rams, but is it normal for them to open and close their mouthes constantly?

[musho3210]

my bolivian rams open and close their mouths a lot, but they open it really really small and dont look like they are panting.

What are you feeding it?

[ChrisWalker]

I feed all my rams catfish pellets, tetraprima sinking food, frozen bloodworm and daphnia. The female blue ram and both bolivian rams are fine :)

He is just breathing really quickly.

[12 Volt Man]

german blue rams are fairly delecate fish.

usually, if they are stressed they will darken up.

rapid breathing can be a sign of gill flukes, but usually this is accompanied by a clamped gill plate (operculum).

I doubt if that is the problem. He is probably just stressed for some reason.

Are the larger bolevian rams picking on him?

[quadpants]

Not Ich... some kind of fungus maybe? I would quarantine and treat with medication.

[musho3210]

i wouldnt treat with any medication until you know what it is.

[12 Volt Man]

If he is that stressed he might be better off where he is than trying to move him at this point (unless of course, you think the stress might be from getting picked on)

[ChrisWalker]

Thanks for the replies people, but he died over night :(

What a quick turnover from being fine...He was so nice, he'd have been perfect when he got fully grown. :(

[ralpf]

Sorry for your loss, maybe he was not healthy from the beginning!

[volkl23]

Dang, that sucks. Sorry for your loss :(

[Cathy G]

Not Ich... some kind of fungus maybe? I would quarantine and treat with medication.

No faster way to kill a blue ram than this strategy.
Change the water daily. What is the temp of the tank? If its not at 83-4, bump it up there.

Rams normally have that open/close mouth action which looks like panting. If he has lost color and if his fins are being held close to his body however, it is a sign that all is not well. If you have seen any flashing/flicking or scratching, it could be a sign of gill flukes. Prazi Pro will work fine with blue rams, it is gentle.

If no signs of scratching/itching, then my guess is that it is something internal and unless he throws it off himself he's a gonner. It is very hard to save a strore bought ram, by the time they show symptoms of anything its too late. If you are desperate to try something because the daily water changes haven't perked him back up, you might try flubendazole. (It kills internal protazoa and treats chronic wasting type diseases...) Here is a link to a site where you can snail mail order it...
http://inkmkr.com/Fish/

The other option is feeding metronidazole laced food. Metro+ by hikari can be dissolved in a bit of warm water and their food can be soaked in it. This is a good option when you don't want to treat the whole tank. It is also safe for rams and is for internal parasites. It has some antibiotic action. It doesn't dissolve well in the tank... you have to get it into them via food. Feed 3 times a day for 5 days.

Hope all this helps,

Cathy
PS Fungus is a mold and it preys on damaged/dead tissues. It is fuzzy like a patch of white lawn. Those little white spotty things aren't fungus...they are probably some sort of bacteria and those types of little infections are quickly and easily thrown off by the fish's own immune system. Hence, change a bunch of your water...and get rid of the level of pathogens the fish is subjected to.

[ct-death]

Here is my Blue Ram (approx. 5-6 months old). I got him from the LFS for free b/c they were going to euthanize him. This was 2 months ago. I brought him home and treated for Ich...nothing, then fungus...nothing. I did both Salt (salt baths) and then Malachite green medication after that didn't work.

After keeping him in the 75G alone w/ my other one (was over a month), I decided to add more fish. As you can see (these pictures were taken 2 days ago), he still has these solid white clumps on his fins. They have neither grown nor reduced in size. I thought of Ich, Fungus and Collyflower, but I have no idea...?

All my other fish are completely disease free and I have never had a prob with any fish *knock on wood*:duh:

This fish is very active, and in fact he is the "King of the Tank" truth be know. He even bullies my 2 angels ... not for long though ! :Angel:


Anyways, I have no clue what this is, and when I got them from the LFS I feared the worse...now I have NO clue :huh:

P.S.
He's pooping BTW ;)

EDIT:
I test my water daily (becasue I'm afraid and over cautious):

Ammonia 0.0
Ites 0.0
Ates 0.5-10
50-60% WCs weekly (w/ heavy Vacs)
pH a constant 7.2
Temp 82-83