Newbie's First Post: Coludy Ammonia in Fishless Cycle??

[Mulla]

Hi all,

I've been lurking here for a few weeks now and finally wanted to ask this question.

It was a long story where a newbie decides to get a fish tank and was mislead by the LFS that I can buy heaps of fishes for a new tank. Of course later found out about cycling and all unfortunately it was all a bit too late. Not to mention I'll never go back to that store.

Now I think I've gathered enough information to start getting equipments to get started.

I only managed to find some "Cloudy Ammonia" down in the supermarket here. I'm an Australian btw. There's no other addictives in it but was wondering if I can use that in a fishless cycle? The word "Cloudy" got me worried. Or should I keep looking elsewhere?

Last time I've only got a UGF and have read here that it's not such a good filter to use. I wanted to get an external one. Hm... But I'm confused as to the sorts out there. Is there a link somewhere that I can read up a bit more on them? What is this "BioWheel" that I kept on reading about here?

Sorry I really don't know much of the "jargon" in fish keeping.



Thanks in advance

[ChilDawg]

As long as it's unadulterated ammonia, which it apparently is by the label, it will be fine for fishless cycling. (Actually, some adulterated ammonia is fine, but we'll leave that alone for now.)

[OrionGirl]

The cloudy ammonia is okay--it's usually the foaming bit that turns people off, but cloudy is okay. Perfumes are not! Doesn't need to be lemony fresh.

For filters--depending on what you want to keep, a UGF may be fine. They require a bit more complex maintenance, but they do a fabulous job of providing bacteria a place to latch on. They are not mechanical filters, so solid wastes will accumulate in the gravel and must be siphoned out. If you want fish that are known to dig--many cichlids, for example, then a UGF won't work well, since the fish will uncover sections of the plate so the water isn't forced through the gravel any longer. Reverse flow UGF is even better--the water is pulled down the risers and up through the gravel, meaning waste isn't pulled into the gravel. A HOB for mechanical filtration in conjunction with a RUGF is great. If you want lots of plants, UGF won't work great--the plants won't like that much movement around their roots, and they can clog the filter, making it less effective.

HOB filters tend to provide mechanical filtration that is easier to clean--you just pull out a sponge and rinse. Aquaclear is a good brand--pretty cheap, easy to maintain, but it doesn't come with the bio wheel. Bio wheels are a wheel, made with spokes of filter fabric. A pump pulls the water from the tank, and pushes it through a channel, causing the wheel to spin, exposing the spokes to the water and the air. This makes an ideal place for the bacteria that process ammonia and nitrites to live--they can pull the wastes from the water, and always have access to oxygen. They work well, but are not a requirement.

Welcome--hope we can help you out!

[Mulla]

Thank you for all your replys.

Haven't really decided what fish I'll be keeping yet since I've been reading that cycling can take up to a month+ to complete so I can leave that till later.

So a HOB filter is one of those external ones where you put two tubes into the tank and have a 'unit' sitting outside on the ground? (Sorry for being so non-technical) :rolleyes:

Right now I think I don't really want to use the UGF since it sounds difficult to clean out (according to various posts).

OrionGirl , So when are BioWheel necessary? When you've got a huge tank and lots of fish?

Aquaclear. Got it I'll go and see if I can find one this weekend maybe just checking out prices first. Now I've learned that fish keeping is about being patient :D


Thank you once again anymore suggestions are always welcomed.

[OrionGirl]

Actually, a HOB=Hang On Back filter. The one you've described is probably a canister filter. Both are grouped as power filters--they require a small pump to pull the water out of the tank (HOB's), or a pump to return the water to the tank (canisters). They both have a tube that hangs into the tank, below the water surface, but a canister will a return tube, where most HOB filters have a channel, like a waterfall, where the water returns to the tank.

Bio wheels are good choices for tanks with very little good media for bacteria--bare-bottom tanks, or tanks with lots of fish. Bacteria will colonize every surface they can, but places where there is not much water flow, or the surface area is limited, limit the bacteria colonies. A bio-wheel will make up for that, but so will a sponge filter. Bio wheels are not necessarily any better than a typical HOB filter; they are just the newest thing around. I like planted tanks, so prefer filters that don't create as much splash (surface agitation releases CO2 from the water, plants need CO2).

;) Patience is the best trait one can have for this hobby; it's almost better than having lots of floor space. Good thing I have the first - I've about ran out of the latter. :D

[Mulla]

Thank you again OrionGirl for your explaination.

Just one more question :o does it mean that a HOB has to be above the water level? So the channel can return the water back to the tank? What is your recommendation on HOB vs Canister filter? I suppose the canisters are more expensive since they have 2 pumps? Canister filter also use a sponge like a HOB? Hm... Maybe it's more than one question :)

Really appreciate your time and patience with me. Thank you once again.

Me = The computer geek trying to be a fishkeeper :(
Well at least fishkeeping is helping me built my patience levels!

[CHINABOY1021]

hey mulla, welcome

A unmodified Hang On Back filter does not have an adjusting leveler. nor is it needed.
i attached a picture of a HOB filter for a better understanding.

cept in the picture, the tank is very small therefore it looks weird. the filter size is about 15-20 cm across usually.

I would recommend HOB filters because they are the only ones ive used. i have no complaints about them, therefore no need to try something different. i myself feel that there's no need to spend hundreds of dollars on a canister filter. unless you have a tank over 50 gallons with little plants.

i suggest Aquaclear (brand) HOB filters. i would have no other choice unless a bio wheel is needed.

HTH
do i sound confusing?

[Mulla]

Thanks Chinaboy1021 for the picture now I know what a HOB filter looks like :D

I've just been to the LFS in my area and they only seemed to have the canister filters in stock. I looked everywhere but don't find any HOBs maybe asking would help. Hehehe...

They have this Fluval brand. I think the 201 will do for my tank it's only 100L. It's around US$90 (AUD$179). They also have Dolphin but it's more expensive. I've seen Fluval getting mentioned a few times here and the guy there seemd to think Fluva is good but not one of the best.

Well for me I don't really need or have the funds for the best one out there. Maybe I'll go back there next time and see if they have any HOBs althought I don't see them this often down here in Australia.

Thanks once again!

[Bergebo]

Originally posted by CHINABOY1021
cept in the picture, the tank is very small therefore it looks weird. the filter size is about 15-20 cm across usually.


Boy am I glad you wrote that. At first I thought it was a sneak preview of the new AC9000. :D