Gettin' Frustrated - help!!

[pseudoblond]

ok, so my water has been stable almost since the beginning. Nitrates 0 Ammonia 0 Ph 8.2 Salinity 1.025...tested last night to confirm.
So I bought a skunk cleaner shrimp and a brittle star. Drip acclimated for 2 hours, separately. The shrimp was dead within 12 hours. Star is doing absolutely great - he's been in there for a little over a week.
Took shrimp back with water sample - LFS tested and said water fine, must be shrimp. Got replacement shrimp last night. Guess what? Dead this morning.

What am I missing? I know it must be that I'm acclimating too fast, but I slow dripped for over 2 hours!!!

Everything else in tank is absolutely happy but the shrimp. I have 1 peppermint shrimp thats in there, and he's doing fine also. So whats up with the cleaner shrimp? Its 99.9% not a predator, or my other shrimp would be toast. HELP!!!!!:eek:

[DarthFred6996]

During the 2 hour drip the water may have gotten too cold for the shrimp. Did you drip while the bag was submerged in the display? I really don't have a clue. BTW I never acclimate for that long. I live so far from the LFS that I only acclimate about 30-45 minutes before releasing into the display. I have never had a death yet from stress and have only had one death otherwise and that was 2 months after acclimation and it was due to a fight and infection from the fight.

I personally think that people go WAAAAY overboard acclimating. I wonder if it kills the fish, etc. when they swim through a cold current in the ocean that is 5 degrees cooler than the surrounding water? Of course not. What about fish that spend their time hidden in the depths until feeding time such as shrimps, etc? It is cooler down deeper and they make a quick trip to the sunwarmed surface waters in a lot less than two hours. The ph is also different at different depths because of oxygen saturation etc.

Anyway, I will get flamed for my opinion so don't listen to me. I can't help it that I try to think logically about this. I also can't help it if my logic is faulty. But, hey, it has worked fine for me.

[pseudoblond]

Doubtful that temp has anything to do with it, because the constant drip keeps the temp fairly regulated...i tested this when I dripped my first fish (overly paranoid)...I drip 2 hours for shrimp because everything I've read on shrimp talks about how they are sensitive to sudden changes in everything, so I've taken pains to avoid sudden changes.
I know I'm missing something, come on experts!!!!
What would kill 2 shrimp but not another shrimp, snails, crabs or a brittle star? )

[Reefscape]

During the 2 hour drip the water may have gotten too cold for the shrimp. Did you drip while the bag was submerged in the display? I really don't have a clue. BTW I never acclimate for that long. I live so far from the LFS that I only acclimate about 30-45 minutes before releasing into the display. I have never had a death yet from stress and have only had one death otherwise and that was 2 months after acclimation and it was due to a fight and infection from the fight.

I personally think that people go WAAAAY overboard acclimating. I wonder if it kills the fish, etc. when they swim through a cold current in the ocean that is 5 degrees cooler than the surrounding water? Of course not. What about fish that spend their time hidden in the depths until feeding time such as shrimps, etc? It is cooler down deeper and they make a quick trip to the sunwarmed surface waters in a lot less than two hours. The ph is also different at different depths because of oxygen saturation etc.

Anyway, I will get flamed for my opinion so don't listen to me. I can't help it that I try to think logically about this. I also can't help it if my logic is faulty. But, hey, it has worked fine for me.

You will not get flamed here for offering your opinions.

Niko

[Reefscape]

personally, i would try getting shrimp from another source. Was the replacements from the same tank? or different? It could be the shrimp themselves that are not right, before you buy them, and the stress of the move from shop to your house, could be enough to push them over the edge, in a manner of speach...

Just a thought

Niko

[drobes]

I second the temperature shock as likely cause of death. Drip acclimating into an external bucket requires a separate heat source. Without one, the temperature WILL drop fairly quickly. Over the course of 2 hours of constant drip the temperature will end up lower than tank temperature.

Acclimating temperature is the most important step in introducing fish/inverts to a new system. Not to say that PH, dissolved oxygen and others aren't important, just not as much as temperature. Many LFS only temperature acclimate new arrivals in the interest of saving time, effort and money.

Next time float the bag in your tank for 2 hours. During this time periodically add and remove water from the bag with a turkey baster to acclimate the shrimp while maintaining temperature. Don't let any shipping water get in your tank.

[pseudoblond]

Shrimp were from 2 different locations of same store....

Also, again, its highly unlikely that temp plays a part in this. Room temperature in my house is 78 degrees right now - same as my tank. I float the bag to temp acclimate then drip - even unheated/cooled, water stays 78. If it was winter or something, I could see temp dropping. But my FW tank stays 78 and I have no heater in there, my sw tank isnt near any heat sources or a/c vents....I'll try floating and removing/adding water.

Any other theories? What else can I check for? Would they stress out that fast? Am I shrimp cursed???

[drobes]

Just because the room temperature in your house is the same as your tank temperature does not mean that water that was dripped into a bucket will stay at the same temperature. The chemical process of evaporation removes energy from the water when the hydrogen and oxygen molecules separate. Evaporation works wonders at cooling water. That's why people use tiny clip on or computer fans in the summer to help keep their whole tank cool.

[pseudoblond]

I'm gonna wait awhile to try this again, but when I do, I'll do the float/fill method. Hopefully that will be the solution! Thanks!

[millie3]

I have dying shrimp experiece, as well. They are skunk cleaner shrimp and i drip acclimate them by floating the bag and occasionally adding small amounts of tank water for several hours. Over time I remove some of the bag water and dipose of it until I am at 100% tank water in the bag. This is how I drip acclimate everything. So far, I have had good success except for the shrimp, and I've got a theory on that. It may sound crazy, but I am beginning to wonder if shrimp kill each other. Everytime I have 2 shrimp in my tank...even 2 cleaner shirmp, one dies. As long as I have only one, all is well...I suspect my original shrimp does not want any competition...Could this be?

[drobes]

Some shrimp can be territorial and kill off other shrimp. But this is more common with shrimp like coral banded than cleaners. Cleaner shrimp are one of the most docile and peaceful shrimp and are commonly kept with shrimp of the same species or different species with no problems (I have two that are fast buddies). I suppose you could have that anomoly agressive cleaner

[SHK_ATK]

if you are going to drip then do it and test for the SG,PH to be the same it it takes 30 min so be it they dont need to be in there for two hours, I would then put him BACK into the original bag and float him for 30 min then release him into display tank. Never lost a cleaner or any shrimp...or fish on that method. If you are going to do the water in bag I would float for 30 min then release as much of the water in the bag so he doesnt die from amo. poisioning and do a little bit of water every 15 min for an hour or so. if the bag gets full or filled just dump some of the water out and keep doing it. again no deaths using that method either. Best of luck.

[pseudoblond]

Ok, now my last shrimp is dead, peppermint shrimp, in tank for about 2 weeks. WTH...
sg 1.025
ph 8.2
amm 0
nitrite 0
nitrate 0

Everything else in tank looking active healthy and happy. I give up with the shrimps. I have no evidence of any predators in tank, shrimp body was untouched. All my water levels have been stable, and I tested for everything again this morning. I am completely at a loss here, especially since this shrimp has been living in the tank for awhile so the acclimation shouldn't have anythning to do here. I'm gonna take a water sample to LFS again and have them test it to the nines...
I stayed up late last night with a blacklight flashlight in the pitch dark, checking for midnight predators or anything! All I saw was my brittle star. I've done this periodically since my tank was setup, and I've never seen any rogue crabs or something - that doesnt mean nothing is in there, but what else can I do? No more shrimp for me for awhile, I am so frustrated and can't figure out whats the problem. Doubt its a hitchhiker pistol or something, I've never heard any noises. Short of dismantling my tank and dunking every piece of LR in low salinity water, what else can I do if anything?? I am so mad, I love the shrimpies!!!!!!!! :(

[Catpicklesdog]

Seeing as everything else tests Ok in your tank and there is no obvious reason for your shrimps dying, can you do me a favour and check for phosphates. My shrimps were the first to die when I had problems with Phosphates but I didn't know about them at the time and it was only when I started losing fish and getting slime algae that someone told me about Phosphates (hence why I'm so paranoid about them now!!).

Just a thought seeing as every other scenario has been covered!

[5xevy]

Seeing as everything else tests Ok in your tank and there is no obvious reason for your shrimps dying, can you do me a favour and check for phosphates.


I was going to suggest checking for phosphates as well. Do you have RO water/well/city? Have you had an official water test done? I just bought some more property and everything was fine until I got the (well) water test back. I had to install a giant UV for the entire house and do a chlorine chemical treatment :rolleyes:. Anyway, what's your water source?

[drobes]

Ask your LFS to check your phosphates. Good phosphate test kits are fairly expensive and there is no point in purchasing the basic phosphate kits. Even salfiert kits which are well regarded for other tests have a poor phosphate kit that is notoriously innacurate and can produce 0.00 readings on water that is later tested with a ROWA, Merk or other high end phosphate kit that identifies significant levels actually exist.

How long has your tank been up and running since you added LR? Could this be new tank syndrome? Also, if you ever introduced copper into your tank in the past this is another potential cause. Shrimp are highly sensitive to even trace copper levels.

[pseudoblond]

I do use ro/di water, never added copper and actually tested for that back when I set up tank....I'm going to LFS today, will check for phosphates.