Water Change long overdue?

[noskimmer]

Well, effectively my last water change was when I setup my new sump, this wasn't exactly a 'water change' per say, but more of just a dilution by adding additional capacity and volume.

I'm what people would refer to as a 'slacker', I hate testing my water, and I loath doing water changes, I actually hate doing any maintenance. But yesterday I (guilt ridden), decided to head down to the lfs and get 75 liters (20 USG) of NSW. Now it's been about 5 weeks since my last change or dilution which ever way you look at it, and this morning I'm looking into the tank and thinking how good everything looks. As the salt water is still sitting in drums in the driveway I start to think that maybe psychologically I'm looking for excuses not to carry it up and do the laborious water change. So I think, I'll just do a nitrate test and that will convince me, so I do my nitrate test, zero, hmm.

Yes I know, water change does more than reduce nitrate, it adds trace elements as well, but looking at my VERY, VERY, FAT Tangs, my coral polyps extending further than they have before, my torch coral with about half an inch of new skeletal growth, and a whole bunch of other things, I hesitate and ask myself "Is this really necessary?"

In all my years, I have never returned a zero nitrate reading, I find it surprising as I am a very heavy feeder, actually yesterday I even dumped a whole bunch of crap from the fish markets in there because I figured I was going to do a water change anyway. I guess I’m just miffed at the results.

I just thought I would share.


http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zero3.JPG


http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zero1.JPG


http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zero2.JPG



Oh, I forgot to mention… I don’t skim.

[Reefscape]

Its a truly superb looking system.

[Catpicklesdog]

Your tank looks stunning. I'll probably get shot for this - but if it aint broke don't fix it. Something is obviously working for you - and very well.

My LFS had a large display tank and he openly admitted to me (this is when he first set up his shop) that he hadn't done a water change on it for 12 months, his stock - corals and fish - looked fantastic. He's trying to persuade me that I will be able to leave my new tank that long without a water change but I'm not convinced!!!

[OldManOfTheSea]

I have to figure that most people are somewhat lazy for how many others here with FO tanks that began there tanks and were told to do either monthly or every two weeks water changes and that they feel tired or lazy and they figure that their tanks are OK and they can do the water change next week or so?

Its is however a nice looking reef tank considering the algae you have, for I hope that when the time comes that I begin my reef tanks that I do a whole lot better on that part. All others should do here is tell you in how you best to do things, for there be many who failed in a reef tank since my beginning years and like if any of you checking around, in RC there is a thread for a FO TOTM thread and it had lots of responses and not on staff over there up to the 5th page has made any comment on it. Because keeping a healthy reef tank is somewhat more work then keeping any FO system and in keeping any FO tank, there are many who are slacking, this im sure.

So no one should put you under the gun for your being lazy for the two things that suffer is your tank and you, so this couldn't been going on for all that long. And I think now that you will be getting out of your lazy mode and begin to clean things up, I hope before things begin to look far worst then it is now.

And you don't skim you say? Your best to begin doing so and siphon the algae out and use a toothbrush to help loosing the algae were its sticking good at. Just what size tank it is? And do you have a sump in place?

CPD, what I always tell others is that we all not have the same results for yes, there are any number of hobbyists who not do a monthly water change for like once I finally do begin my reef tanks, I will be keeping a record book on the tanks and make any changes that might be needed for I known of many who have a 180 gal reef tank, and they due to their problems are performing huge 40 gal water changes a month. And I know a large number of people that does a water change as little as 12 gals every sixth week.

It all falls back on how we maintain our own tanks for I said it that FO tanks with large algae problems are easier to clean up then in reef tank with many corals. I as well if any slight signs of algae in my reef tanks will begin to make what additional changes in order to correct them for as well in your lfs, they not tell you this, but they have a person going in these display tank to clean away any algae that might be there.

For look at the rest of their tanks, they get much algae as most anyone and people think that they can do the reef tank as they can and we know that they really are keeping a reef display and keeping it clean so that others would like to do one themselves and because many lfs make it look easy and all that people then think that it is easier then to keep a FO tank. Im not all as sure, for im speculating on this.

So yes, me too, I'm not convince on what your lfs told you on their reef display tank>

Buddy

[fsn77]

Sure, there's some nuissance algae, but if you really feed that heavily, aren't skimming, and regularly go that long between water changes, I'd say things are looking pretty darn good, all things considered.

I would like to know more information about your system before I make any further comments... essentially your tank specs (size, age, lighting, inhabitants, clean-up crew, etc.). Regardless, it would appear that your deep sand bed is really working for you at this point.

[5xevy]

Hey, beautiful tank. Whatever works for you. When I slack on my water changes my results aren't nearly as good as yours. What kind of clean-up crew do you have and how large is your tank? I agree with you regarding the skimmer. I think once your tank has been running for a while, it just sits with nothing to collect.



So yes, me too, I'm not convince on what your lfs told you on their reef display tank>

Buddy

I believe it.

Interesting this came up. I've been planning on making this the topic for this week's Poll of the Week. :D

[Riverserver]

Well it looks like you have a lot of sand and live rock. Highly established live rock and a sand bed may not require any filtration beyond a refugium.

[SHK_ATK]

kudos. I run my tank the same way, No skimmer (although I am waiting on buying one when I get the $$$$) I put in Fresh RO/DI water for top offs and do change at least 40G or so (prob more) a month its a big tank so Im not doing 50% or nothing too crazy, I think what really helps me is that I have a 55G sump 300+ lbs of LR and a HUGE clean up crew. I will admit that I did get diatoms last week (that where solved by a Gravel vac) and I did get some algae (i think brown) that was solved when I got a kole tang ( they will eat ANY ALGAE!!), Corals all look nice and healthy I dont really like the little film of organic waste but If I point the PH to break the surface of the water and agitate it it goes away. (like I said I will be getting a skimmer once I land on some $$$) Do what ever works for you, I tend not to like algae growing everywhere so far so good but I also would like to know how long youve been running your tank like this, It really is a nice tank.

[clown-lover]

Don't Tangs nip at LHA (long hair algae)? I've at least seen them do this in other tanks. And if it isn't getting out of bounds, or his clean up crew is staying on top of it for the most part, I say leave well enough alone.

It looks like his water parameters are great, but my guess about the 0 Nitrates is that he is feeding the algae that is present in his system.

But overall I agree, if it ain't broke.. Have you tested for your trace elements? Do you dose at all? I know the primary reason for water changes is to eliminate waste, but it is also to add back those elements from the fresh salt.

[lebloom]

How you get away without h2o changes? I try to keep a schedule of every week to change out 10 - 12 gal. in my 75 and mine doesnt look that good. I am not saying mine looks horrible or anything like it but mine need some new life. It seems my coraline isn't as bountiful like it use to be. My rock is coming down with a case of apstasia and I have tried the remedies but have been told that the paste made out of kalkwasser isn't really good to do. My tank is a good 6 yrs old, I'd say and it needs certain something if you know what I mean. :help:

[saltydunc]

nice tank mate....by not doing water changes you run the risk of ph crash though.

[Catpicklesdog]

So yes, me too, I'm not convince on what your lfs told you on their reef display tank>

Buddy

I have no reason to doubt my LFS as he is also a friend, not only that but his staff have all mentioned it as well.

Like so many things in this hobby it's all down to personal preference. I for one would not recommend going 12 months without doing a water change but different things work for different people.

[noskimmer]

Thanks all for the responses.

This particular tank has been running for about 4 years or so. It is a 4x2x2 and runs a remote sump http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105248

The main reason for the thread I guess, was my shear astonishment at the lack of nitrate, as it has always been quite a battle.

I don't skim, don't feed my corals, and am a firm believer that the skimming process is detrimental to the health of tanks, unless they are so big (the tank) that it does not have an impact. The water column if full of micro organisms, some you can see, some you can't. I used this argument in a previous thread.

We all know how much crap fills our skimmer cups.. Yes? Well if you think of this, if you were to collect all that crap over the course of a week or so, and were to put it back in your aquarium, that would be bad.. Yes?

But, all that crap that I haven't skimmed is still in there.. Yes?

So what is that crap? or what was that crap? and was it really crap to start with..?

Has another cycle happened? Because something must me removing the stuff.. or the stuff wasn’t ever really crap, but living stuff.

In regards to the PH crash, well we know that is highly unlikely but a good point.

Look, I don't have the greatest tank in the world. I quite like the algae, I also encourage it's growth and trim it when it gets obtrusive, some people may not regard the algae as their cup of tea, but each to his own. All I know is that I have an abundance of organisms, and they are just the ones I can see, they weren't so abundant when I was skimming. http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=113943

Some info on the tank. Additional to what has been mentioned. I run a reverse photo period, the main tank has 2x55watt Actinic (420nm) and 2x55watt 10k fluorescent what ever you call them, in addition 2x250watt Giesman 14k MH’s in an Arcardia pendant, the sump has 1x55watt Actinic, and 1x55watt 10k and 1x250watt MH 14k. Stock consists of LR http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111248 (unfortunately it doesn’t look like that anymore), 1 Blue Mandarin Goby (avatar), twinspot goby, pair of allardi’s, midnight Pygmy Angle, Maroon CF, 3 Green Damsels, 3 Tangs, Comet Marine Betta, Blastomussa Wellsi, torch coral, and a bunch of other stuff. I have feather dusters just popping up every where, the zoanthids are just nuts, the sand is riddled with tubes of things, worms, and other stuff. I can’t even begin to guess the amount of brittle stars. Here are some other threads to give you an idea http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105938 http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107644

Oh, and if you think that I’m pretter weird so far….
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108887

[Riverserver]

I quite like the algae, I also encourage it's growth and trim it when it gets obtrusive, some people may not regard the algae as their cup of tea, but each to his own.

I've got algae growth about the same as yours. It's all over my intake and spray bar, along the corners of my tank, and at the sand line. When the fish were taken out because of ich, I noticed tons and tons and tons and tons of pods everywhere. It really got the point to where I could add a cubic inch of shrimp meat and watch it disappear over 24 hours. But now that the chromis are back in, pods are almost all gone, and my chromis are fat and happy :)

[noskimmer]

By popular demand... updated pic's

Still haven't finished... but it seems to be running it's self

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//sumplight.JPG

Some infamous red algae... in the dark spots


http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//sumpredalgae.JPG

Some sump Rock

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//sumprock.JPG

RO and topoff.. very rudimentary.

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//sumpro.JPG

Return is via a 1262 @ about 900 US Gallons\hour, but probably loose 150 - 200 due to head, and bends etc, however the water movement in the sump is quite slow, so I use two power heads to help circulation in the fuge. Remember the total sump dimensions are 3.28x1.97x1.64 feet so the pic's are a little deceptive as to it's size

[Riverserver]

Looks like it came together nicely :D

[Reefscape]

still a very impressive beast of a sump mate...some serious green hair algae going on in there...do you have any critters in there to graze on it at all?

Niko

[SHK_ATK]

cant really tell in that pic but it looks like your sand bed is almost a foot deep!!


also how are those lil rings things (2nd pic bottom right) working out for you? alot of memebers say to not use them ect ect I have some that came w/ my AC 70 but havent added them in, any advise?

[noskimmer]

The noodles are extremely porous and slowly dissolve, I use them permanently to slow and distribute flow, there is nothing different to that or rock rubble, except maybe these would have more surface area, and they dissolve, providing calcium, and providing a buffer. I could see them becoming a problem in a sterile tank, as they would collect detritus, and there would not be any greablies to clean them.

Niko, I bought a sea urchin last week, a short spike one so not to be too destructive and he is wiping out the hair algae in the main display tank, but not the sump… other than that I don’t really know what to add, so suggestions are welcome. I do know my Tangs don’t touch it, well when I’m watching anyway.

There is some coral growing in there as well, soft and hard, and some really nice structured algae, but I will wait to see if it develops more.

The sand bed is 6.5" - 10"inch, but I am not sure if the depth is actually beneficial more than a couple of inches.. certainly the top few inches, even at this short stage has high uptake of worms etc.

I chuck vongola in there (baby clams) that I buy for dinner at the fish market, they are alive and just burrow in the sand and stick out their little breather\feeder tubes, some die, and some live. I never take out the dead one’s and when I find they are dead, it is just an empty clean shell..

[SHK_ATK]

suggestions for algae controll have you tried a kole tang? I had one, and ate every lil algae that was growing in my tank, I was really amazed. You can give that a shot. Im sure you will be surprised at the rate he works.

[noskimmer]

I think I'm going to try the kole tang like suggested, thanks SHK_ATK, and move the urchin to the sump, yup I read a thread you posted Niko with your opinion of them.

Cheers,

[Reefscape]

yup I read a thread you posted Niko with your opinion of them.

Cheers,

He he he he he....i shall say no more then on that.....lol....

With regards to the hair algae in the sump, if its bryopsis, tangs and the such wont touch it...i learn that one pretty quickly indeed...Have been informed by many that seahare's are a good way to control this, however, for me they are very touch and go and getting the species to achieve this would be a harder task still as they are commonly sold under the wrong name....

Niko

[Subliminal]

Ok, several things:

If your hair is bryopsis, some people have been having a really good experience by raising their magnesium up to ~1600 with Kent Tech M. Apparently it reacts with something in the plant and inhibits photosynthesis or somesuch. I can grab a link to a few threads on that, if you'd like.

If you really want to get rid of the hair, your best bet probably isn't critters, it's actually water changes. Ha. Your params, like stated before, can be around 0 because the hair is just eating all the stuff in the water.

I've got hair in my tank, too, and i'm just trying to keep my water clean and (recently) switched to ro/di, which i wasn't using before.

Anyway, my two bits....

Tank looks awesome, though. I do like the lawn, as long as it stays short.

:)

[1wizz]

I've got high nitrates and no algae, think i need some of your bryopsis.
The key to it all must be a happy medium. If you did water changes the algae would be starved of nutrients and probably cause you other probs when dying off so your way works for you.
If your sand bed works now what problems can you see in the future? (Timebomb)

[noskimmer]

Oh well.. I was just about to take a pic of the tank, but the mh's just went out... still no water change.

[noskimmer]

Still going without the water change... the sump is something else, there are literally hundreds for snails that have appeared from now where, ranging in size from .5mm - 3mm, lots of what appear to be tiny bristle worms, about 10mm in length, and masses of amphipods and copopods which are enormous, and don't hide when the lights are on anymore. The sand bed in now riddled with creatures, but only the first few inches.

A couple of pic's of the tank

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//front1.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//side.JPG

[Riverserver]

Wow still looking pretty good man.

Are you adding anything to the tank like trace elements?

[noskimmer]

No additives. I don't feed the corals, however when I can I chuck stuff in from the fish markets like live pippies, vongola, sea urchin roe. The sea urchin roe especially clouds the water, so do the pippies and vongola when they succumb to the harassment of the fish. Nitrates are still zero.

[tanhql]

why don't you just test the water? then you can determine how well your tank actually is without water changes.

[Reefscape]

NS....as always, a stunning looking system still.....would love to see an update pic of the sump please...

Niko

[noskimmer]

Just took the shot... put it on the sump thread.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1045506#post1045506

[Reefscape]

Thanks alot for posting the update NS..its looking great..

Niko

[Subliminal]

dang..that's some sandbed in that sump!

[SHK_ATK]

that the same thing I said SUB. Really is a nice tank Kudos again:headbang2:

[clown-lover]

Man I love that Yellow Tang.. Mine pretty much stays behind the LR unless its feeding time.. He is such a scaredy cat!! I wish mine was more social.

[sharkmatt]

Nice tank and sump. I personally do regular water changes and have a skimmer but I'm a relative newby to SW so I'm not chancing anything lol. Where does your Magnesium and to a lesser extent Calcium (I know this will be provided by the sand) come from if you don't do water changes?

[noskimmer]

Ok,

it's now 105 days..... if there were any signs of distress I would not hesitate to do a change... Not one loss, no illness, masses of procreation, feather dusters, snails worms, strange eggs, funny things at night under the light, don't feed the corals, had to move one because of a migrating anemone, but thats about it.

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//howmanydays.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//howmanydays2.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//howmanydays3.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//howmanydays4.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//howmanydays5.JPG

[noskimmer]

Oops I was wrong.... I put in my new sump on the 25th of May, I counted 105 days from this post which was 1st of July, so in fact it's another 55 days since that, so my last water change was about 160 days...... no nitrate, no skimmer... no additives... I actually don't do much at all... hmmm.

[Subliminal]

That's great!

I do my water changes every week...too scared not to. ;)

[Catpicklesdog]

Still looking good:D

[Grins]

That's great!

I do my water changes every week...too scared not to. ;)

Me too. Too risky for me not to when it isn't that difficult to do.

[noskimmer]

Still looking good:D

Catpicklesdog,

You have a very nice Reef Log\Diary there... Do you still not skim? How often do you do water changes?

[saltydunc]

i love your tank man......great fish awesome corals and all without a skimmer and water changes.....good job mate..:)

[Catpicklesdog]

Catpicklesdog,

You have a very nice Reef Log\Diary there... Do you still not skim? How often do you do water changes?

Since setting up the new tank I do skim. Since seeing all the gunk that comes out of it I'd be scared not to, but knowing that I went for so long without skimming ....................... you see my dilemma.

I do a 10% water change once a fortnight at the moment but I'm still getting to grips with having a sump etc.

Don't worry I'm watching your thread closely!!!

[vorlx]

Tank looks good, I love the sump. I am rather new to the SW hobby so I currently skim and do water changes usually monthly. So far I have had good results with this.

[gomrjoe]

In my old 46 bow years ago (FOWLR) I never did water changes, I had a chessy Seaclone skimmer, and no wet/dry or sump of any kind, and it worked. I had a DSB and lined the last 1 1/2 " at the bottom with screening so it wouldn't be disturbed by gobbies. I think they called it the Berlin method, don't know if that is still popular or not.

Now in my 100 reef tank I do a 20% WC every two weeks, I have a real skimmer, and a sump... and everything is great. So, like CPD, go figure, both work. I do remember in my old 46 it was very sensative to adding new fish, I could only or two fish at a time.

[noskimmer]

193 days... Zero Nitrate.

I don't protect my sand from the Gobies, they love it, and I am also probably really bad with feeding, where as I chuck lots of uneaten sea urchin roe, scollop's, oysters, fish bones etc in there.

Also, I have had no fish or coral loss's and no additions either, just been to busy with work.

[noskimmer]

Day 216... I have also updated my sump thread (http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105248), no casualties, however due to an anemone deciding to move, one of my softies (the middle one) got a bit stung and is in recovery mode.

All I wanted to do for this update is just add a couple of pictures which I took yesterday.

Please be warned, this is no skimming, no water change, it ain't pretty and may offend some viewers.

GAP... for those who wish not to proceed... DO NOT SCROLL DOWN



















The offending anemone...... quite clearly suffering now.....NOT!

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zanenome.JPG

I turned of the Tunze in the tank and these guys got startled, enough for me to actually photo.

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zdamsel.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zdamsel2.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//ztank.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//ztank2.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//zzsidetank.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//ztank3.JPG


Because of the outbreak in snails, I have noticed that the inside of the overflow, as well as the back glass of which I cannot clean, and never have or never felt the need to are really clean. I just ran a magnetic cleaner across the front and left panel quickly for these photo's, not a real good job, but just enough (no razor scraping here).

The other tank is still outside, I want to get it in eventually and will have to as we intent to renovate and this tank will need to move.. the contents of which will migrate to the other tank.

Work have been considerably overwhelming, being responsible for offices in Chicago, Sydney and Kyiv, I haven't had much time to spend on the tank but will do so more now as I have moved on and intend to take a more balanced role. Hopefully I will be able to have the time and do some of the things I have really wanted to do.

[Subliminal]

I'm reporting you the the SPCA for cruelty to animals. ;)

[Grins]

What is on the sand in the center? It looks a bit like a red donut from the side.

[chris331]

that's an awesome tank!!

[Catpicklesdog]

Yep, definately the most uncared for tank I've seen.............................................. .......


NOT!!!!

It just goes to show how differently we can all run our tanks and still end up with our own little parts of the ocean. I've been considering getting a little HOB skimmer for my new "Love Shack" but on re-reading your thread have decided not to. I just needed reminding that I managed without a sump or skimmer for 3 years!!!

[noskimmer]

Thanks guys.

Grins, the donut is a sea squirt of some type, very hardy have had him almost since day one, was the inspiration for coming up with a design not to overflow the display. He managed to get into the overflow, up the tube, and then down getting wedged where the bulk head is. He was too far down to get from the top, so had to undo the bulkhead from the bottom. Had a friend staying over that weekend and she is like really tiny, I still can't get the image out of my head with her gripping onto it with both hands under the tank while my wife and I tried to pull her and the squirt out as it was really, really wedged tight.

[Grins]

lol, you should have grabbed the camera.

[noskimmer]

Well you probably guessed it, no water change in 269 days. Lost twinspot, I think a new tunze got him. I have added 3 of those little ones which you can hide at the back. They are great because you just magnet them to the glass and drag them down. I would prefer have a bunch of those hidden than a large one. Added a heap of aragonite, amazing how quickly it gets populated. Here are some photo's.

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//00t.jpg

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//00t4.jpg

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//00t3.jpg

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//00t2.jpg

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//002.jpg

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//001.jpg

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//00.jpg

[Catpicklesdog]

It's looking fantastic!!!! I wouldn't mind but your water looks so much clearer than mine and I do weekly maintainence and have a skimmer.

Just goes to show..................

You're obviously doing something right!!!

[clown-lover]

Still looking awesome noskimmer... Am I seeing three tangs in your tank?? Very nice..

[salty420]

hard to believe it's been so long since you've done a WC and the tank looks so good! it's a cool experiment i guess but i just want to grab you and shake you and tell you "do a water change!!!" lol

[Grins]

I'm too chicken to try it but it appears it can be done.

[nycsicktank]

noskimmer give up the good work and update alotttttt~~~~~ i mean alot!!!!

[sharkmatt]

I think the sump is probably the main reason behind this success. I wouldn't even consider trying it wothout a sump. Kudos to you though Noskimmer for being brave enough to give it a go. Tank's lookin amazing!!

[SHK_ATK]

Sill going strong!! HAHA I LOVE IT

[Reefscape]

As always NS, continually impressed with the system, its beautifull....

Blah....who is it who keeps saying we need bloody skimmers????? Stand up and be counted.....LOL......

[kryptic4l]

the ocean does not skim, nor does it do water changes, it is a balanced system that takes care of everything in the life cycle

[Grins]

The ocean does skim. That is what the frothy stuff is on the shoreline.

[clown-lover]

We could always post that infamous picture of the people frolicking in the fish poo...

[Fishieness]

the ocean does not skim, nor does it do water changes, it is a balanced system that takes care of everything in the life cycle

of course the ocean does water changes... There are currents that continuously replace water in reefs. It is transfered to areas less populated with life or to places where there are many, many, many animals who feed on these nutrients...
Also, you honestly cannot even compare the ocean to ANY fish tank partialy for this reason... And then when you think about fish to area ratios in our tanks, it really doesnt mean a thing seeing how our tanks are 20 inches deep while the ocean in the parts we talka bout are 15+...

[noskimmer]

Still looking awesome noskimmer... Am I seeing three tangs in your tank?? Very nice..

Thanks all for the remarks.

Yes three tangs, Mark the yellow tang was my first fish in this setup, Bruno, the Purple Tang (I think he's a fake) arrived shortly after with a Sohal, unfortunately the Sohal was taken by an aggressive carpet anemone which decided that the tank was there just for him.... (he went to good home) The Clarkii's unfortunately seemed to get lesions on them which is why I got a smaller anemone to replace it.. they never stay small for long.. will probably be another give away.. Betty the lipstick was a rescue buy, she looked awful at the lfs and as I usually do, I said "well that doesn't look like it's going to make it.. I'll take it off you for (little)$$$'s" She looks good now.

Mark (Yellow Tang) at the very beginning
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//__c.JPG

Mark and Gordon at the beginning

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//__a.JPG

Betty (the Lipstick) getting "fattened up" next to a fat Bruno (purple tang)

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//__b.JPG

[clown-lover]

All look fantastic.. You really have done some wonders with your tank. Definately something to be proud of NoSkimmer.. I love your thread..

[blasterman_]

the ocean does not skim, nor does it do water changes, it is a balanced system that takes care of everything in the life cycle


Free nitrate is also rare in the open ocean while it builds to toxic levels in captive tanks. Poor comparison.

I'm looking at the pictures here, and I think I see fairly deep sand bed. Lowest maintenance tanks I've ever had have always had generous sand beds, and we know those are great nitrate reducers. However, I'd still get a skimmer if the tank is heavily stocked. I'd rather have a skimmer and not be aware of it than have organics build up and complicate a sudden crash.

[noskimmer]

All, in regards to skimming, I just think it removes a substantial amount of beneficial organisms from the water column, and as I have said before, I would never recommend to anyone not to skim. I have also made the point of saying if you collect the amount of skimmate that has accumulated in your skimmer cups for a week and put it back into your tanks that this would probably be really bad, and I am sure if I skimmed I would get a vast amount of skimmate. My argument is the fact that I don't skim, means that the so called "skimmate" is still in the tank, so I question what actually makes up our skimmate? sure an amount is crap, which if left in there turns to nitrate, but this in turn brings on a new population of organisms which removes it, which of course would not be present if I skimmed. All I know is that even though my water may look crystal clear, at night it is teaming with organisms and they are just the ones I can see with my naked eye when I shine a light. I am talking about clouds of things so small you can barley make out what they are, some are quite obvoiusly tiny crustations of sorts which are water born, maybe plankton. In turn these keep my sand bed clean, remove pollutants and feed my corals, procreate, I have hundreds of feather dusters in my sump, snails, and other things I could not even begin to guess what they are, and they have arrived from nothing, corals appearing, spawning, I can chuck large amounts of waste food like fish bones left over sushi, oysters, abalone (the bottom close up picture of Mark he is picking on a whole abalone, that was yesterday, now, this morning only the shell remains).

So in summary, in my tank I don't skim, but that may only be possible for similar setups. The argument is not whether to have or not to have, it is whether it is appropriate for your type of system.

This is just my account of my setup, there are a thousand success stories of other tanks with skimmers, water changes etc...

[Grins]

We could always post that infamous picture of the people frolicking in the fish poo...


Ack, were those not the nastiest things?

[noskimmer]

This isn't the best video, in fact this was a while ago now, it is a lot more diverse now, If you have difficulty seeing it (it should be about 1:30sec), you may need to save it to your pc before viewing. When I used to skim these guys didn't exist

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//movie.mpg

[kcress]

noskimmer; I commend your attitude! Over at RK there are so many heavies that just land on you, especially the no-refuge, no-sand, guys. It's sad. So your take on this great hobby is nice.
Thanks.

I see the same thing in my tank at night. It is a wild par Tee in there with things corkscrewing thru the water, worms swimming all over. Most incredible.

No skimmer.

[Riverserver]

Wow man glad to see your tank is still doing so well!

[mcsassy]

How many gallons is your tank? Mine is 72 This makes me quite relieved being that my tank is a month and a half old and i have it stocked with 20+ organisms and immaculate water conditions without having done a single water change yet...i thought i have been really lucky with the things i have been doing to take care of it but i guess i am doing the right things and i am very glad to hear your story! We rule! I probably owe it to my nitrate sponge and cleaning crew though...and i do monitor and take care of every little problem as well but still...yay.

[noskimmer]

Here goes, hope the sums are ok. Display is 4x2x2 which makes it same as yours 72, sump (this is in mm) 500x600x1000 which is about 44Gallons, total being 116. But you need to drop the level in the sump (and each stage in the sump is a different level) and tank, about 120kg (264lbs) of live rock (very porous and it's weighed when its wet, so a large proportion of weight is actually water anyway) who knows how much aragonite.. about 60kg (132lbs) in sump (at least) and 20 (44lbs)in display.. don't know how to calc the displacement of this would have on the water volume, then you got the coral.. and this is just all really rough estimates. If you look at the amount of aragonite which has dissolved from when I topped it up in the pictures above, it's quite a bit, so you would really never know.

Of course volume is a major factor ppm is smaller in larger volumes so to say, a better way to say it is if a fish died and went unnoticed in a 10Gallon tank the same amount of toxin would be released if it dies in a 400gallon tank, but as ppm is proportionate to volume, a larger volume is more stable, not to also mention that salinity, ph, temp, and everything else takes a lot longer to change in large volumes, that's why I think that people who can keep nano's successfully are a lot more skilled than the guys with the big tanks.

Also, remember your tank is early days also and yes a big yay for the parameters being very good with no WC, and I wish you the best of luck.

[mcsassy]

Ya it is in the very early days and I am also in the middle of medicating the tank for an ich breakout so i had to take out ALL my filter media...i am still upkeeping perfect water parameters in the meantime...i feel quite accomplished...knock on wood!

[Angel 0249]

What an amazing thread.
Hats off to you noskimmer.:thumbsup:

[JohnLin]

water change to remove nitrate in an established reef tank -- over-rated!

water change to replenish trace elements and dilute the hormones that fish produce to detect the physical volume body of water surrounding them -- under-rated!

[fsn77]

Here goes, hope the sums are ok. Display is 4x2x2 which makes it same as yours 72, sump (this is in mm) 500x600x1000 which is about 44Gallons, total being 116.

Actually, 4' x 2' x 2' = 120g, not 72g. That's a pretty big difference. Give your tank the credit it deserves -- don't short it those 48g! You don't want to hurt it's ego... :)

[nycsicktank]

what are your stocklist-cant seem to find it in your post

[Fishieness]

Betty (the Lipstick) getting "fattened up" next to a fat Bruno (purple tang)


it's a scopas tang, not a purple

[mr pink floyd]

WOW DUDE! thats sooo nice!
where did you get all the brown? I need to get some.
Im sick of all the greens, purples, reds, blues and oranges in my system, im getting ready to give up! Im thinking its time to sell my skimmer and stop doing water changes every 2 weeks!

Also, howd you get yellow water? did you just add food coloring to it? it looks SOOOO COOL!

PLEASE HELP OUT A NEWB!!!!!

heres a pic, can you help me out?

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k312/mikey31491/ctars%20totm%20feb%202008/P1070062.jpg
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k312/mikey31491/ctars%20totm%20feb%202008/P1070073.jpg
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k312/mikey31491/P1080086-1.jpg


THANKS! LOL!

[noskimmer]

Actually, 4' x 2' x 2' = 120g, not 72g. That's a pretty big difference. Give your tank the credit it deserves -- don't short it those 48g! You don't want to hurt it's ego... :)
Doh! Can't do my math!

it's a scopas tang, not a purple
Can't even ID my own fish! Always thought there wasn't something right about him.... or.. hang on, that's right, never thought there was something right about me... I'm confused...

what are your stocklist-cant seem to find it in your post
Gee's do you think if I gave you a stock list that you could trust it? Like the way I'm going I'll probably say I had a shark in there as well....Hmm I did at one stage start one (a list).. let me dig around..

WOW DUDE! thats sooo nice!
where did you get all the brown? I need to get some.
Im sick of all the greens, purples, reds, blues and oranges in my system, im getting ready to give up! Im thinking its time to sell my skimmer and stop doing water changes every 2 weeks!

Also, howd you get yellow water? did you just add food coloring to it?
Whoa, had to run over that a couple of times, some interesting descriptions you used. Did you ever see that movie "Meet the parents"? well I have two cats... Just kidding. Are you referring to the lights? If so, I am running Metal Halides which may account for your colour description. As for the brown, you mean the corals I suspect, I don't know all the scientific names for them, and hey if I did it would probably be wrong, but I never really thought of it as having a lot of brown. Your tank incidentally looks great, a lot of blue, which I suspect is from actinics or 20k bulbs of some type. You also have some very nice greens, purples, reds.. etc, I wouldn't be complaining it seems very healthy. Rock formations seem really good and I wouldn't see that as a newb tank.

Now that stock list.... I will find it, update it (scopas tang, scopas tang, scopas tang...) and post it up..

[Subliminal]

Noskimmer, I think you need to turn up your sarcasm alert down there in Sydney. I'm thinking this fellow signed up here simply to bash you and your methods.

Which isn't very nice, really.

[clown-lover]

Um yeah when I read it I'm seeing him trying to slam NS on his tank.. Rather rude actually.

[Reefscape]

WOW DUDE! thats sooo nice!
where did you get all the brown? I need to get some.
Im sick of all the greens, purples, reds, blues and oranges in my system, im getting ready to give up! Im thinking its time to sell my skimmer and stop doing water changes every 2 weeks!

Also, howd you get yellow water? did you just add food coloring to it? it looks SOOOO COOL!

PLEASE HELP OUT A NEWB!!!!!

heres a pic, can you help me out?


THANKS! LOL!


Can we please keep sarcastic and rude comments out of the thread please and have some respect for fellow aquarists..

Thanks and have a good day..

Niko :)

[Riverserver]

heres a pic, can you help me out?
THANKS! LOL!

He's an Aussie, I'd think I try and be nicer ;)

[mr pink floyd]

sorry guys! i wasnt trying to be rude at all LOL!

im simply trying to make my tank look like his!!!!!

anybody want to buy a remora skimmer? i cant believe i bought it! its stealing food from my corals LOL!


i dont appreciate you guys getting angry about me looking for help!!!!!
:help::help::help::) :headbang2::headbang2::headbang2::headbang2::headb ang2::headbang2::headbang2::headbang2:

[vorlx]

:banher:

[Subliminal]

Well, for starters get rid of some of that digita. I see you have all the colors, but that stuff, well, it's about as tough to grow as star polyps.

I don't skim either, and quite frankly I think my tank has more colors than yours.

I also notice from your pics you have a few tiny fish. It's a whole different ballgame once your bioload goes up a bit.

You have a nice looking tank, Mr Floyd, but it isn't the nicest on the forum by a long shot. The only difference is you think you're the stuff and you can't see the beauty in a tank that's probably been set up longer than you've been alive and requires less maint. in a year than you probably spend on yours in a week.

But it was nice of you to stop by. Please feel free to actually try and add to a discussion, rather than detracting from one.

Or, even better, just start your own post and leave this one alone.

[WoodRight]

Hello NS, I'm very new to the SW world and I'm in the middle of setting up my first (not only tank but SW) tank. I think I'm going to skim at least at first but maybe stop when it gets a bit older. I think that your setup is unbaleaveable and love this thread. I hope you keep the updates comin. Oh and please check out my Blog and let me know if there is anything that you would change befor I fill it up and get it running. I still have a few weeks of work to do on it befor then so if you or anyone else wnats to please do. again great thread.

[SHK_ATK]

Niko better start spraying that troll spray.

[Reefscape]

sorry guys! i wasnt trying to be rude at all LOL!

im simply trying to make my tank look like his!!!!!

anybody want to buy a remora skimmer? i cant believe i bought it! its stealing food from my corals LOL!


i dont appreciate you guys getting angry about me looking for help!!!!!
:help::help::help::) :headbang2::headbang2::headbang2::headbang2::headb ang2::headbang2::headbang2::headbang2:

By all means, if you require help with your tank, or have questions about it, then please start a new thread. You asked no questions, nor any cry's for help, hence why people took it as sarcasm.

Thanks


Niko better start spraying that troll spray.

Its ready :grinyes:

Niko ;)

[mr pink floyd]

subliminal.. digita?

i thought it was digitada?
oh well im just a n00b LOLz

and a few tiny fish? i have a false perc thats over 3"
, a 6line wrasse over 3.5" and 2 green chromis each about 2.5"

i feed heavily with mysis, cyclopeeze and krill daily, id say my bioload is pretty high. my weekly maintenence includes feeding, and watching, tossing in some RO now and then, and watching, and sitting, and watching. IT SCKS!!!

[sharkmatt]

subliminal.. digita?

i thought it was digitada?
oh well im just a n00b LOLz


It's actually digitata, so I guess you are still somewhat of a newbie :headshake2:. The thing is you were actually trying to show off which makes it all the more sad! Do yourself a favour and get a life that doesn't involve belittling other peoples achievements. It disturbs me that there are people like you in the world.

[clown-lover]

Matt...
:thm::clap::werd:

[mr pink floyd]

**** right im showing off!

i dont think its good to be posting about how not doing waterchanges is good. you can get by with no skimmer, but not doing both is such a bad idea!

i do a water change every 2-3 weeks, only 5 gallons, and my tank is fine. if youre too lazy to practice good husbandry, you shouldnt be in this hobby. From the looks of your tank, im guessing youre a pretty messy person. Bad husbandry is the downfall of this hobby, it disturbs ME that there are people who encourage poor husbandry, and people who have such ignorance to the needs of these animals.

its like using the bathroom, but never flushing the toilet for a year. try that on for size.

for the actual new people to the hobby...


WATER CHANGES ARE NECESSARY, THIS GUY HAS NO IDEA WHAT HES TALKING ABOUT.


please send me a sample of your water, or post a video testing it. i would bet my life savings all your nitrates are off the charts! Your alkalinity and calcium are probably completely outside and accepted HEALTHY level, and i almost guarantee phosphates. the brown coral is a sign of it. Phosphates should be undetectable on any test kit, and less than .03 using a Hanna photometer(if anyone here has a clue what that is) There is no other reason for everything to be brown, besides lack of care. Youre browning out soft corals and LPS corals... you have to TRY to do that.

get a phosban reactor, some salt mix, a bunch of RO, and stop letting your fish live with toxicity.

Sincerely,

Mike




PS: This is what the alphabet woudl look liek if Q and R were eliminated!!!

[mr pink floyd]

If you claim to have a healthy system, you should actually have a healthy system to back it up! please do some reading:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-02/dw/index.php

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-07/mvd/index.php

Reference www.reercentral.com for very knowledgeable people, who can help you get your tank healthy(unless you dont want a healthy tank)

and look here:http://reefkeeping.com/issues/past.php

look at every single tank of the month.... what are the things they all have in common?

water changes...skimmers...color....GOOD HUSBANDRY=HEALTHY TANKS!!!!!

[sharkmatt]

Finally you've offered some sensible and worthwhile advice. Nobody on here has any problem with people offering their point of view, thats what we're all here for. That point of view, however, needs to be put across in a sensible and polite manner. The problem people had with your earlier posts is that you were making fun of someones hard work without offering any intelligent reasoning to the contrary. I appreciate your opinion now you've made it properly, and I would tend to agree with a lot of what you've said. I think it is dangerous for a newbie to try this method and I've already made a comment about it being impossible without a sump. Other people have also questioned certain aspects of this method. However I think that there is nothing wrong with what noskimmer is attempting so long as the fish etc are in good health. The pictures I've seen show a healthy tank. After all, if people never went against the grain and tried something different, we would be without a vast majority of todays technology and knowledge. I'm sure the first aquarist's who suggested doing regular water changes were laughed out of the room.

Shark.

[Reefscape]

Ok...Opinions have been clearly stated. Lets not bring this thread into one that is rude is disrespectfull to the thread OP as there is absolutly zero need for it.

We all have our own ways of running our systems, however that does not mean that if we disagree with how someone else is running theirs, we have to be rude, show-off, leave disrespectfull comments.

Thanks

Niko

[snailrider]

Does this mean that this thread is finished? Can I speak up?

[kcress]

No. Whatcha got?

[Riverserver]

Just curious, what are your calcium and alkalinity levels?

[noskimmer]

Just ran the tests, the MH's have not come on in the display as yet and the MH's on the sump have been off for several hours, since about 7:30am (it is now 11am local time) So I will be curious to test the ph again. I also have some NSW (the stuff that I bought at the beginning of this thread) which I can use as a control test if you like.

Here goes.
Nitrate 0
PH around 7.8 - 8.0
Calcium 450

[noskimmer]

Aragonite composition is estimated to be around 97% calcium carbonate, < 1.5% magnesium carbonate, with traces of aluminium oxide (<0.15%), sodium chloride (<0.125%) and Strontium oxide (<0.125%). Strontium, an element similar in chemistry to calcium, is essential for the growth of coralline algae and coral skeletons. Magnesium, also taken up by corals and algae, is adequately replaced by gradual solubilisation of aragonite sand, so supplements are not required.
If you note from some of the pictures you will see a large amount of aragonite gradually disappearing prior to me adding additional aragonite. If you look closely at the sump design you will also notice that I intentionally add aragonite to the partitions which water has to move through, in effect blocking the flow of water until the previous partition raises enough to create enough water pressure as to force its way through the aragonite, acting partially as a filter and also increasing the rate at which it dissolves. This is done at two sections, the first and the one immediately after the refugem part. The fact that the water must travel up (and slowly due to the last one having a wider hence slower flow) it is prevented by gravity and low flow from the sand reaching the area where the heaters are located and hence the return pump.
It is also noted that pH is normally slightly depressed to 7.8-8.0 at night which is considered well within normal tolerances, since the above samples are effectively “night samples” it seems that the pH ok.

[Grins]

Not sure I'm reading that right but wouldn't that potentially cause a flood?

[noskimmer]

Not sure I'm reading that right but wouldn't that potentially cause a flood?
Grins, Yes you are right! However check for the drilled safety holes which prevent this. All part of the initial design, as with the raised return etc. It may not make sense when you first look at it without understanding the principles that I have adopted, but it begins to pan out. The whole rational was to make it safe, even with higher flow as this sump is for two tanks, but the other tanks is still outside waiting for the front door (of the house) to be replaced.

[Grins]

Ah OK. I figured I was missing something because you've been running this way for so long.

[clown-lover]

I would love to sit with you in a coffee shop for like a week and pick your brain of the last 20 years of knowledge.. :D

[kcress]

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//sumplight.JPG

So looking at this shot you are only forcing the water thru that one little partition's sand on the right and a little on the left one too?

You aren't forcing any water thru that deep sand bed. Correct?

[noskimmer]

Correct!
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//00s3.jpg

It is clearer on this picture, however you cannot see the section on the far right.

[nycsicktank]

noskimmer
did you ever get cyanobacteria? im having a huge battle with them. how much flow do you have in your sump? doesnt seem like you got a ph in there.

[noskimmer]

I have two ph's in the sump, but I have recently turned them off and a little cyano has appeared, but in saying that I did have a major problem in my display as well, I just changed the lights and that got rid of it. So I think it may be a combination of old lights (longer wavelengths as lights get older) and flow.

This would be controversial, as some people combat cyano with a shorter photo period, I didn't increase my photo period, just replaced my MH's and those other funny tubey lights and that resolved the issue. The thing that got me thinking was that the cyano would not appear where the tank was exposed to full natural sun from the window, and seemed to be more prevalent in the darker albeit low flow areas of the tank, this lead to a little research and as lights get older they don't hold their initial designed wave lengths for long and hence cyano loves longer wave lengths I figured I would just shorten it again. It didn't happen instantly but it defiantly got rid of it as well as a coral unfortunately as I should of raised the lights a little. The cyano appeared to get burnt.

The tank - well still no water change - and I think it's looking better than ever, but I will let you guys be the judges when I post some pictures up... soon to be a year now.

[1wizz]

I too agree with the light solution for cyano, i get small spots after about 6 months and if i leave it, it soon takes over the sand and rocks change the lights and it just recedes away.
Great tank NS. Big fan here.

[noskimmer]

Would have almost made a year with everything alive, but it had to be a leap year, because if it wasn't for that one extra day my last fish would have still been alive..... Ok, I'm kidding!

Got a long weekend, will post some pics and update, a couple of casualties (coral warfare and would you belive a Chromis! You can never get rid of those!)

**** work! Why does it consume so much time?

[Catpicklesdog]

Looking forward to seeing the pictures!!!!!!

[noskimmer]

Well unfortunately the long weekend came and went.. and I managed to get the pic's but never got a chance to upload them.. Finally here they are. The short of it is that there still has not been any water change, one coral isn't doing the best but I think it might just be a cycle as it has done this a few times before. Everything else is doing fine minus the Chromis which suffered some type of injury. He was on the mend and one day I noticed that he had left for fishy heaven, never did find him. The sump is something else, just can't seem to take any photo's to do it justice. I think I have to try a bit harder, but it is truly fascinating.

I did post a question at one time asking if anyone knew what the maximum beneficial depth of a DSB would be, and even though mine (the sump) has worms and stuff right to the bottom and it is at least 10" means that I still don't know the answer to that question.

The coral I have in the sump has flourished and the mantis which just by chance I had caught is now a monster, but amazingly beautiful, he (or she) would have to be at least 3". The amount of life in the sump is amazing to say the least, not to mention that some corals have spontaneously began to appear, I don't really know what they are but are beautiful none the less.

Anyway no more rambling.. here is the pudding.


http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//1ynwc1.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//1ynwc4.JPG

http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//1ynwc3.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//1ynwc2.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//1ynwc6.JPG
http://users.tpg.com.au/nickpapa//1ynwc.JPG

[kcress]

Very nice!

What is your substrate?

And give an updated pic of your sump, any kind of pic!

What does your trate measure?

[Reefscape]

Very nice!

What is your substrate?

And give an updated pic of your sump, any kind of pic!

What does your trate measure?

Not 400ppm i doubt.... ;)


Tank is looking absolutly stunning indeed...great work so far....

[journey0820]

That tank is just amazing. You have some very happy coral.

[kcress]

Not 400ppm i doubt.... ;)



zing!


LOL

[Catpicklesdog]

Still looking good Noskimmer!!!! And is it me or are those snails absoutely massive, in the one photo it looks bigger than your tang:grinyes:

[noskimmer]

Very nice!

What is your substrate?

And give an updated pic of your sump, any kind of pic!

What does your trate measure?

kress.. you’re so demanding! ; )

Actually I think I am just slack. I have answered your questions in the sump thread... I really do appreciate your curiosity. Here is the link.. http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1436472#post1436472

[saltydunc]

stunning tank mate.

[noskimmer]

Well, sort of....

Somewhere a few months ago, a bit before having the house broken into and my camera stolen, and a few days into my parents staying with my wife and I, all hell breaks loose... What is it about the parents staying with you that makes the anxiety and stress levels fly through the roof? And why did they decide to stay with us to see their second grandchild (not ours, we're still practicing)? And what is it about all of that stuff and "Murphy's Law" that the morning after they arrive. The day they are going to see my new wrinkly nephew for the first time, that we wake up and I find my aquarium flooded?

I try and make excuses as to why I did the things I did at the time, try and justify my actions of what was to happen next. The parents totally non understanding that the puddle of water in the room with the aquarium overflowing was actually of major significance to me and a major problem. My trying to understate it as saying "Oh everything is ok, not a problem" and them saying "We are running late, your brother is expecting us half an hour ago we can't wait to see our little grandchild" (Imagine this in a really annoying voice that only your mother can possibly do as though you were still only 6 years old).

Well, yes it looks like I'm trying to make excuses and maybe I am, as anyone knows, hindsight is a wonderful thing. In reality I was the one who stuffed up. None of it was their fault, and looking back at it now I probably would of done things a little different.

What happened? Well, it started with the auto top off. This is how (take note of my use of past tense) it used to work... 20 Litre reservoir that contains RO which has an auto top off that turns on a solenoid valve to the RO unit when it gets below a certain level in the reservoir, and then turns it off when it reaches a set level. This is then connected to a very basic float valve in the sump, maintaining a very constant level particularly in the section that has the return pump. It is quite amazing but if you keep this level constant you are effectively controlling your “Head height” for your return pump, hence controlling the water level in your overflow in such a precise way that it does not make any sound and remains very constant. This its self doesn’t sound so bad, but for a reservoir to work with a float valve in your sump then gravity is a major factor, so you place your reservoir above your sump (or in my case on the back part of the glass and the wall). Now, I know what you are thinking, what happens if the auto top off in the reservoir fails, does not turn off the solenoid and continues to fill the reservoir and begins to overflow into the sump…? Dumb right! Yes! Well, I sort of thought about this and had a second shut off system if the first failed.. well the first failed and in this case the second failed, so through the night the sump began to fill with beautiful pure RO, for hours, and hours (probably at least 8 – 12 hours), causing the sump to fill up, lowing the head height for the pump and slowly overflowing the display.
This is now that part where I stuffed up!



I look back, and after taking a reading of the salinity to realise that it wasn’t the very very gradual lowering of the salinity (down to 1.012) that caused the problem, but my panicked response to what I did next, and that was try and bring it back up. At this stage everything surprisingly was doing well, the fish were not stressed, the coral all looked fine, the only thing that was wrong was me and my actions. I dumped a heap of half dissolved salt (or very high concentrated salt water) into the sump in an attempt to stop the “nagging” parents (not their fault!) saying “we are running late” and my stupid attempt to get the levels back to "right".


Surprisingly (I actually thought I was going to lose everything) I lost very little considering.. I lost Betty (the lipstick), two Chromis (I didn’t think they could die), my Niger Trigger, the Six Line and several corals.


More surprisingly I gained heaps… (Gordon, Mark, Bruno, Dotty and the others all survived as did the tank as a whole, the dilution to a certain extent was in some ways, well.. it was sort of a water change). What I gained is knowledge, and when it comes to Marine Aquariums, when you thought you had patience, you realise that sometimes you don’t, and sometimes just stopping, thinking, looking, and NOT reacting is the best thing you can do.


The tank is looking great! I have 4 new rescue jobs (some throw away coral). The father in law has given me a conductivity meter (he works with precision measuring equipment and stuff like that) that is used in things like dialysis machines and can remain permanently in fluid (even salt water), compensates for temperature, and will give a mS\cm reading to some ridiculous accuracy, connect to a data logger (a spare laptop) which graphs temp, salinity and also has an alarm which goes off (a horrible screeching noise, and I get it to send me an email as well) when it breaches set temp and conductivity thresholds. Here are the links to it http://www.aicpl.com.au/brochures/condtbth.pdf http://www.aicpl.com.au/brochures/pm4co.pdf http://www.aicpl.com.au/brochures/rm4co.pdf

(http://www.aicpl.com.au/brochures/rm4co.pdf)
I wish I could post some pic’s, I have some of the rescue jobs on my mobile (very bad quality) but haven’t got around to buying a new camera yet because rumour has it that Canon is releasing the replacement to the 5D, so will have to wait.

[fsn77]

Wow... That's the hard way to learn, but it sounds like as much was gained as was lost. Definitely glad to hear you didn't lose everything. Best wishes for the rest of the recovery!

[Amphiprion]

That stinks, but I feel your pain. At least you didn't lose everything, so there's still plenty to be thankful for. A good water change is a great way to start things off, though :D.