Mbuna 38 gal tank setup and tankmates?

[mbunaluvr]

I have a 38 gal tank that I am planning on transferring two small mbunas and one pleco. I have heard that overstocking is the way to go and am wondering how many I can have in my 38 gal tank? I have one red zebra and I'm not sure what the other is...s/he's blue and black striped.

Can mbunas live with any kind of crustaceans? My husband is also interested in getting some kind of shark...any recommendations/comments?

Thanks!

[Lupin]

Can mbunas live with any kind of crustaceans?
None of the invertebrates will last long. Crayfish aren't the best options either owing to their nature for attacking fellow tankmates.

My husband is also interested in getting some kind of shark...any recommendations/comments?
I wouldn't recommend any shark in that tank full of mbunas.

[Coler]

what are the dimensions of the tank ?

[kay-bee]

If you can find them, and if your mbuna's are larger than 2.5", then maybe malawi blue crabs (potamonautes orbitospinus).

[GirlieGirl8521]

I would just get more of the Mbuna you already have and build the groups up to 5 each. In a 38g, that would be about all you'll have room for.

Can you post a picture of the unidentified Mbuna? Maybe we can ID it....

[jm1212]

most inverts will fall victim to aggression. the pleco may also.

[Coler]

blue and black stripe could be a johanni or a demasoni but are very aggressive, the demasoni especially so. I wouldn't add more of them until you know what it is - possibly better to keep that one as a single fish in that tank, with no similarly coloured species.

Again, tank dimensions have a lot to do with stocking

[mbunaluvr]

I've attached some pictures of my cichlids. I think the orange one is a red zebra and initially thought the blue one was a male red zebra(Pseudotropheus estherae). He seemed to chase her around a lot as if pursuing her and then a few nights ago she must've attacked him 'cause his caudal and dorsal fins were badly damaged and he succomed a day later. I thought maybe it was a breeding attempt that got a little rough, but I"m not sure. I can't tell if she has any eggs in her mouth or not.

The one I can't id is the blue and black striped guy...I thought he might be a powder blue (Pseudotropheus socolofi) but I'm not sure.

My new tank is a 38 gallon....12"x36"x18" Right now all I have are the female (?) red zebra and powder blue (sex unknown). I am interested in breeding so what should I get and how many? Also, are there any sites you recommend for buying fish? There aren't many fish stores around here

Thanks to all for your help!

[kay-bee]

As you've indicated, it looks like a red zebra (though not sure of the gender based on that pic, and you post another pic of it with a clear shot of dorsal fin?). The probable socolofi looks to be displaying 'stress bars' (mostly seen in juvies, basically a temporary pattern). Not quite sure if the blue is a red zebra (metriaclima estherae) or cobalt blue (metriaclima callainos) judging from the pic; can you also post a clear shot of the blue zebra?

(fyi, 'pseudotropheus' is an obsolete nomenclature in regards to the zebra complex).

To achieve successful breeding (while at the same time minimize the creation of hybrids) you'll probably want to assure you have an adequate sex ratio of the species you want to breed (typically 1 male per 3+ females per species), and decrease/remove similar or closely related species.

As a suggestion you may want to look into getting a larger tank (55gal minimum).

[Coler]

blue one is in my opinion a pseudotropheus elongatus and that's just his colouration if so http://www.cichlidforum.com/profiles/species.php?id=855. I agree the red one is a zebra.

they're aggressive little fish but you could do a group of them (1 male 3 female). They may have serious issues with any similar coloured fish. Labidochromis caeruleus (another group of 1 male 3/4 femaels) would be a good tank mate.

[mbunaluvr]

Thanks for all of your help! My little blue guy is definetly a P. elongatus. I looked through a lot of photos on the web and had a hard time id'ing him. My camera is down right now so I can't get another photo of my red zebra...how can I tell if it's male or female? What do I look for in the dorsal fin? If I get my camera working, I'll post a photo.

Will my P. elonongatus be o.k. living w/the red zebra? I have a 55gal waiting on a replacement tank bottom that these guys will be relocated to...hopefully soon.

Thanks again, you guys are great!

[Coler]

no prob glad that you got an ID :)

the elongatus and the zebras shouldn't have any difficulty living together per se...you can never legislate for personality issues mind you and bigger tanks help greatly.

heres a link with a male zebra on top and a female below http://www.african-cichlid.com/Red_Zebra.htm note the smaller and rounder tipped fins on the female and the brighter and more egg spots on the male anal fin

the 55 will be great for your mbuna - and much more flexibility on stock too.

[mbunaluvr]

Thanks for your help! It's definetly a P. elongatus. Will he be o.k. living with the red zebra? Is there an easy way to sex the red zebras? I think I have a female but I'm not sure. I may look into getting some labs, they're beautiful! I have a 55gallon that is getting the bottom replaced...so these guys will be moving soon.

Thanks!

[Coler]

I think our posts crossed lol my post above yours has a link to a male and female zebra and description of what to look for.

[mbunaluvr]

Sorry for the previous post, I didn't notice you had already answered.

My red zebra is a female, thanks for the link w/photos. I'm pretty sure the one that I had (now deceased) was a male red zebra (blue). I'm hoping she has some eggs in her mouth but I can't tell. He was attacked brutally by her and I think it may have been a breeding attempt that got a little too rough. His caudal and dorsal fins were pretty eaten up. Do you think this is the case? How can I tell if she has any eggs or will I have to wait and see?

Thanks again

[kay-bee]

Sorry for the previous post, I didn't notice you had already answered.

My red zebra is a female, thanks for the link w/photos. I'm pretty sure the one that I had (now deceased) was a male red zebra (blue). I'm hoping she has some eggs in her mouth but I can't tell. He was attacked brutally by her and I think it may have been a breeding attempt that got a little too rough. His caudal and dorsal fins were pretty eaten up. Do you think this is the case? How can I tell if she has any eggs or will I have to wait and see?

Thanks again


Wow, sorry for the loss of the blue one. If the female is mouthbrooding the bottom of her throat area will have distended, and she won't consume food as easily and might even reject it (if she's eating normally she may not be mouthbrooding at all). Periodically she'll move the eggs around in her mouth (and if fish could ever appear to chew gum that's would this action would resemble).

If she's only mouthbrooding a small quantity of eggs (less than 10) then the expanded throat region may not be as apparent, at least early on.

Here's a pic of my female red zebra when she was mouthbrooding (it's kind of blurry but you can probably see a fry eye peering out from inside there):
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a259/y2kenny19/African%20Cichlids/holding1.jpg