Considering pressurized CO2 - need opinion about regulator

[maronov]

I'm got tired of yeast-based CO2 injection because of fluctuating concentrations and constant need for maintenance, so I decided to look into pressurized. It seems that the most expensive bit is the regulator - some cost well over $100. However, I found this one (http://www.aquacave.com/detail.aspx?ID=4) for pretty cheap and can't shake the feeling that I'm missing some flaw - how can they charge so little for a dual-gauge regulator, solenoid, needle valve, and bubble counter? These parts together could cost up to $200 but this particular part costs ~$80 in various stores... what gives?

[UCF-Planted]

I have that regulator, but havn't gotten it setup yet, so I can't speak for how good it is, but I can say that the components are fairly cheap and the directions are a little strange. It seems like the manufacturer doesn't really understand how their own regulator is intended to be used. It is made in china out of mediocre quality parts, so that's what gives. If you want American made out of high quality parts I highly recommend a custom regulator from Rex Grigg. He helped me out on a project I am in the middle of, and next time I need a regulator I will turn to him first: http://www.bestaquariumregulator.com/co2.html

[maronov]

That explains a lot. I'm glad I asked here before making an impulse buy. Thanks, UCF-Planted. When you set up the system, PM me or post on this thread - I'd like to know how well the part actually works. Rex's model is a lot more expensive after all.

[Nolapete]

I just bought one of Rex's regulators and spent the extra money on the Ideal needle valve. I'm completely satisfied with it and would recommend spending the extra money to get the great service and advice Rex has to offer. The Ideal valve is so precise and allows for super-fine adjustment almost to the point of being too precise if there is such a thing.

[GirlieGirl8521]

I don't personally have that regulator (I have Rex's as well), but I know that alot of people use it and its very popular. I've heard good and bad things about it, but its mostly good feedback. Alot of people use it without problems, so if its better for your budget, I say go for it. :) If you can spend the extra money on a regulator from Rex, then thats the route I'd suggest.

[imnotlistening]

Here's your problem. You're buying the same product but in the aquarium market so it is overpriced. The same exact thing is also used for brewing beer. http://www.micromatic.com/draft-keg-beer/regulators-cid-614.html

[Nolapete]

If you're buying from Rex, you aren't buying the same thing as a beer regulator. Sure, you could take the beer regulator and add your own Ghetto bubble counter, tubing, nifty brass washer that Rex includes, brass check valves, and whichever needle valve you want. You'll come out with the same thing Rex is offering with one stop shopping and expertise as well. I don't know for certain, but I take Rex as being a bit of a perfectionist and definitely someone who takes pride in his work. You are paying extra for that and to me it's well worth it.

[imnotlistening]

"Sure, you could take the beer regulator and add your own Ghetto bubble counter, tubing, nifty brass washer that Rex includes, brass check valves, and whichever needle valve you want." You really don't need all that junk. In fact, you don't even need a bubble counter at all. Plus all those accessories aren't gonna bump up the price to $115. BTW you can get a needle valve from Lowe's for $3. "one stop shopping" This is called DIY, not lazy and will spend whatever it takes to not get off the couch, pressurized co2.
All you need is a co2 cylinder,regulator,needle valve, and a DIY reactor.

[maronov]

What GirlieGirl8521 says combined with Rex's price tag makes that $78 model very tempting. Has anybody actually used it? If it breaks after a while it would probably be worth dishing out the extra $100 for Rex's product.

[Plecosterone]

I Use that regulator with a pH controller and have no problems with it.

[TwoTankAmin]

I put my co2 system together 5+ years ago, it has worked fine from day one through the present. back then it was not easy finding all the parts in one place for a reasonable price. I got my stuff using 3 different sources, one of which no longer exists.

I got my regulator from kegworks http://www.kegworks.com/product.php?productid=19100&cat=427&page=1

I got a top quality inline needle valve for about $22 and my bubble counter (which imo is a necessity for making adjustments to the flow rate with the needle valve) was about $18.

Rex has an excellent rep and I would buy from him if I was looking to buy.

[Nolapete]

"Sure, you could take the beer regulator and add your own Ghetto bubble counter, tubing, nifty brass washer that Rex includes, brass check valves, and whichever needle valve you want." You really don't need all that junk. In fact, you don't even need a bubble counter at all. Plus all those accessories aren't gonna bump up the price to $115. BTW you can get a needle valve from Lowe's for $3. "one stop shopping" This is called DIY, not lazy and will spend whatever it takes to not get off the couch, pressurized co2.
All you need is a co2 cylinder,regulator,needle valve, and a DIY reactor.

Yes, you can buy a crappy needle valve from Lowe's. You can't buy an Ideal quality needle valve for under $40.

I don't know what your problem is, but I don't appreciate the flame.

The fact that you refer to it as junk shows me that you dont' have a clue about what you are talking about.

[imnotlistening]

Umm I wasn't flaming. I said junk,so what, I think you're a little sensitive. Anyway you started this whole thing: "ghetto bubble counter". All I said was if you do it yourself, then it will be of the same quality and cheaper price. Why do you care so much about Rex's stuff anyway. It's a ripoff, I don't care how good it is. That's my opinion, get over it. I didn't force it on you. This is a forum, you share opinions. Don't whine about it. BTW, you may not be old enough to understand but some independent businesses rely on loyal people like you to sell when really it's the same thing as the one at drfostersmith. Just more expensive.

[J double R]

lets keep it civil please. :)

[UCF-Planted]

"Ghetto bubble counter" is the name Rex has given the one he makes and sells, and others have begun calling it the same, not because it is DIY and made from hardware store parts. Nolapete's point regarding your usage of the word junk is not necessarily a problem with the implication that the specific parts are trash, but that you do not see the purpose and value in using those parts. Perhaps you can get by without a bubble counter and other parts that are not directly critical to the process of delivering CO2 to the aquarium, but others may appreciate the benefit of those parts. Similarly they may appreciate the quality of parts provided in a custom solution that costs a little more.

Certainly you are entitled to your own opinion, and to share it, however, it is appropriate to provide your opinion in a non-attacking way. When you attack another person's opinion it is a flame. Calling someone else lazy and making implications regarding maturity are such attacks.

[Nolapete]

Umm I wasn't flaming. I said junk,so what, I think you're a little sensitive. Anyway you started this whole thing: "ghetto bubble counter". All I said was if you do it yourself, then it will be of the same quality and cheaper price. Why do you care so much about Rex's stuff anyway. It's a ripoff, I don't care how good it is. That's my opinion, get over it. I didn't force it on you. This is a forum, you share opinions. Don't whine about it. BTW, you may not be old enough to understand but some independent businesses rely on loyal people like you to sell when really it's the same thing as the one at drfostersmith. Just more expensive.

I'm 41 and most likely have a better understanding of brand loyalty and marketing than you think. You on the other hand don't seem to understand the concept of value-added and service.

There is no intrinsic value bestowed upon the regulator because it comes from Rex. He tells you on his website how to make exactly the same thing yourself. It's not that the parts are better because they are the same parts available to anyone with a computer and Internet access.

As I said before, when you buy a regulator from Rex you are paying for his expertise and service and quality craftsmanship. For me the extra money is worth the piece of mind that I have a good product. Does that make me "lazy and will spend whatever it takes to not get off the couch?" No, it doesn't.

UCF-Planted, thank you for saying what I was going to. I couldn't have said it better.

[imnotlistening]

I'm sorry if I offended you.

[maronov]

After shopping around the only thing that I can't understand is the price of the actual regulator. Quality CO2 regulators from brewery or welding places cost around $40... from aquarium places they cost over $100. Does seem like they are charging extra for the same product just because you are buying for an aquarium and not a beer keg.

However, it is different for Rex's site:

Items included with Rex's regulator (Clippard needle valve, brass in-line check valve, MK II perma-seal and 5' of CO2 tubing) = $35
Regulator from Beverage Factory (http://www.beveragefactory.com/draftbeer/regulators/co2-premium.shtml) = $45
Total = $80

Rex's regulator costs $115. So you are paying $35 for service, a guarantee that all the parts will fit perfectly, and perhaps a donation to keep Rex's site going. Not exactly a ripoff, is it?

Hope this clears up any confusion that, ironically, I myself started.

[Nolapete]

What about the solenoid? I don't see that in your price.

[maronov]

I was calculating the price without the solenoid. Rex sells both a solenoid and manual regulator - $140 and $115, respectively.

Made a slight mistake in including the needle valve for the manual regulator. That's $15. But one would probably get the solenoid reactor anyway.

[Nolapete]

When you compare apples to apples, you aren't going to be that much different on the price despite what some people think.

[maronov]

Just a bit of info from Rex in a PM he sent me:

"To actually compare apples to apples you have to compare the exact same regulator body I'm using. I use Cornelius regulators. I think you will find they are a bit more than $40. Also if you buy from several different places you have to total the shipping and handling charges."

So that answers my question about why the brewery regulator costs much less: here (http://www.northernbrewer.com/regulator-parts.html) a Cornelius body costs $50, and that's without the dual pressure gauges.