View Full Version : Mixing Cichlids
jiminy_crime
06-09-2003, 9:13 PM
If I were to put an african cichlid with a south american cichlid is this a bad thing?
simply put.....yes bad idea
yes, for many reasons, although I am sure it has been done before and will be done again. It's just not the preferential treatment for the fish, so, yes its bad.
dcallen
06-09-2003, 9:29 PM
I totally agree with Optix. You want to keep them apart for sure. The results of doing this would be tragic.
HTH
Welcome to AC!
andruboz
06-09-2003, 10:34 PM
i think i have mixed them already.. jewel cichlids with nicaraguan cichlids.. have seen no trouble yet.. the nics are twice as big as the jewels.
another tank has firemouth and african knife and an african puffer[fahaka]. they seem to get along.
although jewels are african continent, i dont think they are lake malawi or tanganika. so i have no experience with that. i saw small africans beating a large oscar at my lfs.
optix
06-09-2003, 10:38 PM
im pretty sure everything you just named are all west african.
nolemite
06-10-2003, 1:02 AM
The nicaraguense and firemouths are central american. Jewels are west african.
What size is the tank? The jewels (you didn't mention which species) have a reputation for being rougher in general than the nicaraguense. If the tank is big enough, then the mix could work.
ahhh yes Jewel was the only thing that stuck in my mind lol. Sorry for the mix up, im pretty aware of FM's and nigs being new world
Like I’ve said in a previous post; "I know some people mix all kind of cichlids, even from different parts of the world and sometimes even those species get along just fine."
But frankly, it's not my idea of keeping cichlids as for most hobbyists. Read up on compatibility and find out why it's a bad idea. At least you would know what to look for when problems occur. Here’s an example of just one of them.
Quote:
"Spawning aggression. Hemichromis bimaculatus, widely known as the Jewel cichlid, is a truly magnificent fish. However, when spawning in the limited space of an aquarium it becomes as deadly as it can get. Even the female may be killed on the spot if "she" doesn't accept the males courting. Certainly, getting 4 of them in a community tank will always result in big troubles. This species is simply incompatible because if its spawning behavior"
Quote:
"It should be noted that when spawning, some fishes "enlarge" their territory considerably. If the tank is not big enough, this may well mean that there is no space for the rest of your fish. A good example is the African river fish Hemichromis bimaculatus (known as the Jewel cichlid). When this fish is spawning all other fish in the tank become endangered species. It goes without saying that, the bigger the fish, the bigger the problem will be."
I guess it'll be totally up to you.
Jimmy
My buddy has some jack dempseys with some africans.. everything is fine..
Originally posted by Jinks
My buddy has some jack dempseys with some africans.. everything is fine..
For now......
dbcb314
06-10-2003, 3:21 PM
i had a krib and jewel with a firemouth and jurupari and severum.
for now?? how about for 2 years now..
Still alive and healthy.
mogurnda
06-10-2003, 3:37 PM
The fish don't really care which continent they are from. There are at least hundreds of species from South and Central America, and thousands from Africa. The key is knowing which species, what water conditions they like, and whether their aggression is matched.
For example, if that JD is with mbuna, it will ultimately be toast. If it's with Tilapia mariae (or whatever it's called now), it's probably fine. You just can't tell unless you know who the players are.
its with a 5" mbuna. Jacks are 3"
hmmmmm....3" jack with a mbuna for 2 years eh... anybody else see anything wrong with that. Let that jack reach about 7 inchs. Things will get interesting then
dbcb314
06-10-2003, 3:44 PM
youve had the jack for 2 years and it is only 3in? do they grow that slow?
no dbcb they don't grow that slow, I have a 4 inch female that I've only had since november of this past year. I bought her at half an inch as a baby.
ahhhhhhh...
he screwed me up
hes had the jcaks for 6months.. they are 2-3 "
Africans for just over a year.. they are 3-5"
dbcb314
06-10-2003, 3:48 PM
hahaha, i posted the same thing 1 sec after you
ummm fry only takes about a month to reach .5 inch in which is the time I bought mine and have only had mine for 7 months. That is still incredibly slow growing, so slow in fact that I don't believe its even been 1.5 years.
dbcb314
06-10-2003, 3:50 PM
i didnt think they grew that slow
ya ya.. go back and read my post.. i fixed it..
here :
I thought he meant he had them for over a year and a half togehter.. nm.
ahhhhhhh...
he screwed me up
hes had the jcaks for 6months.. they are 2-3 "
Africans for just over a year.. they are 3-5"
Still had them together for at least 6 months.. in a 29 gal
Forgive me if I don't know the correct name of the fish I had, but my vote for mixing Cichlids is definitely NO. I learned my lesson by doing that. I originally had Gold Severums, Firemouths, Jewels. Everything was great so I added a Malawi type. Things were still great. I thought - screw the people that say it won't work because it IS! Soooo... I added another one and the war zone began. I replaced the casualties with Kribs and another Malawi type. Oh boy! They started pissing me off when they went after my severums. I got rid of all the culprits and was left with my Gold Severums, which I adored. It was devastating. Even my plecos were gutted. Each day was a massacre. I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND MIXING CICHLIDS! I was stupid not to listen to people advising against it. I had no clue. I'm sure my tank was probably overcrowded too. Just to make matters worse. If you go for it, all I have to say is good luck and don't be disappointed if they start roughing each other up. I can guarantee that you're tank will be better off than mine due to the simple fact that you're educating yourself PRIOR. Good for you!;)
Originally posted by Jinks
ya ya.. go back and read my post.. i fixed it..
here :
I thought he meant he had them for over a year and a half togehter.. nm.
ahhhhhhh...
he screwed me up
hes had the jcaks for 6months.. they are 2-3 "
Africans for just over a year.. they are 3-5"
Still had them together for at least 6 months.. in a 29 gal
OK im trying to keep the flaming to a minimum but cooome on man lol....your post is totally invalid to make on here. he's asking to be educated not mislead. 2 jacks and an mbuna in A 29 GALLON!!! That tank is going to be a **** breeding grounds for hell spawn before too long at all. I advise you guys do something before you are left with one of those fish and you aren't able to make the decision as to which one.
Im jsut saying what he has..
I misunderstood what he said at first..
Originally posted by Jinks
Im jsut saying what he has..
I misunderstood what he said at first..
Understandable, I know you are just speaking of an experience, just next time let us know the full details instead of just saying they can live peacefully :)
dbcb314
06-10-2003, 4:03 PM
Still had them together for at least 6 months.. in a 29 gal
whoa...
Even my plecos were gutted
whoa...
they fight ab it.. but generally they are fine..
I told him to throw in a bumblee for some real fun ;)
Originally posted by dbcb314
whoa...
whoa...
hahaha good way of saying it dbcb, my thoughts exactly
i had two 3" jewels with two 6" bumble bees.. They held their own.. was surprised
dbcb314/Jinks: Do you know whether all those cichlids are pairs or just males?
It doesn’t say in your reply.
Don’t get me wrong I’m not criticizing I’m just curious.
Jimmy
chevyII
06-10-2003, 4:16 PM
Ok lete me save Jinks a little bit here. I am the one with the fish he was explaining.
I have had my africans for over a year now and I bought 4 baby jacks back in November. Yes I do have them in a 29 gallon.
My Africans are 1 3.5" Socolofi and 1 4.5" socolofi.
MY 4 jacks are in the 2-3" range. They all get a long just fine in this tank and actually my Africans are the "boss" of the tank. My jacks fins get a nip now and then but nothing serious.
Yes I break all the holy rules, I also don't use lake salt with my Africans and never have and they are always perfect healthy fish.
I live in an apartment right now and don't have the room for multiple tanks. I will be buying a house in the next couple months and will probably be transfering the jacks to a 55-75 gal tank once I have the space for it.
With the setup I have now I see them living "happily" for at least another year before room becomes an issue.
Originally posted by chevyII
Ok lete me save Jinks a little bit here. I am the one with the fish he was explaining.
I have had my africans for over a year now and I bought 4 baby jacks back in November. Yes I do have them in a 29 gallon.
My Africans are 1 3.5" Socolofi and 1 4.5" socolofi.
MY 4 jacks are in the 2-3" range. They all get a long just fine in this tank and actually my Africans are the "boss" of the tank. They all get a long just fine. My jacks fins get a nip now and then but nothing serious.
Yes I break all the holy rules, I also don't use lake salt with my Africans and never have and they are always perfect healthy fish.
I live in an apartment right now and don't have the room for multiple tanks. I will be buying a house in the next couple months and will probably be transfering the jacks to a 55-65 gal tank once I have the space for it.
With the setup I have now I see them living "happily" for at least another year before room becomes an issue.
no offense but I would bet my next years salary that tank wont last another 6 months. Im just stating my opinion, I would take 3 of those jacks back. 55-65 gallon tank is only sufficient enough for a single jack and maybe a pleco. that 29 gallon is entirely too small for those 6 fish. That is utter insanity 6 months from now. I promise
55-65 for one jack?? give me a break lol..
im trying to give you a break, you seem to be too stubborn to heed my warnings, anyone in here would advise against that if they have any experience or knowledge of these fish. Trust me, I have a single 4 inch jack with a 2 inch con in a 55 gallon growing out to put into my 150 gallon, and its already getting nasty. if you want to fill a 29 gallon or 55 gallon with multiple fish, cichlids aren't for you. Go look at some tiger barbs or neon tetras. That way you aren't just wasting your time and money.
haha tetra's riiight..
You dont know how to landscape a tank if you cant fit two JD's in a 55-65 GAl tank.
chevyII
06-10-2003, 4:37 PM
not to turn this poor guys post into a flame war I apologize.
but, when I lived at home few years ago I had a 55 gal tank with two 10" Oscars and 1 8" Dempsey that I raised from 3" size. They were just fine in that tank.
I think some of you guys are little space crazy for your fish and go way over board.
Originally posted by Jinks
haha tetra's riiight..
You dont know how to landscape a tank if you cant fit two JD's in a 55-65 GAl tank.
How do you plan to aquascape a 55 gallon aquarium with 2 fish that reach 10 inchs in length and are rather aggressive. Seriously what do you plan to do that will keep those fish from trying to overrun the entire tank. it is just too small. You are showing just how novice you are the more you post here. You should probably stop while you are kind of still ahead.
ok obviously im being the only one who has decided to argue with you so im going to go along with everyone else who has just decided to ignore this. have it your way, you'll see for yourself in due time and you can then post for us to hear about your tragic stories.
they seem to get less aggressive with size and age to me.
well its generally the other way around, like with mine she was like really shy at first, always hiding and what not. Now she is 4 inchs and she is starting to be a terror, finally flaring out her gills and threatening my convict. they can sit for 15 minutes straight it seems like just sitting there with gills flared taunting each other, I will eventually have to move the jack out because it will only be going down hill from here. She will find the 150 gallon with only a fellow oscar and gold saum as tankmates much more suitable. Now I know I can aquascape a 150 gallon to house a jack oscar gold saum and pleco. thats all I plan to ever keep in there other than the dithers (silver dollars) and maybe a few pictus cats. I am going to go ape **** on the filtration. I am thinking 2 emporer 400's and two fluval 404's.
haha my African tank must be ludicrous :) 15 In a 77 :/
well see africans have a reputation for being able to be overcrowded to control aggression especially mbuna. Overcrowding rift lake africans isn't necessarily a bad thing. Its usually new worlds that are the problem.
EDIT: actually depending on the species 15 doesn't seem like a very big number for a tank over 75 gallons to me anyway. That sounds like you are in good shape (depending on speicies as I said)
dbcb314
06-10-2003, 6:52 PM
to someone who asks if my fish were paired, no they are not. i definently do not want to mess with a pair of cichlids in a tanks with something else, especially a jewel cichlid. they just take over.
3 jacks will not live in a 50 gal. not too full size at least. maybe 2, but definently not 3.
You see.. the only reason i disagree is because i dont like to say NEVER.. that isnt true.. We dont understand fish fully.. and sometimes 3 JD's WILL get along in that size tank. Weirder things have happened. I would probably put 4 SMall JD's in.. and let them grow to about 4-5" ( or whenver they kill each other ) and then sell them! I only like htem up to that size anyway ! afte rthat they start to get big and ugly
Originally posted by Jinks
You see.. the only reason i disagree is because i dont like to say NEVER.. that isnt true.. We dont understand fish fully.. and sometimes 3 JD's WILL get along in that size tank. Weirder things have happened. I would probably put 4 SMall JD's in.. and let them grow to about 4-5" ( or whenver they kill each other ) and then sell them! I only like htem up to that size anyway ! afte rthat they start to get big and ugly
Well that could work as long as you get them back before they outgrow the tank. Now I know the never say never rule, but this is nature. I know there are sometimes tame fish of a normally aggressive species, but even the most docile of the species is going to eventually start kicking *** if you box them up in a small space with 3 others especially the size jacks get. you MAY get by with 2 maybe. Anymore than that and its just physically impossible to go without some war here and there. If not all out until death.
Mystroe_TheMyst
06-11-2003, 4:05 AM
Yeah wierder things have happened....but more often than not most behavior patterns of particular cichlids are pretty much predictable.
I'm just shocked at the 29 gallon deal, my gold severum lives alone in a 35Gal and kills anything that gets into the water, the tank seems empty but I don't want to keep losing fish..I recently put 2 autralian pearch in there as a temporary home (2 days) so I could take them elsewhere and after 2 days both were dead...hes nasty. And I used to think like that grow them till a certian size and trade them, but not no more cause I remember the reason why I started into fish because I like fishes charecter and its great watching a fish grow into a adult and knowing what its behaviour is and it eating little strips of soft beef heart out of your hand! Too much attachment for my fish IMO to let them go..
Luca Brazzi
06-18-2003, 12:37 AM
I dont see a problem with mixing SA and Africans... its all about the sizes, and temperments.
For that matter there are species on boths sides of the fence that dont do well together... MBuna and Peacoks, Midas and anything else.
I think you could safely put a Male Chipokae, and a Male Dempsey of equal size into the same tank...
Luca Brazzi: I don’t see a problem with mixing SA and Africans... its all about the sizes, and temperments.
I think you could safely put a Male Chipokae, and a Male Dempsey of equal size into the same tank...
I'm still wondering why would you mix cichlids which prefers pH 7 and gH 6 with cichlids who prefers pH 8.3 and gH 14.
Would they recognize the warning signals from each other?
How about their feeding habits, the overall tank setup like decoration?
Sometimes it seems that shape and color are the primary (if not only) concern.
No matter what size tank you’re keeping them in, one of them is not feeling happy in there.
Even both won’t feel happy when you go for the average values.
Mixing these cichlids has IMO nothing to do with keeping cichlids.
Jimmy
Luca Brazzi
06-18-2003, 10:03 AM
I'm still wondering why would you mix cichlids which prefers pH 7 and gH 6 with cichlids who prefers pH 8.3 and gH 14.
Its simple... because you like/want both fish.
Why would you take a fish that would be better off in the wild... and keep it captive in living room? Easy... because you feel like it.
jimbo
06-18-2003, 12:02 PM
The first choice you make, limits the second.
That's all what "keeping cichlids" is about.
Don’t get me wrong, mix any cichlid or fish you like in your tank.
At least you would know what to look for, if something goes wrong.
Jimmy
dave76
06-18-2003, 1:03 PM
Originally posted by Jinks
they fight ab it.. but generally they are fine..
I told him to throw in a bumblee for some real fun ;)
To me this says as much as I need to know about what you want to get out of keeping fish, you might as well be breeding pit bulls to fight :rolleyes:
chevyII
06-18-2003, 4:29 PM
Originally posted by dave76
To me this says as much as I need to know about what you want to get out of keeping fish, you might as well be breeding pit bulls to fight :rolleyes:
He was being sarcastic :)
chevyII
07-01-2004, 5:02 PM
Just a little update. A year later my Jacks and Africans are still thriving together :) MY Jd's just laid Eggs and my Auratus Is holding as well. Granted they were upgraded to a 135 gallon tank from the 29gallon.
no offense but I would bet my next years salary that tank wont last another 6 months. Im just stating my opinion, I would take 3 of those jacks back. 55-65 gallon tank is only sufficient enough for a single jack and maybe a pleco. that 29 gallon is entirely too small for those 6 fish. That is utter insanity 6 months from now. I promise
You owe me your whole years salary. They lasted in that tank telll April :)
http://www.chevelles.com/showroom/66chevyIISS/tank.jpg