new 10g, standard AG Deluxe 15w

[ho114nd]

I've had a planted tankl in the past with CF lighting and CO2 but had to take it down during a move. I've decided to start a little 10g. I have flourite mixed with gravel for substrate and the standard 15W fluorescent that came with an All Glass Deluxe Hood. I'd like to keep it fairly low maintenence but would like to plant it heavily. I have some dry and liquid fertilizers and have set up DIY CO2 in the past but may try and avoid this if possible. What are the best plants for this setup? I'm thinking that iwould like a ground cover... maybe dwarf hairgrass and then perhaps anubias and java fern. Any other suggestions for this amount of lighting? Would CO2 be necessary? Anyone have experience with a similar setup? thank in advance.

[plantling]

Injected CO2 would be beneficial to plants of any tank, but not necessary if you only have about 1.5 watts per gallon. Anubias and java fern are good choices for low light tanks. I found the plantgeek site helpful when picking out my plants. Here's a link to the low light plants in their plant guide:

http://www.plantgeek.net/plantguide_list.php?category=1&filter_by=2

I think dwarf hairgrass and even dwarf sag prefer med to med-high light. You could try the anubias nana or the petite nana as groundcover and I remember reading that others have had luck with those. Or go with another low light plant that that is described as a foreground plant (tank placement) in the plantgeek guide. Good Luck.

[ho114nd]

thanks for the link it was very helpful. I ordered some anubias nana and also 2 varieties of crypts for background. I read those were low light as well. I went ahead and got some dwarf sag, as it was listed moderate to low. I'll see how it does. I may upgrade lighting eventually and will do CO2 if need be. I just wanted to see what i could do simply at first. Any suggestions for a CF strip light that would fit on my AG hood? I went through aquabotanic as i had gotten plants from them several years ago.

thanks.

[Slappy*McFish]

I've been able to grow many plants at 1.5wpg with or without CO2. Rooted plants, java fern and anubias especially.

Here are some pics of one of my old planted tanks from about 5-7 yrs ago.

[mellowvision]

wow nice. were you using ferts at the time, or was this just a low light, easy going tank?

[plantling]

Wow Slappy! That was a beautiful tank. I was able to grow swords in low light too, but didn't want to suggest them for a 10 gallon as they can get quite large. Although with the smaller swords like compact or melon sword and low light, they may stay small.

As far as cf light, I upgraded my lighting with a Current USA satellite and as a result my plants have really taken off and there's lots more pearling. But then along with higher light, I'm also doing diy yeast for CO2, and dosing fert's. Here's a link just to show you what I have, but you may find a better price elsewhere if you want to get one of these. And if I'm correct you'd need a 20" for your 10 gallon regular. With 40watts, this will give you 4 watts per gallon and then of course you'll also need to worry about CO2 and fert's.

http://www.marineandreef.com/shoppro/power_satellite.html

Oh, I also changed out the bulb and got a dual daylight bulb for my plants, so this route may prove too costly. A lot of folks on this site have had success with AH Supply lighting but if you're planning on sticking with low light plants, I think 1.5 wpg is plenty. Just look at Slappy's tank above. :)

[mellowvision]

I did what plantling did... have that same current usa 40w on my 10gallon... I feel that it's too a little much light for what I wanted, it forces me to stay on top of co2 and ferts, and one slip starts to show algae growth.

[Slappy*McFish]

wow nice. were you using ferts at the time, or was this just a low light, easy going tank?

Just a little Flourish once a week. The tank was pretty heavily stocked, so the fish provided more than enough nitrogen to the tank. I ran DIY CO2 bottles for a couple of years and the stem plants did a little better, but to be honest it wasn't really needed. The tank did very well without it. If the plants ever showed signs of deficiency, I'd add the necessary ferts/minerals to rectify it. The substrate was never vacuumed, either. The tank was about as easy-going as it gets. Just a little pruning during weekly water changes of 25-30%.

[Slappy*McFish]

...oh, and can you believe all of those anubias nana came from the one mother plant on the far left?

[ho114nd]

wow, that is a great tank and defintely shows what you can do with 1.5wpg. It gives me hope for sure! Slappy, i checked out your 10g planted tank link a couple of the plants you listed, i have on order. Any specific comments on Cryptocoryne spiralis or wendtii? I'm also gonna get a few java fern cuttings from a friend. It will be interesting to follow your progress as it seems our setups will be similar.

i had a tank a few years back with close to 4wpg. It was beautiful when i had co2 and steady dosing, but a couple weeks of slacking sent me into a long battle with algae etc. Hopefully i can get this one stable with the low light setup and then perhaps down the road tweak things up a bit.

[Slappy*McFish]

You should do very well with those plants. Keep in mind, that tank pictured above is a lot deeper than a 10g. 1.5wpg on a 10 is probably equal to 2+wpg on that 55g.

[jersysman]

I bought the 2x13w kit from AH Supply and have been very happy with it. The also offer a 1 x 36w kit for a ten gallon.

[Slappy*McFish]

My 10G has been planted. Check out the link in my sig if you want to see the pics. We'll see how this tank does long term.

[ho114nd]

Thanks all for the info. Should have plants in this week. I am restocking some test kits and other products currently. I have used Seachem Prime in the past for a water conditioner. It says that it detoxifies ammonia and helps remove nitrate. This wouldn't affect it's availability to plants would it? Is Prime ok to use in a planted tank? Thanks again, i'll post some pics when i get some stuff into the tank.

[Slappy*McFish]

Yes, Prime is perfectly safe for planted tanks. It doesn't actually remove ammonia/nitrites/nitrates...it just renders them nontoxic. The plants will still be able to utilize the ammonium and nitrates.

[ho114nd]

Got the plants in today. I was a little disapointed in the quality/ size from aquabotanica. the crypt spirilis was really ragged as well as the wendtii. I got one nice anubias nana but the other two were meh... I really hope the hairgrass does ok caus it was a pita to plant heh. depending on how these grow out i may add some java fern or i'm thinking the spirilis may get too tall so maybe could replace that with some java fern later.

I also got some Flourish and flourish excel as well as some seachem root tabs. I went ahead and dosed the liquids when i added water but am holding off on the tabs for now. Tested my tap water and got some odd results.

pH= 7.6,
Nitrate= 5ppm
Ammonia= 2.5ppm???

pH and nitrate did not surprise me, but is it normal to get an ammonia reading from the tap water? Maybe i did the test wrong idk but it seemed odd to me. Anyhow, i'll post another pic when things start growing. This one is kinda poor quality but the best i had. As you can see the crypts are pretty shabby.

[Slappy*McFish]

Don't worry about the crypts. It is normal for them to 'melt' away at first (especially after shipping)...They will regrow new leaves in time.
Most of mine melted back, but new growth is coming along. They are more sensitive than most plants and need some time to develop their roots.
Also, a lot of plants are grown emersed and will drop their leaves until the new submersed leaves grow in.
Try not to disturb the crypts too much and just let them die back. They hate to be moved around and disturbed. Try to trim back the dead leaves and soft spots without uprooting them.
I would hold off adding any ferts the 1st week, as the plants are not going to be growing very much until they get over the shipping/transplant shock.
When they begin to grow again, slowly add the ferts to accommodate their needs. Otherwise, you'll be feeding algae instead.
The ammonia could be a spike caused by the addition of organic matter to the tank. I assume the readings were 0 before adding the plants?
Make sure to remove the rockwool from the roots of the plants as it can produce ammonia, as well.
If you're getting a reading from the tap, then your water is probably treated with chloramines and the water conditioner should take care of that. The plants and bacteria will consume the ammonium.

[ho114nd]

when i read your answer i quickly realised i was dumb! Yah, i tested the tap before adding any water conditioner... so the ammonia i was seeing was likely from the chloramine in the water. I will hold off on adding any more flourish for awhile and just observe how things go. I did go ahead and add 2 small tetras as i have read they will do ok in an uncycled planted tank. I retested water 24 hrs after adding them and came up with .25ppm ammonia and 10-20ppm nitrate , pH 7.6. Originally i read 5ppm Nitrate from the tap. Could dead plant matter increase nitrates and ammonia a bit? Does anyone recommend water changes before a full cycle for this type of setup (fish being already in the tank). Question regarding the flourish root tabs. When should i add them and should i only add them to the crypts, or space them under the hairgrass as well? I don't plan on adding tabs around the anubias. Also once i began adding it, what is the recommended schedule for Flourish Comprehensive and Flourish Excel? THanks!

[Slappy*McFish]

Could dead plant matter increase nitrates and ammonia a bit?Yes. It certainly can.

Does anyone recommend water changes before a full cycle for this type of setup (fish being already in the tank).Yes, try to keep the ammonia levels below 1ppm. This may require daily partial water changes...or add Prime to the tank daily to detoxify the ammonia and nitrites. Add some gravel or filter mulm from an established tank to the system to introduce more bacteria.


Question regarding the flourish root tabs. When should i add them and should i only add them to the crypts, or space them under the hairgrass as well?You add them near the roots of all the root feeders for best results. Don't overdose. I would wait to add the root tabs until the plants have had time to develop their root systems and have settled in. This usually takes a couple of weeks after planting.

I don't plan on adding tabs around the anubias.They would benefit from a root tab, but not as much as the crypts and grass. I'd go ahead and add a tab near them, as well.


Also once i began adding it, what is the recommended schedule for Flourish Comprehensive and Flourish Excel? THanks!Just follow the directions on the bottles. I add Flourish once/twice a week depending on growth (Higher light = higher growth = more ferts), and Excel daily. Do not overdose.

[ho114nd]

Well had this tank up and running for a little over 3 weeks now. PLants are starting to show some growth, especially the crypt spirilis. The wendtii is a little slow but it is coming along. Can't see alot of growth with the dwarf hairgrass but i got it knowing that i was probably pushing the limits of what it would grow under. Also, starting to see a little green hair algae on the anubias. Been dosing Excel 1mL every day and Flourish 1mL every other day. Right now i have 2 Pristellas and 3 Red Phantom Tetras all doing well. I've been feeding them somewhat heavy, as my only resource for livestock is Petco and a couple of them came home looking a little worse for their stay. I would love to get a bristlenose for this tank, however i don't see myself finding one locally and don't want to order online for one fish. I could try a couple places that are an hour away. Would a BN be fine in a 10g? Lastly, i'm still holding off on co2 injection, however, may do it once i get a good feel for how this tank is doing. If i simply added Co2 to my current setup and dosing regimen, what results could i expect to see? Meaning, would Co2 significantly increase algae growth as well as plant growth, or would the plants most likely benefit the most? I do have a full compliment of dry ferts, however i really don't want to mess with too many variables at once. Any general advice would be very appreciated. And here is an updated pic to compare with the above pic which was taken shortly after planting. Still trying to find the best camera setting to take pics of the tank and also would like to get a background up asap. I'm thinking just a solid black backdrop... what would you all suggest?

thanks,