VHO vs T5

[schigara]

The first time I had this 75 setup before I moved, I was using 2 250w MH iwasaki bulbs 6500K and ofcourse the look was very yellow and just........yuk!

I was at my LFS the other day and he recommended VHO's. What would be the cost difference and general pros and cons of using VHO's or T5's? It will be a fish and softy only and maybe a Tridacnid clam.

[ooja3k]

So you got rid of your MH fixtures??? Why don't you jsut get different bulbs... Going from MH to T5 or VHO is a extreme downgrade..

[archer772]

If you are talking about getting rid of the halides and going with just VHO's or T-5's there will be the cost of setting up the other lights but the monthly cost with T-5's would be about 1/2- 2/3rds that of the halides along with the tank running cooler. It can also be easier to get the color you like with T-5's than it is with the halides. You should run individual refletors on the T-5 bulbs also. I think the 75 gallon is like 21 inches deep so you should be able to keep anything you would like all the way down to the bottom of the tank. Here are a couple of links that The Grim Reefer did on T-5's on RC.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=918935&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=724967

Hope this helps

Scott

[dorkfish]

So you got rid of your MH fixtures??? Why don't you jsut get different bulbs... Going from MH to T5 or VHO is a extreme downgrade..

A quality well designed T5 fixture can be just as good as a MH...

[schigara]

Yeah, I already gave the MH's to a friend. I never used a chiller before. I had a big house fan blowing in the back of the canopy that kept the temp at 80F with the ambient in the room of 76F.

I shouldnt have any problem with the temps now. My house has awesome A/C. I keep the temp in the house at 70 and it stays at 70 in even though it is 107 outside with the heat index. I placed the tank in a room away from any windows and a vent directly above it.

The VHO's at the LFS were typical sized bulbs and the T5's i have seen are really skinny, small diameter bulbs. What's the main difference in the two?

[ooja3k]

Check this link out...

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/pic/article.cfm?acatid=287&aid=350

[archer772]

T-5's when set up properly will put twice the useable light into the tank and about twice as deep. Anotherwords they will be about the same as the MH. The way I would describe it is the par from PC's will only penatrate about 8 inches, VHO's about 12-15 inches and T-5's about 20-24 inches or at least they will start to drop off alot at those distances

[schigara]

OOj and archer, thanks for the link and the info about depth. I will definitely go with T5's.

What would you guys recommend about how many and what colors of the bulbs?

4x T5's or 6x T5's. More is better? And what combination of daylight and actinics?

Thanks again for the advice! I still wonder how the average hobbyist ever managed a Marine tank before the advent of the internet.

[archer772]

If you dont want to be limited on what you keep I would go with 6 bulb set up and as far as bulb selection goes it depends on what color you like but I think 3 54W T5 Aquablue Plus 11K Giesemann PowerChrome Bulb 48inch,
1 54W 6500K GE Starcoat Daylight T5 HO 48inch and
2 54W UVL Super Actinic 420nm. The blueplus bulbs are a crisp white and the GE starcoat is a little on the yellow side, you could also trade one of the blueplus's for another actinic if you like your task a little bluer

[schigara]

Archer, I got the PM link.

Just to be sure, a Maxima clam will do fine under T5 at 20in depth?

I have read that coraline grows faster and in better color under actinics than just the yellowish MH's I had before so keeping a clam and to have excellent coraline growth is possible with the T5 config you mentioned?

[archer772]

I have 2 maxima's and 1 crocea at about 20 inches and they are doing fine and growing. If you are going to be running a DSB in the tank then they will only be like 16-18 inches and they will do fine. I know this will sound strange but any corals that you put in will need to be started out at the bottm and then worked up. I put a acro in both of my tanks and the one under the MH did just fine but the one I put under my T-5's I cooked and I got them both from the same guy at the same time, so dont let those little tubes fool you they do pack a punch

[archer772]

I believe so, I cant even see thru the ends of my tank do to the coraline and I even scrape it off in sheets to help people seed there tank once in awhile




Just to be sure, a Maxima clam will do fine under T5 at 20in depth?

I have read that coraline grows faster and in better color under actinics than just the yellowish MH's I had before so keeping a clam and to have excellent coraline growth is possible with the T5 config you mentioned?[/QUOTE]

[ooja3k]

Archer, you sound like you know what your talking about!! Good advice so far, i was not thinking about the situation with this lighting thoroughly...

I have a question for you..

I currently have a 36" nova extreme t5 fixture... Im guessing the bulbs it came with aren't as good as they could be. what bulbs would you reccomend to replace the ones that came "stock"?? It is a 4 bulb fixture.. Would you reccomend ditching one of the 10000ks and go with an additional actinic?? if so what kinds??

I really appreciate your help!

[schigara]

Alright, I guess I am good to go and order some lights.

I just filled the tank with RO/DI and got the salt in today and started cycling with pure ammonia. I am getting a used 40in tall counter current Air skimmer from my LFS but will wait till cycle is finished to run it.

Pic of my little system.

http://www.geocities.com/drcunlimited/Marine_001.jpg

[archer772]

If you check out this link it will give you the par values for the different T-5 bulbs and that should help you decide but with a 4 bulb light I would probably go with 3 Blueplus bulbs and 1 UV actinic
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=918935&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

[ooja3k]

what are par values?

[archer772]

Here are a couple pics of my tank and as you can see lots of coraline and the clams

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d195/archer772/100_0153.jpg

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d195/archer772/100_0111.jpg

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d195/archer772/coralsandshrimp003.jpg

[archer772]

The amount of Photosynthetically active radiation, measurement of the amount of photosynthetically active wavelengths in light



what are par values?

[schigara]

Those are some beautiful shots and the upper clam looks just like the one I had.

I am so relieved that I don't have to use those darn MH's!

What is that in the last picture?

[ooja3k]

What do you think of these lights...

They off higher wattage for the same bulb...

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=16768&N=2004+113907
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=16887&N=2004+113907

Those are higher wattage but low on price... My guess is that they are cheasyy lights...

My current system has these lights...
Slimpaq 460nm Actinic and 10000°K T-5 HO lamps

Are these lame lights???

If i were to upgrade... Exactly which lights would you recomend.. Links?

Thanks for all your help...

Great clams by the way

[schigara]

One more question. What are your thoughts on a UV sterilizer for a reef?

[ooja3k]

Is that last one a long tentacle plate coral?

[archer772]

Elegance Coral, most of the ones imported over the last 3- 5 years dont make it more than about 3-6 months this one is going on 2 years THANK GOD

[archer772]

I have never used one but I know people that never shut theres down. I dont think they are needed but hey thats just me



One more question. What are your thoughts on a UV sterilizer for a reef?

[ooja3k]

Archer do you have any t-5 light setup preferences? bulbs, colors etc... ?

Sorry im kind of impatient.. Im trying to overcome that in this hobby...

I just want to get the best light i can out of my fixture... I don't have individual reflectors, but as far as bulbs go i want the best ones with the best set-up of color ratios...

you know what i mean?

[dorkfish]

One more question. What are your thoughts on a UV sterilizer for a reef?

Don't see a need for it... you should be QT'ing your fish wich will prevent diseases from getting in the tank in the first place.

[archer772]

There are alot of us here in MI that are useing the T-5's and we have tried alot of different brand bulbs and the colors seem to be just as good as any other brand but most of the guys I talk to and myself included are useing IC 660 ballasts and the cheaper bulbs dont last as long as what I would call the name brand bulbs. The IC 660 will overdrive the 54 watt bulbs to about 85 watts each and we still get up to 2 years out of the white and blue bulbs and about 18 months out of the actinic bulbs, I know of some that have gone 3 years on there white and blue bulbs without any problems. When you change out your bulbs I think 3 of the D&D Giesmen Blueplus and 1 UV Actinic would give you a nice color but if you dont like alot of blue then go with all of the Blueplus, if you like alot of blue then try trading 1 of the blueplus bulbs for a UV 14k Aquablue bulbs. Here is a link to a site with the bulb brands that most of us use.
https://diyreef.authsecure.com/shop/index.php?cPath=55_59&osCsid=7beb230c213c79f0f7995b47261b87b8
Dr Foster and Smith is carrying VHO T-5's that are 85 watts and there are some of us out here that are trying them but I havent heard anything yet so the jury is still out on them but with how long the bulbs last I will be sticking with the bulbs that I know are good and will last even if they do cost a little more. I tried one of the Helio bulbs and it did have good color but it burned out within about 8 months on my IC 660 and they are a different length than the rest of the T-5's.



What do you think of these lights...

They off higher wattage for the same bulb...

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=16768&N=2004+113907
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=16887&N=2004+113907

Those are higher wattage but low on price... My guess is that they are cheasyy lights...

My current system has these lights...
Slimpaq 460nm Actinic and 10000°K T-5 HO lamps

Are these lame lights???

If i were to upgrade... Exactly which lights would you recomend.. Links?

Thanks for all your help...

Great clams by the way

[Amphiprion]

I prefer ATI, GE, and UVL brands for T5 bulbs, myself. However, I tend to lean more heavily into the daylight spectrum and PAR than many others. I don't like the deep blue look, myself. I think a daylight tube (UVL Aquasun is brightest, but GE 6500K is not far behind), 2 ATI Blue+, and one UVL actinic should give you some blue color, but not be quite so overpowering--as well as giving a bit more PAR.

Any 54w T5 tube can run at 85 watts--if they are overdriven. The life span will vary between brands, but running them on an icecap ballast will make them run at 85w. I overdrive my 6 T5 tubes on my 75.

[Grins]

I'm still stuck on the part where you gave the Mhs away instead of just changing to a 14,000 or 20,000K bulb.

[schigara]

The heat was a big issue and power usage.


I'm still stuck on the part where you gave the Mhs away instead of just changing to a 14,000 or 20,000K bulb.

[Grins]

Elegance Coral, most of the ones imported over the last 3- 5 years dont make it more than about 3-6 months this one is going on 2 years THANK GOD

Yeah, they changed where they are collected. I'd love one but unless it came from the right waters I'll pass them over. Your's is beautiful.

[Grins]

The heat was a big issue and power usage.

I can understand giving them up for that. Before it sounded like it was a color issue with the bulbs. I'll keep mine until they can make LEDs shimmer and the price of them come down.

[archer772]

I am not sure that it is because of where they collect them or not, I know that Eric Boreman and a couple of others are doing some studies on them to see if they can figure out why they are dieing after they are havested.

[Grins]

I believe that it is one of the probable reasons Borneman gives for the decline of them in hobbyist tanks over the past years. They used to be one of the hardier out there, so hardy and popular that they have unfortunately become extinct in some areas or are close to it. There are other reasons of course, such as how nutrient free our tanks are becoming but I'll be happy to see them making a comeback if they begin to thrive again.