sick fish

[mackenzieam]

Is there a website or somewhere i can go to look up symptoms and see what could be wrong with my fish?

[Reefscape]

You could explain all the symptom here for us, we have a wealth of experience here and hopefully we should be able to help pin point what the issue is your experiencing...

[mackenzieam]

OK. Well I am confused because I have 3 very healthy fish and 1 that is just not looking so good. The one that is sick is one of my clowns. A couple of days ago he started hiding out in the bottom of the tank back in some rocks. He was eating for a day or two and then yesterday and today he does not even try to eat. Then also yesterday I notice that he is breathing really hard. Then this morning he looked like he was swimming sideways - not upright. I see no other physical signs.

I tested the water and all is normal.
PH 8.2
Amm: 0
No2: 0
No3: 10-15
Temp 78-80

The only thing that has changed in the tank in the past two weeks is that I added my Threadfin Butterfly in there. But he is showing no signs of aggression towards the other fish. The one clown that is sick has been hiding in the rocks since I put in the butterfly with exception of like 3 or 4 days he was swimming like normal.

Any thoughts?

TIA!

[rxdoc_85]

hello mackenzie. i'm pretty new to marine aquariums myself, but your symptoms sound familiar. it sounds like it could be the beginning stages of marine ich. the parasite has quite a unique life cycle, and one of the first parts is invading your fish's integument, and it really likes to invade the gills (hence the heavy breathing). i had a clown that i actually lost to ich, and mine did EXACTLY what yours is doing. he hid, breathed really heavily, and swam awkwardly. i tried some remedies that didn't work, but i stumbled upon a product that has seemed to work for me. it's called "coral vital" and it's form the marc weiss company. it's not marketed for ich, but you simply triple the recommended dose for the corals, and then it helps the ich organism go dormant. i was a little late and lost some fish, but some of them came out of it and now none of my fish have ich. if it is in fact ich in the next day to few days you will start to see small white specks on your clown. be on the look out for those as these are the tell-tale sign of ich. good luck!

[rxdoc_85]

ps...i forgot to mention that butterfly fish are notorious for harboring parasites, and outbreaks like this are commonly seen after adding one to your tank. it is often reccommended to set up a quarantine tank and keep them there for a while and treat them witha copper-based medication to kill any parasites before adding them to the tank with other fish. this could very well be the source of your outbreak.

[mackenzieam]

:( Well, I really hope it is not ich, but you may be right.

I did QT the butterfly, but only for two weeks and I did not medicate him during that time. He seems to be perfectly healthy.
So it's possible that the butterfly had ich and gave it to the clown? The clown has been in there for over two months and was healthy before. GRRR!
I will look at the clown when I get home from work, I hope he is doing better. Poor guy.

[HiepNotik]

yeah it does sound like ich to me as well, I lost 2 clowns due to ich, they were healthy one day and the next they would swim in one place, breath heavy, then starvation, then eventually death. I'm still new to the hobby and never QT my fish, I learned a hard lesson, and now I know better then not to QT. My tank is now Fallow (fishless) for 2 1/2 weeks because of ich, I have a few more weeks to go before I can even add fish. Hopfully when I add my new fish the ich would be long gone.

I suggest setting up a Hospital tank, and treat your clown with copper or Hyposalinity (spelling?) ASAP. If your using the copper method, be sure to have a copper test kit handy, you don't want to overdose. I personally love all types of clownfish, and to hear one sick, kindda makes me sad, yeah yeah I know its just a fish, but everyone who's in this hooby will grow to love everything in the tank. I wish you the best of luck and everything comes out good.

Hiep

[mackenzieam]

yeah it does sound like ich to me as well, I lost 2 clowns due to ich, they were healthy one day and the next they would swim in one place, breath heavy, then starvation, then eventually death. I'm still new to the hobby and never QT my fish, I learned a hard lesson, and now I know better then not to QT. My tank is now Fallow (fishless) for 2 1/2 weeks because of ich, I have a few more weeks to go before I can even add fish. Hopfully when I add my new fish the ich would be long gone.

I suggest setting up a Hospital tank, and treat your clown with copper or Hyposalinity (spelling?) ASAP. If your using the copper method, be sure to have a copper test kit handy, you don't want to overdose. I personally love all types of clownfish, and to hear one sick, kindda makes me sad, yeah yeah I know its just a fish, but everyone who's in this hooby will grow to love everything in the tank. I wish you the best of luck and everything comes out good.

Hiep

Thanks for the advice. Tonight he is completely upside down. But he did come out of the cave for like 5 minutes and tried to swim upright. I think in the morning I will see what I can do to get him out of the DT and put him in QT.

[tamableanimal]

Does the clown have a heavy slim coat? Does it have any white spots on it? Does the fish show any change in color? Does it show any other symptoms?The symptoms that you described could be anything from beginning stage of Cryptocaryon irritans. To Brooklynella hostillas, to gill flukes, to internal paracites of the swim bladder,and blood flagellant.
Remove the fish to a quarentine and I would start with treating with copper sulfate. Make sure you have a test kit for copper when treating. If the fish appears healthy you could try a fresh water dip. Which if it is gill flukes they cannot take the change. But this will have to be very short because you said that it already has excellerated breathing.
Keep an eye on your other fish as most of the causes of what you described are contagious in a manner of speaking.

[mackenzieam]

Ok, well I just got him into the QT tank. That was the easiest time I've ever had trying to catch a fish.
There are still no other visible symptoms. He is still swimming sideways and upside down and can't seem to right him self, and he is breating heavy and not eating.
Now off to the store to get some copper... maybe. Or should I do the FW dip or hyposalinity?

[mackenzieam]

Aw, I am really sad for my clown fish. Now that I have got him in QT he is having a hard time with the flow - which there is not much, just a 10G filter and a small powerhead, but he keeps getting stuck on the intake part of them.
There are still no white spots showing up, there doesn't seem to be a slime coat, or a change in color. I Really don't know what's wrong with him. :(

[HiepNotik]

are you using Copper in the QT? At this point, or from your discription, even copper would harm his condition, not sure if he can withstand copper treatment now.

[mackenzieam]

Yes, I just started using the copper a few hours ago. He does not look good.

[mackenzieam]

OK, well I woke up this morning and he is a gonner.... :(
Still don't know what happened to him, but it was quite similar to how I lost a bi-color angel a few months ago. I just really hope it doesn't happen again.

So I really do want a pair of clowns and my other one is healthy. So if I go buy a smaller clown, do you think they will mate?

[Catpicklesdog]

Just out of interest - whay is your SG and what do you use to test it?

[Grins]

It sounded like it may have been an oxygenation problem rather than ich. I'd seriously be cautious about copper in the future. It has it's place but some fish don't tolerate it well and clowns are one of them in my opinion. Copper is a poison so it isn't something that should be used as a preventative in my opinion either. QT is a good idea, but there is no need to treat all new fish when they are in QT. Put them in there yes, but only treat for problems you observe.

[mackenzieam]

Just out of interest - whay is your SG and what do you use to test it?

It is at 1.024 and I use a refractometer.

[Catpicklesdog]

It sounded like swim bladder disease to me. Sorry my suggestion has come too late but it's hard to treat it anyway without knowing what caused it.

So sorry for your loss.

You should be OK introducing a smaller clown to partner up with your other one. Just keep an eye on them as there is likely to be a bit of chasing and nipping to start with, but once the female has shown who's boss it should calm down.

[mackenzieam]

It sounded like swim bladder disease to me. Sorry my suggestion has come too late but it's hard to treat it anyway without knowing what caused it.

So sorry for your loss.

You should be OK introducing a smaller clown to partner up with your other one. Just keep an eye on them as there is likely to be a bit of chasing and nipping to start with, but once the female has shown who's boss it should calm down.

Ok, thanks!

[clown-lover]

Sorry for your loss.. I just had a fish jump out of the tank here recently and didn't discover it until the club guys were over at the house and we found this crispy dry fish next to my newly installed top off container..

[Grins]

Aww sorry to hear that Clown.