View Full Version : Noob 30 gallon cichlid tank
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 3:20 AM
Hey all,
I really want to do Cichlids in my new 30 gallon tank. All the people at the pet store have said that I could not keep them in their, due to the fact that they get to big. I want some pretty fish, instead of my plain community fish 10 gallon tank. Is this do able? And if so what are some things I need to know?
The only cichlids you can keep there are apistogrammas, Bolivian rams, blue rams or keyholes. Let us know which of those you prefer. They're suitable for community tanks. Tetras, pencilfish, small species of plecos, otos and corydoras make excellent tankmates for those fish.
:welcome: to AC!
Oh, and a reminder. Before you add fish in your tank, make sure to cycle it ensuring the ammonia and nitrites are zero with nitrates not exceeding 40 ppm for the sake of those cichlids. Apistos and rams especially are sensitive to water conditions.
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 3:34 AM
Man, all of these fish are smaller and are not as colorful as I wanted. I wanted something that looked alot like saltwater, until I can get into my own please and get a 100+ tank. I guess that keyholes and rams are the best looking fish.
Can these fish have plants in the tank? I made the mistake of setting the tank up for plants, with flourite, before I realized that I really like cichlids. If they can have plants, than I wont take all the flourite out. If they can not have plants, than I will be taking the flourite out and putting crushed coral in there.
Please let me know what else I need to know. Thanks.
Man, all of these fish are smaller and are not as colorful as I wanted. I wanted something that looked alot like saltwater, until I can get into my own please and get a 100+ tank. I guess that keyholes and rams are the best looking fish.
Can these fish have plants in the tank? I made the mistake of setting the tank up for plants, with flourite, before I realized that I really like cichlids. If they can have plants, than I wont take all the flourite out. If they can not have plants, than I will be taking the flourite out and putting crushed coral in there.
Please let me know what else I need to know. Thanks.
All the species I mentioned earlier are fine with plants. They do not uproot the plants. As far as the aesthetics is concerned, which species of apistos did you look into? There are practically over hundreds of species of apistos that exist with so many still remaining undiscovered.
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 3:43 AM
Really I just googled the names that you sent me and went to the first one on the list. I don't know all of this stuff and certainly don't know good sites to watch or look at.
the other option, for colourful 'saltwater like' fish, which is certainly doable in a 30 gallon is some small tanganyikans - shelldwellers and a calvus for instance (see www.cichlidforum.com for profiles, pics, suggested mixes)
here's a link http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=131457 to a nice 30 gallon tang tank.
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 4:15 AM
Okay, cool. I will have to look into those fish and see if the LFS has some of them. Another question is, I have a AquaClear 50 gallon filer. Is that enough?
Also, should I take the flourite out of the tank, and put crushed coral in?
what's your Ph ? (if its around 8 you can leave the aragonite, if you like it. If your Ph is around 7 - 7.5 the crushed coral will buffer it up nicely for you which the fish would, in an ideal world prefer. (personally I think the coral looks nice and natural but this is just my
I don't know the filter brand you mention so perhaps someone else can comment; 50 gallon rating sounds pretty good though.
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 2:29 PM
So, since I have to take this flourite out, should I leave the same kind of water in my tank, or should I totally do a whole new water change on it? Also, I have been told to get grade 1 crushed coral, where is the cheapest place to get that? How much should I be putting in my tank? The LFS wants like $25.00 for like 10 pounds of it I think it was. That wasn't even grade 1. Any suggestions of online places to look or somewhere else would be great. Please let me know. Thank you.
wataugachicken
03-20-2008, 5:39 PM
you don't need crushed coral at all. not only does it harden the water, but it compacts over time, catching poop and debris and messing up your water quality. if you choose to get african cichlids that like harder water, an aragonite or calcium-based sand would be healthier for the tank than the coral. if you get any new-world cichlids, just leave the flourite in. they do not need hard water.
i really think that based on what you've posted here, the people at your store really don't know much. there are plenty of small colorful cichlids that would work for your tank in combination with other fish. then again, if you want it to look like saltwater you might never find the 'perfect' one.
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 5:43 PM
Yeah, this is true. So, I am still confused about what to do with the flourite? Should I leave it in or take it out? What is the safest think to do?
Please let me know. Thank you.
wataugachicken
03-20-2008, 6:16 PM
flourite isn't going to hurt the fish. if they dig in it it'll make the water a little brown (like when you first put it in the tank) but that's it. if you really want to get rid of it, sand would be a good safe option for any fish you put in there. no need to buy it from the lfs and pay $$$ though, there are other options.
bamosherjr
03-20-2008, 6:19 PM
Okay, what other options should I look at?
wataugachicken
03-20-2008, 6:22 PM
pool filter sand, quikrete commercial grade medium sand (which i use), even play sand although that tends to be very fine and turn 'muddy'. if you aren't going to have any bottom feeders that sit on the bottom all the time and you like black sand you could even go with a sandblasting sand like Black Beauty ( i think that's the name of one brand). Or for a little more $ you could look into 3M brand sands (but still cheaper than LFS sand).
bamosherjr
03-21-2008, 6:42 PM
Okay, so this should allow the levels to be at the right levels than right? And it wont turn muddy? I think i might go with the Quickrete stuff. I noticed on their website they have three different grits(grades). Also, should i put 50 or 100 pounds of sand in?
Also, I think that I am going to be putting a plecostamus in that tank as a bottom feeder. Is this a good idea or not? I noticed that he gets picked on by my little dalmation molly as well. Not sure why.
Fishfiles1
03-21-2008, 7:57 PM
Man, all of these fish are smaller and are not as colorful as I wanted. I wanted something that looked alot like saltwater, until I can get into my own please and get a 100+ tank. I guess that keyholes and rams are the best looking fish.
Can these fish have plants in the tank? I made the mistake of setting the tank up for plants, with flourite, before I realized that I really like cichlids. If they can have plants, than I wont take all the flourite out. If they can not have plants, than I will be taking the flourite out and putting crushed coral in there.
Please let me know what else I need to know. Thanks.
if you want a "saltwater" looking fish than get ondesa barbs, when they get there color they look just like someting of finding nemo
wataugachicken
03-21-2008, 8:15 PM
buy a 50lb bag, and use maybe 10 lbs of it for the tank. you only want it 1/2 inch-1 inch deep. make sure you rinse it well outside before putting it in the tank, and do not run the filters while adding the sand.
what kind pf pleco do you have? common plecos do not belong in small tanks at all. a species that stays under 4-5 inches would be okay.
I've never had any problems with a crushed coral substrate (compacting/'catching' poop etc.) - thorough gravel vacs seem to keep it just fine.
it does harden water, but then this is what is sought, with a view to setting up a rift lake tank.
you don't need it as substrate...you can add to filter...put in in some netting, fill up about 1 third of the media compartment with it, something like that, as discussed above, if that's what you decide to go with (the tangs).
wataugachicken
03-21-2008, 8:32 PM
the cc compacting may be more of a saltwater thing where they do not mess with the substrate, but it can happen in freshwater tanks if neglected long enough.
^ yep I've seen a ton of good advice about not using it in SW alright - but I don't think the same problems apply in FW; I find it completely unproblematic, great buffer, very easy to maintain and perfect for the natural looking rift lake set-up.
bamosherjr
03-21-2008, 10:21 PM
Ha so I'm still confused about what I should get? lol. I have already spent 50 bucks on the flourite and the top gravel. So, any suggestions would be nice. I really want to get cichlids going and am trying to save money. Let me know lol.
Leave the substrate like it is, put in some plants and look for leluepi http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neolamprologus_leleupi. They are from lake Tanganyika and their yellow rivals any saltwater fish...and they are fairly easy to find. You could have a pair in a 30 gallon, and also a colony of shellies...brevis are pretty easy to come by and the sunspot brevis http://www.flippersandfins.net/neolamprologusbrevisarticle.htm are rather colorful...besides shellies are cool. Don't worry about digging with flourite, it will not cloud the water like laterite will. If you want to raise the hardness you can get a small bag of crushed coral, out some in a net bag and put it in the filter. Crushed coral will compact over time in freshwater...not saltwater. Crushed coral will disolve in freshwater that has a pH of 8.2 or less, saltwater should have a pH of 8.2 to 8.4 so the crushed coral will not dissolve. It can become a problem in saltwater if it is too deep and you don't have any livestock that sifts through it with anerobic pockets.
If you really want saltwater, why not do it in your 30 gallon? You could have some damsels, gobies, firefish...
Deb - how long are you saying the crushed coral will take to compact in FW (or did you mean SW) ? I havn't noticed this problem - admittedly I have fish that dig a bit.
it does need to be replenished after a few months i find, as the minerals leach out.
bamosherjr
03-22-2008, 10:48 PM
I was gonna do saltwater fish until I found out the cost of having freshwater fish. I was going to take all the plants out, and than I noticed to day that they are really rooting and that they are even starting to expand. So, I am going to leave the fluorite in there, get some more rocks to put in there with my wood and put some kind of fish in there. I went out and bought four mollies, and put on in there from my 10 gallon, and moved my pleco over to the 30 gallon tank as there was a lot of algae everywhere. Can I still get the fish you mentioned and put them in my tank without and problematic fights? I also have CO2 going into this tank as well in case that makes a difference. Please let me know. Thank you.
wataugachicken
03-23-2008, 11:04 AM
4 mollies is kind of pushing it for a 10g tank. they reach 3-4 inches.
bamosherjr
03-23-2008, 12:42 PM
My bad, I meant to say that I put the four mollies in my 30 and took the one molly out of my 10 and moved him to the 30. I just took some pictures this morning, or tried to, fish dont like to be still. I will upload them today after church so everyone can see.
lymabean
03-23-2008, 1:40 PM
ok, there is no reason for you to have to take out the flourite if you are not getting african cichlids.
in fact, if you get appistogramma or rams, they like softer more neutral/acidic water. IF you really want a good splash of color, Get a pair of kirbensis. They are very colorful(check my avy) and breed pretty easy. Only thing is is that they will pick a cave and chase anything that gets close to it. Better than africans, worse then appistos in that sense. Appisots can get expensive, but german blue rams come pretty cheap now adays. In a 30 you can put like 2 pairs of blues and 1 pair of kribs.
Yes you can still get the fish I mentioned without fights. You don't want 2 male leluepi though....they would fight in any sized tank...I would get 4 small ones and wait for a pair, trade in the others. The brevis will chase off any fish (no matter how large) from their shell, but won't harm them and don't go looking for trouble. Leluepi won't go looking for trouble either, but they will defend their cave. Tanganyikans in general aren't too aggressive (there are some that are).
I meant FW, it would take a long time, and your pH might be high enough to prevent disolving of the crushed coral, and your diggers are probably preventing it also. I am talking a couple of years and it doesn't always happen....depends on how often it is vacuumed, the fish you keep, and your natural water chemistry.
bamosherjr
03-24-2008, 1:43 AM
Well guys I have decided to stay with freshwater, I am not sure what I am going to do with fish for now besides my mollies and my plecostamus. I have started a thread on the photo gallery section with my pictures. Here is the link. Let me know what you think, and what other fish I should get with these. Thanks!
My Picture Thread (http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1360487#post1360487)