Moving reef from 105 to 135.... advice please

[AnnetteG]

Okay, so after a finance discussion tonight, we've decided to make this an upgrade instead of a 2nd reef tank. The 105 is beautiful, but being so tall makes it more limiting on what I can do so that's why I wanted the 6 foot 135 for another reef. However, setting up a 2nd reef would take up more money (that I could be spending on corals!) and lots more time before we could spend money on another good light or skimmer. I've been shopping used, but even used, the ones I want are pretty high.

So now the plan is to finish getting the water made and into the 135 up half or so, I guess and get the plumbing finished, which he's almost got done. Then I guess I will start moving my rocks in and figuring out the 'scape and then take most of the sand from the 105, leaving behind the small layer of play "quality" sand that was left at the bottom of it when we added the live sand. Before I start on the sand, I could move the fish into the refugium temporarily, or just aerated buckets? Then I'll move the refugium stuff into the new one - Bigger! yay!

I know my current skimmer isn't the top of the line but it does a good job and I'm sure it will be fine for the 135 at least till I can pick up a bigger one. My biggest concern is lighting. Right now I've got a 48" fixture with 2 150 MHs and 4 HO T5s suspended over the 105. I can't buy a new light yet, but we have a canopy on my husband's FW tank that we can use on the 135 and it's got 4 6 foot VHOs in it. Not sure on the wattage, but I'm sure it's pretty typical of whatever 6 foot VHOs are. Would the VHOs be enough to take care of my corals for a little while? Probably in a month I'll be able to pick up a better light, assuming I can find a good used one. This is definitely temporary as my hubby wants his lights back. LOL

The other option would be to put the 48" fixture over the 6' tank and center it and concentrate coral placement under the good lights until I can get a new fixture. I'd keep eggcrate stuff on the tank to keep the fish in.

What would you do? Any other advice on this changeover? I picked up an Iwaki 70 with the Japanese motor, I'm super excited to see how it does, since the guy I got it from said it was too much for his tank. I didn't think there was such a thing as too much flow in a reef? I've also got a Tunze 6090 for it! And I'll move my 2 Koralia 4s in.

OH and one more question. I've heard if you add 2 angels at the same time, they'll be okay living together. If I get a Flame Angel right at the time we're moving the fish, would it be okay with my Coral Beauty? One of the reasons I wanted a 2nd tank was to have a Flame. The 105 will become something else at some point. Hubby wants an octopus. I want a clown trigger. We'll discuss. ;-) Maybe a lunar wrasse. Hmmmm

Thanks in advance!

[Ace25]

Holy crap.. Iwaki70 Jap and a tunze!! I am so jealous! I just have the iwaki40 jap.

Lighting.. anyway you can use 2 or 4 VHOs as well as your 4' fixture until you get the light you want? I think the 4' MH light is better than the VHOs, but like you said, would have to center the rocks/corals. With both lights you can put the low light softies/mushrooms at the ends.

Personally, after watching my neighbors lunare wrasse, I am not impressed with them. They eat up all the snails and hermits in the tank very fast. Hmmm, tough call on the angels. I wouldn't do it myself, both are known to get stressed out/ich easily and the stress of moving into a new tank that is still going through a mini cycle more than likely as well as 2 angels in the same tank sounds like trouble. If the tank were setup for a few months and you QT'd both angels for a month, then put them in together I think you would have much better luck. You can even tank out your CB and put it in QT when you get a flame, do a little reaquascaping in the tank, and put them both in and it will be like a new tank for both.

[mandy21]

I have had zero issues with my lunare wrasse eating any snails or hermits. 2 peppermint shrimp on the other hand, they are missing. i never found any body parts so I'm inclined to think he didn't eat them.

He's also one of my favorite fish with how active he is and how colorful. I also seem to have a rare model citizen who is currently in a 30g QT with a maroon clown, humu trigger and princess parrot and there is no fighting. Odd too, since i expected there to be some so the aggressive fish went into one QT.

[Ace25]

Ya, like you pointed out before Mandy, my neighbors appears to be the Red Sea variety, so maybe they are a little different, or could be this one wrasse has issues with inverts. Definately known to happen.

[mandy21]

mine is also a red sea variety

[Ace25]

Well fine then.. keep popping my balloon.. see if I play with you anymore. Phhht. ;)

[mandy21]

haha now now, you know I'm just pointing out that there is hope that they aren't all little devils. They are known for being bullies, I just think me and one other person (I forget who it is) wound up with the rare nice gene-holding ones

[salty420]

i was going to put 2 pygmy angels in my 75g. i wouldn't hesitate trying 2 in a 135g but i would put them in at the same time. HOWEVER, that may be hard to do with being that you already have the CB and the flame should really be QT'd as they are soooooooooooo prone to ick...

[Ace25]

Pygmy's? Why those? That is what I have.. Out of all the angels, I picked it for its size alone, but I have never really liked it. It is healthy, always has been, but just a blah fish to me. I am without a doubt getting a potters again for my 68g. I know its not the ideal size, but I am known to break a few rules now and then.

[got2envy]

OMG moving from one tank to the other is alot a work..i transferred from the 40 to the 75 on monday heres what i did
first off the 75 was originally going planted FW..but that changed quickly lol did i mention that i can't keep fw planted tanks alive i dunno
i emptied it past halfway caught all the fish and moved them to my 125g FW..that was a crazy..took out the soil and plants and cleaned the tank
then i went and bought 60 gallons of natural sea water..2 trips
then i bought 80 lbs of carribsea live sand from petsmart (had a credit)
put sand in..added water halfway with the heater..waited overnight for the tank to clear
i then drained 20 gallons of water from the 40 and put them in containers
i then took my frags and corals one by one over to the 75 and put them on the sand
i then started on the live rock..i got a flat container and took the rocks out a few at a time over to the 75..rinsing them in water in bucket..luck 2 of my rock are at least 10-15 lbs each
after all rock was transferred over it was time to catch the 6 fish that was easy since there was nothing in the tank and it only had 1/4 of water
then looked for and snails, shrooms, hermits in the sand i left behind
i think sand would be a pain to transfer..all u need is a handfull of your old sand to start off your new sand so thats what i did..and it was really nasty looking after the move
wow what a long post lol but thats how i did the tank transfer
i went 3 days with just my 36" fixture and everything was fine

[salty420]

Pygmy's? Why those? That is what I have.. Out of all the angels, I picked it for its size alone, but I have never really liked it. It is healthy, always has been, but just a blah fish to me. I am without a doubt getting a potters again for my 68g. I know its not the ideal size, but I am known to break a few rules now and then.

pygmy as in dwarf, not cherub :)

[Ace25]

oh, oops, my mistake. So which 2 dwarfs are you getting? Didn't you just get 2 angels?

[salty420]

heh to quote myself...

i was going to put 2 pygmy angels in my 75g.
was being the operative word... that was before i got my 2 swallowtails :)

[AnnetteG]

Ok, so I'll work on setting up a QT asap for a Flame angel. I have a 10 gallon I'm going to attach to the system and I was thinking of putting a UV sterilizer on the outgoing of it somehow. Anyway, it'll sortof be an extra refugium. I will put the CB in there until the Flame is ready to go in the main tank. How's that?

I am moving my sand, or most of it anyway. Throwing that out goes against my bargain shopper's grain. ;) It's too full of good stuff, I can't let it go. I can rinse it in tank water as I move it though. Besides, my sand digging gobies keep it pretty stirred up and clean.

I don't HAVE to move anything right away, I can continue to fill the 135 and get it up and running and do water changes from my 105 to the 135 for the next few water changes. In May I was planning to order a small "package" from TBS, but now maybe I'll just get an extra 20 pounds or so and some of their live sand and put that in and get a cycle going and then start the move. Before we decided to move everything and I thought I was making a whole new tank, I was planning on getting the whole thing running with no skimmer and just putting carbon and a big filter sponge in before the return so it would clean up the water for a while before we could get the new skimmer, so I could just do that for a few weeks anyway. I'll take it slow and keep you guys posted on progress.

No, there's no way to use the VHOs and the 48" light together. The VHOs are a retro inside a canopy and the 48" is a whole fixture.

I traded my 110 FW for the tunze and a SEIO! Plus I got a new bucket of salt mix and 20 pounds of live rock out of the deal! :grinyes:

Then we got the Iwaki 70 for an embarrassingly cheap price the other day. :grinyes: from the guy who thought it was too much for his tank.

No one answered my ? yet about too much flow. There's no such thing, right? I mean, not like I'm going to aim the Tunze directly at the rocks or anything. :)

Oh and if I had a lunar wrasse, I wouldn't put shrimp in the tank. I'd like to have one of the smaller puffers too, so probably no snails or hermies either. Guess I'll have to actually CLEAN the tank myself. ;)

I'd also like to have an Antennarius sp. frogfish, but we'll see. Oooo, maybe I can have an eel in that tank. I think the snowflakes are so pretty. So yeah, I'll end up with a FOWLR slightly aggressive tank after all!

[mandy21]

the flame should really be QT'd as they are soooooooooooo prone to ick...

Yes. That's all i have to say about that. :angryfire:

[nycsicktank]

Yes. That's all i have to say about that. :angryfire:

make sure you do fresh water dip too :devil:

[svenkesd]

If it is possible one of the angels should be a lot smaller than the other when you add them. If you have one large angel and one small angel there is a better chance of the smaller one being female and the larger being male, then you would have less territorial issues.

[Ace25]

I thought it was the other way around, females are bigger, maybe that is just clowns. But I agree, 2 different sizes would be more ideal so you don't get too much fighting.

I would NOT hook your 10G QT to your main system, that completely defeats the purpose of a QT (isolated) tank. A UV sterilizer will NOT protect against things like ich from spreading. It will kill some of it, if it is present, but probably only around 25% at best.

Flow, no, never have too much flow.. only thing limiting on flow is getting it placed correctly so you don't get a whirlpool or sandstorm effect in your tank. I am at 68x turnover on my 29G tank, and Amp says he is at 150x turnover, and that still doesn't compete with ocean currents.

[AnnetteG]

Ace, I'll have a separate QT, I meant that I'll be hooking up another 10 gallon to the main tank as sortof an extra refugium. This is mostly for my own amusement. Good to know that about the UV thingy, won't bother then.

Have abandoned the move idea though. LOL Didn't take long! My IPSF order came today and WHOA that was SO much fun putting that stuff into my fuge! I was just thinking how much of a pain it would be to try to move everything and I know I'd still manage to lose some of the stuff that has just started to establish itself really well.....Plus, moving or not, I still have to wait a month or so before I can get the right light for the 135 and I'd still probably need a bigger skimmer, so might as well just get the water running through the 135 and make sure everything works, run carbon for a little while and hunt for deals on lights and skimmers. I think I'll put the tunze in my 105 to give it a try in there for a bit. Hehehe