Wood Shrimp problem

[tcarita]

Hi good people, i searched the forum but did not find the answer for my troubles.

First here is my Aquarium
200 Litter (53 Gal) Freshwater Aquarium, Rena Filter 1050L/H (275G/H), Aqua Clear 480L/H (125G/H), Dark stone with plant subtract
1x Betta, 1x clown loach, 1x tiger pleco, 2x Bala Shark, 7x Rasbora Harlequin, 7x white clouds, 7x Zebra Danios, 10x unidentified snakelike cat fishes, 10x cardinas japonicas
Lots of Plants from Java fen and musk and others

I bought a couple of large wood shrimps to my aquarium and they died in less than a week, i though all water parameters were ok but not, I had neglected Nitrates, my floating plants were removed and Nitrates escalated to 180 ppm.

I was really mad with myself, i don't lose a single animal for more than a year and the shrimps were darn cool...

It took me 3 weeks of daily water changes (around 20%) to drop nitrates back to 10 ppms (the lowest i can get without floating plants).

When it reached this value most of my 10 japonicas shrimps changed the skin and appeared very dynamic eating algae all the time.

So I bought 2 more wood shrimp, the first thing i noticed is that in less of 12 hours they had the colour changed from dull brown to fiery orange.
http://www.blueshark.com.pt/camarones.jpg

* top at arrival, bottom after 12h

I got really scared since the others died with that color, but they were behaving normally, i even added a current to the aquarium so they can feed better and i mesured all parameters nearly everyday.

then after 4 days the big male went blind, flying in the aquarium smashing everything and desperately going to the surface and died during the night, then female behaved normally for 2 days and now started to do the same thing. its going to die in less than 12 hours.

i went out all "mad" and after reading a lot i just went to by a copper test (25 USDs) and amazingly its Zero.

The most strange think is that i didn't even lost one single japonica and the females are full of egs, so I'm not placing another wood shrimp but i wanted to understand what hapened...

Anyone could shed light in my path?
Please :-)

--==[[ Ti/|G() C/|R|T/| ]]==--
200 Litter (53 Gal) Freshwater Aquarium
1x Betta, 1x clown loach, 1x tiger pleco, 2x Bala Shark, 7x Rasbora Harlequin, 7x white clouds, 7x Zebra Danios, 10x unidentified snakelike cat fishes, 10x cardinas japonicas
Lots of Plants from Java fen and musk and others

[thebullit]

sounds a bit strange, as ur water params seem fine and i asume they feed well and have plenty. the red colours are there natural colour when happy, so to speak.

they may of been stressed by the loaches, but saying that if they were they would of probably turned brown again. some 1 else will chime am sure.

[Gary Powers]

I've had this same thing happen and the only thing I could come to is that the Shrimp were only in the LFS for a day or so before they were sold to me. So basically they went from transport bag, to fish store to my tank in under 48hours. I'm thinking they are used to clean moving water and only gradual water parameter changes so three different (pH, temp, O2 levels, etc.) environments in 2 days killed 'em.

I've bought some since from the same store but have asked them to hold the shrimp for 5 days before I take home and since then not one has died.


hope that helps.

[tcarita]

Ok guys... could it be a feeding problem? the first days they spent some time in the currents ...if i watched them they would be piking stuff from the water, sometimes they would walk in the bottom piking stuff with the fans, because i don't have food for the shrimps i assumed they would pick from leftovers...
The japonicas don't get specifc food.. maybe i should get them.. i don't know what because the fishes eat everything really fasts, pellets, flakes, artemia or blood worm... maybe the shrimps eat other thing...

[thebullit]

heres a link with some general information on these shrimp. hope it helps

http://www.theshrimpfarm.com/bamboo_shrimp.shtml

[tcarita]

Thx I'm checking it out...

[tcarita]

Checking this site The only reason I see for the shrimp to die is probably lack of food since they were piking on the gravel frequently.

Did i starve them? :-(

[pixl8r]

It may be that they did not get enough food. However, it sounds like your tank is well established (been populated with fish for a while). Filter feeders gather food directly from the water column. The foods that they eat are microbial. It is possible that, for some reason, the food source preferred by Atya moluccensis (Bamboo shrimp) in your tank is unhealthy.

It is impossible, as outsiders with minimal information, to say what the exact problem is. It still could be environmental, metals, or other toxins (pesticides, fertilizers, unintentional environmental contaminates) that the Bamboo shrimp are more susceptible to.

Another theory stems from filter feeding shrimp being very pacific. They can be, and often are, stressed by other fish. If they do not feel comfortable (have plenty of cover, or places to hide) they can easily die from stress. I have noted that Amano shrimp are particularly resilient (for a shrimp species), when it comes to stress. I have kept Amano shrimp with multiple species of fish, successfully. But I keep my filter feeders in an invert only tank. I have read of others that have kept them with fish.

These are just some things to consider, if you are determined to keep filter feeding shrimp, of any species. I would recommend an invert, or species specific tank.

Good Luck!

[tcarita]

Ok good things to consider...

My wife would kill me if another tank apeared here at home :-)

I was realy happy with the shrimps they are very cool ... but i will drpo them frm my list

[thebullit]

i keep mine in a comunity tank with loaches bettas gouramies and others the shrimp dont get bothered by any. there is ample hidding places from my bamboos but they stay out in the open feeding.

[tcarita]

so this means something in my water that does not bother amano shrimps and other fishes kill bamboo shrimps :-(

Anyone have any idia of the Nitrate tolerance of this shrimps? 10 ppms? 20 ppms more than 20?

[tcarita]

i keep mine in a comunity tank with loaches bettas gouramies and others the shrimp dont get bothered by any. there is ample hidding places from my bamboos but they stay out in the open feeding.

what do you mean "they stay out in the open feeding" they just hang out when you give food?

[thebullit]

i dont feed them anything, just normal fish food for the rest. i have a well istablished tank and they feed from my spray outlet which i have under water pointing towards the top of a rock, they hang out there feeding. 1 got hold of a blood worm yesterday and went mad/crazy trying to get it back out of its mouth, so i guess they dont like them lol

[tcarita]

Ok.. lets just resume it:

Starvation... No... my tank as an year and is well established (maybe a bit algae too much)
Stress... No... never seen a fish bothering them, only the Betta was curiose in the first day
Copper.. No Tests = 0
Nitrates = 10/20 ppms (is this mortal to filter shrimp? i just added some floating plants to reduce it)
All other parameters = 0
PH = 7.2
Temperature 36/37
I think its other quimical propperty... i used some Algae controller long time ago and before that i used water fertilizer but it was more than 4 months before the first shrimp was introduced but maybe it is this no?

[pixl8r]

"All other parameters = 0"

Does this include other metals, and trace elements? Water alkaline/acidic?

The tank I keep mine in has pH of ~6.2, and I've kept the water more acidic.

[tcarita]

Well let me post them here:
PH = 7,4
NH3 = 0
GH = 149
KH = 80
NH2 < 0,1
NO3 = 15
PO4 3 = 0,5
CU = 0

This are the only parameters I can mesure

[Hermes]

Wait, what's your temperature? 37 Celsius?

That's rather high.

Either way, that temperature can't be right - Farenheit would be much too cold for the shrimp, and celsius would cook them. I don't know what animals 37 celsius wouldn't stress...

[Hermes]

"All other parameters = 0"

Does this include other metals, and trace elements? Water alkaline/acidic?

The tank I keep mine in has pH of ~6.2, and I've kept the water more acidic.

He mentioned the pH was 7.4 - That means the water is alkaline slightly.

Just to make sure everyone knows - pH under 7 is acidic and pH over 7 is alkaline. If this seems rude, excuse me.

[thebullit]

i think there slowly getting cooked and the gh and kh are far to high in my nderstanding as the KH sould be between 3 -10 dh, and the gh should be between 6 - 16dh

[Hermes]

i think there slowly getting cooked and the gh and kh are far to high in my nderstanding as the KH sould be between 3 -10 dh, and the gh should be between 6 - 16dh

I agree. That level of hardness is ridiculous. Are you sure you're converting your values to kh and gh units?

[tcarita]

no i'm not Sorry...I was just using the base value in mg...

Temperature 26ºC, 78.8ºF

GH = 149 = 10
KH = 80 = 4.48

[thebullit]

oh rite ok!!!!!! then am stumped to be honest. any other info that you might of m issed that could determain (sp) the problem?

[thebullit]

y is your tank temp so high?????

[tcarita]

Well,this is the temperature the store told me to maintain for all my fishes... i will be baffled if its the wrong one, maybe not that much it was the same store that sold at the same time 2 clown loaches and 4 yellow snails...

Other than that only if the plant subtract is poison to the shrimp or so other strange strange water parameter than i can't mesure..

[thebullit]

first off i would drop your temp from 36 down to 24 gradualy as that will most deff be the problem, as that is far to hot for them, but do it gradually.

[tcarita]

first off i would drop your temp from 36 down to 24 gradualy as that will most deff be the problem, as that is far to hot for them, but do it gradually.

Its not 36.. its 26 :-)

[thebullit]

arrr rite, you did state earlier that it was 36.