Finally, Brichardi Breeding

[AfroCichlid]

I've had 2 pairs of Brichardi purchased as juvies about a year ago, and I noticed today during their water change, one pair has finally spawned. This is my first successful breeding of Tanganyikan cichlids. The clutch is small, and the parents will have a heck of a time defending them against the 3 Calvus in the tank, hopefully some will survive.

[AfroCichlid]

An interesting tidbit: one Brichardi stays near the eggs at all times, but all 4 continue to school and socialize as a group. This is something I have never seen in a cichlid, and I believe is a behavior unique to Brichardi.

[nguyendetecting]

great pictures, keep us updated when they hatch.

[jm1212]

they could be siblings if the parents are allowing the others to stick around.

brichardi have a habbit of raising fry as a family. past spawns will often help their parents raise new fry. it is acctually very cool to watch.

[Pittbull]

cool afro on the spawn i have a sixsome of brichardi that should be spawning any time soon i also have some new brevis fry i should have a photo soon well goodluck on the hatching process buddy..

[Rbishop]

Congrats! I hope some of the fry make it!

[AfroCichlid]

Thanks everybody, I'll post pics as we go along. I'd love to keep them together as they would in the wild, but I think my tank is too full of predators for any to survive. I"ll remove a few once they hatch and raise them in a seperate tank.

Jon: They are most certainly siblings, they came from a tank where several generations were allowed breed and establish a colony. I'm a bit worried about the young, the parents have shown some signs of too much inbreeding, a few in the tank I got them from showed twisted mouths and other signs of genetic problems. I'll have to wait and see what these guys look like.

[jpappy789]

Congrats!

I wouldn't worry too much about the calvus getting the fry. Brichardi are known for terrorizing intruders even to the point of pushing them to one side of the tank. It's good for the fry but not always good for the other inhabitants. Just something to watch out for.

[AfroCichlid]

I think for the most part the rest of the gang knows to stay away, they give that back corner a pretty wide berth. I see the Calvus being pushed away from time to time ( they bend their sides toward the attacker, with those sharp scales exposed, and just allow themselves to be pushed around ).
BTW, today I have wrigglers. I'll have to be hatching some shrimps soon.

[jpappy789]

awesome...more pics? ;)

[BV77]

IME the brichardi will eventually take over the tank. I had mine in with some calvus and leleupi, and petricolas.....................now that tank has only brichardi, as I had to move the others out.

[AfroCichlid]

IME the brichardi will eventually take over the tank. I had mine in with some calvus and leleupi, and petricolas.....................now that tank has only brichardi, as I had to move the others out.
The 4 I have now are the only permanent resident Brichardi. Eventually I'll remove all the offspring until we get into a place we own, then I'd like to have a 100+ gallon Tang community, where perhaps a few could remain.

[AfroCichlid]

It's really tough to get a decent pic of these guys, they're all the way in the back corner behind a rock structure. They look just like little white tadpoles. They are clinging to the bottom of the tan rock, just to the left of the large pebble ( that " large pebble " is about 1/4'' ). I'll try to get some better pics later, I don't have the time to wrestle with my camera settings this morning.

[Pittbull]

cool afro congrats on the fry buddy

[Coler]

nice ! good luck with them

[nguyendetecting]

Congrats, did most of them hatch/survive? What are you going to feed them?

[HomerJay]

I don't think you'll have too many problems with other fish eating the fry. I had three plecos in my tank with no eyes after my brichardi's first successful breeding attempt. I would be more worried about the other fish in the tank.

[AfroCichlid]

Congrats, did most of them hatch/survive? What are you going to feed them? Still wrigglers today. The clutch was smallish, perhaps 40-50 eggs, it's hard to get a count on the wrigglers, they lay in a pit dug by the parents, and now and then cling to the side of the slate rock they were laid on. I plan on feeding newly hatched brine shrimp and finely crushed flake. This has always worked fine for me, though I have yet to successfully hatch and rear this species. I plan on removing most once they are free swimming and rearing them in a 20 breeder.

[AfroCichlid]

I don't think you'll have too many problems with other fish eating the fry. I had three plecos in my tank with no eyes after my brichardi's first successful breeding attempt. I would be more worried about the other fish in the tank.
They are definitely aggressive parents, but they're together with some rough fish, most of which have larger mouths than the Brichardi. So far so good, they are among the smaller fish in the tank, and everybody seems to have gotten the message. I haven't found any damage to any of the rest of the community.

[Pittbull]

hey afro didnt you say that there were calvus in there with them, if so you are so right the calvus are great fry eaters usually just hoover vacuum them right in aye and calvus just manuver side to side as to avoid or retreat from a would be attacker thats why i love em and i have em, later buddy oh yeah i am with you i would remove some of the fry..

[Pittbull]

wow afro you must be good luck buddy because i am looking at my new brichardi fry that just hatched that i didnt even know about heres some photos and whats a trip is this is my first brichardi spawn in a shell, i have had other successfull spawns but none in a shell ---

[Pittbull]

hey afro i got a tret today he is in with the shellies

[AfroCichlid]

Congrats on the fry, Pittbull. Watch those shellies with the Tret. They're mean little fish, man.

[Pittbull]

hey afro..

yeah right now the tret is just a wi one tiny right at an inch he was given to me and is being punked by my brevis, thanks buddy later..

[AfroCichlid]

Pitbull, have you witnessed your Brichardi spawn from the eggs hatching? I'm wondering how long the wriggler stage lasts. They're going on 4 days now, just developing eyes and becoming more active. I'm wondering if I should wait until the free swimming stage to feed? It's going to be a pain getting the food down to them. I tried some crushed flake today, but my intake for my sump is on that side, and it's very effective. I'll have to use a baster to get food down there. Any tips or pointers would be appreciated.

[Pittbull]

cool that is what i was going to say about the baster, try some live brine and target feed i do my multi fry that way with a old medicine bulb dropper, in the years i have had brichardi's honestly i never target fed them, when i fed the tank they would eat as well, but what you could do is step up feedings also step up water changes for the bioload with crushed flakes along with extra live brine shrimp, on the hatch stage honest with brichardi's i knew they would eventually breed for me so i never paid any attention so when i seen fry i was like cool and maybe one time i seen some eggs and a couple days later there were fry but i dont know who long the eggs were there before i noticed them now when my fronts start to breed i will pay 100% attention as for my brichardi i think of them as a cichlid guppy, but yes i am with you i would wait til they are free swimming buddy, sorry i couldnt help more my friend..

[AfroCichlid]

There are roughly 100 of these guys: Free swimmers! Feeding baby brine shrimp and crushed flake.

[jm1212]

nice!!

[Hurley]

Very cool! Keep the pictures coming!

[jpappy789]

awesome afro!

[Pittbull]

hey afro
cool buddy man those fry look sweet as for mine ah they lasted about a week the parents are very young and this was their fist hatching to my knowledge but i moved them into the 120gal with my other brichardi and well you know what happens when babies are moved, good job though..

[nagukush]

Hi Friends,

Kindly excuse me for posting my question in this thread ( I just thought mine is related and a lot of brichardi breeders here already...) Sorry again if I'm disturbing the thread...

Anyways, my brichardis are about 2 to 2.5" in size and a few seem to have paired (though I'm not really sure) - I'm feeding them Frozen Bloodworms, Freeze-Dried Brine Shrimp, Live Earthworms (cut into tiny pieces) everyday and they seem to have become quite healthy (and even a little grownup since I bought them)

Just wanted to know the following-

1. Are Brichardis Slow Growers like the Frontosas ?
2. At what size will they start breeding ?
3. How many days will it take for the eggs to hatch ?
4. Do I need to do anything to make them start breeding ?
5. Is the food they're getting alright ?

Also mine dont seem to be aggressive atall ! They dont bother the fronts and they very rarely fight among themselves... Can it be that they're finding the tank too crowded and hence are not breeding ?

Kindly guide me a little here - I'd love to see them breed soon...
Thanks again and sorry for bothering the thread...
Lots of Regards and Care to All ! :)
Kush

[Pittbull]

All seems fine for now but when they do breed all bets off and they could turn into little terrors but you do have a lot of escape routes for your other fish plus they tend to only guard a short distance.

1. No they are not slow growers..
2. Usually at an early age like 2 to 3 inches..
3. Not sure on the egg hatching rate tried to look it up and couldn't find it sorry..
4. No not at all they will get it together soon enough..
5. It is ok only if given as a treat a high protein diet will lead to bloat issues you may want to start a spirulina low protein diet as well remember what you feed the brichardi's your front's are eating the same thing.. cut back on the meats and provide some veggies and you can alternate these feedings..

[Pittbull]

Earthworms are high protein feed this as a treat sorry that is what i meant to say about the high protein diet..

[nagukush]

Hi there Pittbull,

I hope all is well and great !

Thanks a lot for the kindness and for guiding me as always...

I forgot to mention that once in a day, I also feed them Hikari Cichlid Excell - which is a high veggie - high spirulina diet - so is it ok if I feed the other protein stuff along with these vggie pellets everyday ?

Also if freeze dried brine shrimp good for my fronts and brichs ? I find that my fish just love them too much...

Kindly advice...
Thanks a lot again for everything !
Lots of Regards and Care
Kush

[Pittbull]

As long as you do it in moderation my friend i wouldn't over feed aye, as long as your giving the veggies and switching up on foods you should be ok and you can supplement with that freeze dried brine i wouldn't do it as a staple..

No worries buddy.. your doing a great job at providing for your fins..

[austinpetemo]

wait arnt brichardis a colonial species?

[jpappy789]

Ummm, kind of. Multiple broods will coexist but when it comes to breeding time it's hard to say what could happen...a breeding pair will guard a large territory viciously, so in smaller aquariums it's harder to keep a colony together.

[nagukush]

Friends, also wanted to ask - if Snails will fish eggs ? Actually I have some malaysian trumpet snails in my tank and I'm afraid that they might affect my brichardi's breeding. I mean can they enter their territory and eatup the eggs before they hatch ? Is this a possibility to be worried about ?

Kindly guide me...
Thnaks !
Kush

[AfroCichlid]

I found it impossible to get my Brichardi to NOT breed. I'm not sure what you'd have to do to keep them from getting it on. They do need to be of a certain age and size, males to 2" at least. It took 1 year for mine to spawn for the first time and then they were like rabbits. Other adults would observe the spawning behaviour and it set them in the mood. Soon there were 2 pairs spawning.
I feed bloodworms and Mysis shrimp every afternoon and spirulina flakes in the mornings. Most Tangs are carnivores or at least omnivores but should have some ruffage. Spirulaina flakes work well for this.

[nagukush]

I found it impossible to get my Brichardi to NOT breed. I'm not sure what you'd have to do to keep them from getting it on. They do need to be of a certain age and size, males to 2" at least. It took 1 year for mine to spawn for the first time and then they were like rabbits. Other adults would observe the spawning behaviour and it set them in the mood. Soon there were 2 pairs spawning.
I feed bloodworms and Mysis shrimp every afternoon and spirulina flakes in the mornings. Most Tangs are carnivores or at least omnivores but should have some ruffage. Spirulaina flakes work well for this.

Hey Afro,

Thanks a lot for the reply and for guiding me... I just hope that mine start breeding soon ! They're about 2 to 2.5" now and I feel that 1 pair has already formed... I have a feeling that they're afraid of the fronts and are not breeding because of fear of them - is this a possibility ? They just run off like mad, at the sight of an approaching front...

Kindly advice...Thanks again !
Kush

[Pittbull]

Kush wrote:
Snails will fish eggs ?

I am assuming you meant will snails eat Brichardi eggs.. well the larger snails like apples may do some harm to plants and may poss a threat to some eggs but with Brichardi they are excellent parents and the fierce parental care they provide will never let a snail get close to the egg clutch..

In my experience as a previous Brichardi breeder the mother will fan and protect eggs in close proximity and the father will take on guard duties to the outer territory as a second layer of defense so in terms a predator will get two blasts before reaching an egg station and once the previous fry attain a certain size they too join in on the guarding patrol duties hence family harem..

Pretty amazing to watch how closely they work together..

[Pittbull]

Hey Kush their still young and may take a while to be the nasty boogers they can be in time my friend but i wouldn't worry too much they can handle themselves at an early age..

[Hurley]

What are your water parameters? I.E. Temp, pH, KH, GH, etc.? I have some crassus(similar to your fish) I have been trying to get to breed again and I haven't had any luck. I have a pair that has successfully laid eggs and raised young once but I haven't had repeat success.

[AfroCichlid]

What are your water parameters? I.E. Temp, pH, KH, GH, etc.? I have some crassus(similar to your fish) I have been trying to get to breed again and I haven't had any luck. I have a pair that has successfully laid eggs and raised young once but I haven't had repeat success.

I keep mine at 79 F. pH is 8.4. I couldn't tell you the hardness but the tapwater from Florida is pretty dang hard.

[AfroCichlid]

Hey Afro,

Thanks a lot for the reply and for guiding me... I just hope that mine start breeding soon ! They're about 2 to 2.5" now and I feel that 1 pair has already formed... I have a feeling that they're afraid of the fronts and are not breeding because of fear of them - is this a possibility ? They just run off like mad, at the sight of an approaching front...

Kindly advice...Thanks again !
Kush

I doubt it's fear of the Fronts. Their just getting themselves sorted out. You'll eventually see a male and female start to pay more attention to one another, and possibly some squabbles amongst the males. The pairs in my case seemed pretty tolerant of the other adult Brichardi in the group, but eventually would not allow them too close to their chosen area. Mine cleaned an area, with the female doing most of the work while the male wandered the territory.
The eggs took several days to hatch ( shoulda wrote it down ), and the parents were all over them.
Brichardi and Pulcher in general are very hardy and very good at reproduction. Eventually a pair will form for you and you will be overrun with all the little baby Brichardis you could want.

[nagukush]

Hi pitbull and Afro !

Thanks a lot for caring and for kindly guiding me - really-really grateful...

I guess my Temp can also be a problem - It will be great if you can help me out on this - I have a Fan installed on my Tank and when the fan is not running my temp stays between 29 C to 30 C, but when I switch on the fan the temp starts to drop and it reaches about 25.5 C and after that I switch it off (for the fear of it getting any colder). After a few hours the temp again raises to about 30 C.

I'm really confused on what to do regarding this - Switch it off and let the temp remain at 30 C or let it run continously ? Please guide me on this as my fish are subjected to constant temp changes everyday because of this confusion...

Also wanted to mention that I'm using a digital thermometer to check the temps...

My PH and Hardness seems to be good (ph above 8 and i'm using bore-well water which is normally hard) I also have lots of Shells, Coral pieces, Coral Sand. Argonite Substrate in my tank... I also use a cup of pure salt (sodium chloride) at every water change....

Kindly let me know what you think regarding this...

[nagukush]

Friends, I just found that one of my Brich pairs has spawned and I can see a group of little greenish colored egg ! Both the parents seem to take turns and seem to be 'kissing' the eggs !

The strange thing that I notice is that they're arent aggressive atall and are allowing all the fish (even the fronts) to come near their cave. They occassionally drive off other brichs but when a front appraoches, they just run away leaving the eggs at risk...

Is this normal ? From all that I've read and have been adviced, brichs would protect their eggs very aggressively, but this is really strange...

Any ideas friends ?

Kindly advice...
Regards
Kush

[austinpetemo]

are helianthus a type of brichardi??? cuz they sure look similar

[efors]

I guess my Temp can also be a problem - It will be great if you can help me out on this - I have a Fan installed on my Tank and when the fan is not running my temp stays between 29 C to 30 C, but when I switch on the fan the temp starts to drop and it reaches about 25.5 C and after that I switch it off (for the fear of it getting any colder). After a few hours the temp again raises to about 30 C.
I'm really confused on what to do regarding this - Switch it off and let the temp remain at 30 C or let it run continously ? Please guide me on this as my fish are subjected to constant temp changes everyday because of this confusion...
I also use a cup of pure salt (sodium chloride) at every water change....


Hi, nagukush!
Two things about this: 1) I don't think it is necessary to add pure salt at water changes; I would skip that.
2) 30 C is hot (86 F). That's exactly my tank's water temp during the hottest summer days. I also use a fan for the tank on most summer days, but during the most critical hours; from 2:00 pm to around 11:30 pm. This way the temp changes are not too big and aren't dangerous to the fishes.
I hope this can help you. :)

[efors]

Friends, I just found that one of my Brich pairs has spawned and I can see a group of little greenish colored egg ! Both the parents seem to take turns and seem to be 'kissing' the eggs !

The strange thing that I notice is that they're arent aggressive atall and are allowing all the fish (even the fronts) to come near their cave. They occassionally drive off other brichs but when a front appraoches, they just run away leaving the eggs at risk...

Is this normal ? From all that I've read and have been adviced, brichs would protect their eggs very aggressively, but this is really strange...

Any ideas friends ?


Kush, our tangs experts will say something about this, but IMHO, I think those brichs are not ready to be very good parents yet; because they are too young or first time parents.

[Pittbull]

And again fish can be totally different on what their supposed to do and be when lineages have been bred out, so a natural wild Brichardi could be so aggressive in terms of a killing machine and a washed out over bred specimen could be the total different..

But what i am getting at is this some fish tend to form different attitudes towards life a fish in a book could be a super aggressive species but you may have got the sissy of the bunch.. for whatever reason why your Brichardi's are not holding true to their super aggressive ways even at an early age is that you may have to wait and see what happens when they mature is all..

86F would be ok just don't let it get too much higher and do not let it get lower than 70F and an ideal range would be 80F..

[AfroCichlid]

And again fish can be totally different on what their supposed to do and be when lineages have been bred out, so a natural wild Brichardi could be so aggressive in terms of a killing machine and a washed out over bred specimen could be the total different..

But what i am getting at is this some fish tend to form different attitudes towards life a fish in a book could be a super aggressive species but you may have got the sissy of the bunch.. for whatever reason why your Brichardi's are not holding true to their super aggressive ways even at an early age is that you may have to wait and see what happens when they mature is all..

86F would be ok just don't let it get too much higher and do not let it get lower than 70F and an ideal range would be 80F..

Agreed. Count yourself lucky if they don't terrorize your Fronts. I'll wager that a few fry will survive if they make it free swimming age.
On the temp, I keep mine at 79.

[nagukush]

Hi Friends !

Thanks a lot for all the advice and guidance. The Eggs are still safe and the parents almost always stay with them. They are starting to drive away all the fishes that come near the nest but the strange thing is that they allow only one of the fronts (not the biggest one) to stay near ! I guess I'll have to just wait and watch... I really hope that atleast one of the baby survives and makes it... Anyways, I'll keep you guys updated... Thanks a lot again for being so kind and friendly :)

Regards and Care
Kush

[nagukush]

Also wanted to know if I may carryon with the regular water changes at this time, or should I wait for the babies to arrive ? Also can I feed the other fish normally ? Kindly guide me...

[Pittbull]

Yes you most definitely want to continue water changes and feedings this will aid in the fry to grow strong and survive just make sure you pulverize a few flakes to dust with your fingers to insure a supplement of food for the fry..

[nagukush]

Yes you most definitely want to continue water changes and feedings this will aid in the fry to grow strong and survive just make sure you pulverize a few flakes to dust with your fingers to insure a supplement of food for the fry..

Oh ok then. I thought that I'll wait for the eggs to hatch before doing a water change. Actually the nest is above the water level, to which I change the water so I was afraid that the eggs might dry-up when brought out of water, but anyways, I will drain less water so that the eggs remain submerged...

Also I dont have good quality flakes - I do have good quality sinking pellets (Hikari Cichlid Gold) and Tetra Bits. Can I crush these to powder and feed the powder to the young fish ?

Kindly advice regarding this...
Thanks a lot again !
Regards and Care
Kush

[Pittbull]

Try to get a hold of some omega one cichlid flake or NLS flake it would be better in the long run but to answer your question yes if you crush the pellets into a dust form, the fry will be able to eat this but wait til your fry are free swimming and lurking at the nest site before doing this..

wow a nest site is up that high if so than yeah your Brichardi's are so immature aye they should be utilizing the bottom for substrate spawning but they will get it together soon enough.. cool job yeah you dont want the eggs exposed to the air its not a good ideal..

[nagukush]

Hi Pittbull,

Yes, I'm desperately searching for a good flake food but things are SOOO hard to get here... Its really frustrating, but anyways, I guess I'm trying my best. I'll use the crushed pellets till that then...

Thanks again for guiding me as always - Also wanted to ask if you have any ideas on when I can expect these guys to hatch and become free swimming ?

Kindly advice...
Thanks and Regards
Kush

[nagukush]

Friends, I find that out of the 20 to 30 eggs that are in the nest, a few (may be 2 or 3) appear to have become a little whitish is color and are also looking a little bigger. Is this the hatching stage or is something wrong ? Kindly guide me...

Thanks a lot !
Regards and Care
Kush

[nagukush]

Friends, I just found that all the eggs from the nest are missing and only 2 or 3 of them are still there and even they've turned pure white... Have the eggs hatched or did somebody eat them ? Please advice as I'm really worried...

Kindly advice...

[nagukush]

Friends, all the eggs have now disappeared, but the parents are still guarding the nest...I'm really not sure whats happening...Please help me here... Pittbull please guide me here - need your help :(

[Pittbull]

Sorry buddy i was away i believe we are on total different times zones here.. two things may have happened one is that yep either the parents or someone robbed / ate the eggs..

Second thing could be that the eggs did hatch so maybe watch for tiny little fry near the substrate..

White eggs are usually a sign of not being fertilized or a egg that is green and turns white is fungus.. the parents need to fan the eggs to keep them from turning into fungus but as you said this is their first batch being young and immature they will go again just keep up the water changes and feed a good diet to help them out..

[nagukush]

Hi Pittbull,

Thanks for guiding me again... I'm really seeing some strange happenings in my tank...lol..

The eggs have completely disappeared and the parents arent guarding the nest as fiercely as they were, when the eggs were present... I also see that they have invited / teamed up with 3 other brichardis and are almost always hanging out together as a shoal of 5 fish near the nest... They dont attack anybody and run away from the fronts as always... The parents still go inside the nest and stay there for sometime, but I have a feeling that this batch of eggs / babies are gone forever...

Anyways, I also found another spot / cave where a single brich was standing on guard. When I used the flash light to check the ceiling, I find 2 green eggs there - I guess the other were also eaten / destroyed. I'm guessing that 2 pairs have already spawned in my tank with no survivors yet. The strange thing is that only one brich is guarding the 2 eggs and the partner is nowhere near...

Anyways, as you've adviced, I guess my brichs are still too young and learning...

Thanks a lot for all the help, Pittbull - I'm truly grateful to you...
Regards
Kush

[nagukush]

BTW is it ok to search the caves using a flash light ? I mean are the eggs / babies light sensitive and can it harm them ?

[Pittbull]

No worries me friend.. yep flash light searching is what i do as well and shouldn't pose an issue just be observant in their secrecy aye..

Give em some time and they should get it down soon..

[nagukush]

Hi friends !
I really dont think that the babies survived or if the eggs hatched... I find that the parents have completely left the nest and are allowing all the fish to go near or even inside the nest... but I have a feeling that this pair is again getting ready to spawn as they are again moving about the nest and seem to be cleaning it... Any ideas if Brichardis always lay eggs in the same spot or can they change the site at every spawn ?
Also are there any passive - less aggressive brichardi species available - if yes, can mine be those ? I'm asking this because my brichs seem to be totally peaceful and infact very afraid of other fish (the fronts)
I found that another pair had laid eggs in a nearby nest but that nest too is taken over by a small front (almost of the same size as the brichardi) and the parenst just ran away from the nest. I just found that all the eggs have again been eaten from there too...
Any ideas on this Friends ?