Curpla used as Nitrate reducer?

[widdledink]

Greetings everyone!

I have another question reguarding my high levels of nitrate.
My LFS told me last friday that I could use caulerpa (not sure if I am spelling it right) to reduce the high levels of nitrate in my tank. I wasn't sure that this would help reduce the nitrate levels all that much if at all. As I understand it, I need to have the anerobacteria (sp) growth in my tank do the work as well as frequent WC.

Is this true? Will caulerpa reduce my nitrate level? If so how much?

My reason for asking is I feel like my LFS is just after my money and not interested in helping me out with my nitrate problem. No on at the store have offered any of the suggestions that I recieved here. In fact, I have told them the info I recieved here at AC and felt as though I was teaching them.

Any info would be helpful. I don't want to give any more of my money to this store if they are lying to me.

Thanks in advance

Widdledink

[kreblak]

Well, your LFS isn't lying to you about caulerpa. Caulerpa (a marine macroalgae) requires high levels of nitrates to grow. Many people keep a refugium or a sump with caulerpa growing in it to denitrify their water. Also, tangs love to graze on it. Growing some caulerpa will help out with your nitrates, but it is not a cure all. You need to attack your nitrate problem from different angles.

To lower my nitrates, I had to switch over from crushed coral to a DSB, add 50% more live rock than I had, cut back my feeding to every other day, start skimming, and start using RO/DI water for changes and top offs after I found out that my tap water has something like 20-30 ppm of nitrates already in it! Regular water changes help, too.

[mogurnda]

Yep, Caulerpa will reduce your NO3. I prefer Chaetomorpha, which is like a green ball of spaghetti. Caulerpa occasionally "goes sexual," filing your tank with spores. Either way, I would put them in a lighted sump or refugium, like Kreblak says. Two reasons. First, you can reverse the photoperiod in the sump to stabilize the pH (more explanation upon request). Second, once Caulerpa is established in the main tank, it can become a pest.

Any aquatic plant will do the same thing. Fast growing corals, such as Xenia will remove NO3 as well. They need the nitrogen to synthesize proteins. So, unlike the anaerobic bacteria, the plants are just sequestering nitrogen, rather than turning it into N2 gas that bubbles away. To remove the nitrogen from the system, you need to harvest the plants.

[widdledink]

TY kreblak

When you switched over to the DSB did you get rid of your crushed coral? I currently have about 2.5" of crushed coral in my 75G tank. I have thought about adding an inch or so of live sand into the tank on top of my existing strata. Inaddition adding some cured live rock into the tank as well. I currently have about 20lbs of "base rock" with some choriline alge growing on it but no real LR.

[kreblak]

When I switched over my substrate to a DSB, I kept about a half an inch of crushed coral on top of the sand, and then mixed it down into the sand. I really only wanted it there for the added buffering capacity, and to seed the DSB a little bit. I tried to keep some intact shells on top of the sand for my hermits. It took around 3 weeks before I began to see a marked decrease in my nitrate levels.

Dave,
You said that the anerobic bacteria living in the deeper recesses of a DSB turn nitrates into nitrogen gas. I was under the impression that the anerobes turn nitrates into carbon dioxide gas. Do I need to re-read marine chemistry 101?

[mogurnda]

Do I need to re-read marine chemistry 101? I'm afraid you'll have to stay up late and do a little reading. The final products of carbohydrates, which are made of C, H and O, are CO2 and H20. Nitrate, on the other hand, is a result of protein breakdown (which also liberates CO2, but let's not get distracted). It is NO3, consisting of one N combined with 3 O's. There are two ways of dealing with it. One is for something (like a plant, coral or clam) to take it up and re-use it to make protein. The other is for it to find its way to an anaerobic place and be reduced to N2.

[kreblak]

Well consider me educated on the subject then. :) I don't know why I thought NO3 became CO2 anerobically. I seem to remember reading that somewhere....

HIJACK ALERT!

On a different note but same topic, are the bubbles that form in green alages the result of trapped O2 or CO2?

[mogurnda]

If you're getting bubbles on your macroalgae during the day, congratulations, you've got "pearling!" It's the formation of O2 bubbles from photosynthesis. Do a search in the plants forum. They get all excited about it.

[kreblak]

Seeing as how I have this "pearling" in my green hair algae that is trying to take over my tank, it is really hard for me to get excited over it. It's funny, though, because my blue legged hermits go sifting through the algae eating it, and every so often they release these air bubbles, which usually knocks them off the coral. I find it amusing to watch, anyway. :rolleyes:

[widdledink]

LOL @ kreblak!!!!

The few hermits I have do the same thing...but not though pearling, I just think they have problems with depth of field. They fall off my rocks all the time. I get a big kick out of it too.

You know I think I need to go back to school and get my docturate in chemistry just to understand all these chemical reactions that happen in the Saltwater environment. But it sure is fun learing without haveing to pay a university for it. :D

[kreblak]

But it sure is fun learing without haveing to pay a university for it.

I feel the same way. If you really want a hard to understand treat, get these guys going about the role of iodine in the molting process of crustacea. There is a massive thread archived here about this. :D

[mogurnda]

They fall off my rocks all the time. Mine actually dive-bomb off the rocks at dinner time. Plunk, plunk, plunk! I guess they think they'll find more food on the floor.
But it sure is fun learing without haveing to pay a university for it. Once you go off and get the degree, you'll realize that we're making it all up:D

[widdledink]

Once you go off and get the degree, you'll realize that we're making it all up.


LOL...LOL...LOL...mogurnda that is great!

Are you an Aquaist-omedian?

BTW...How do you all do the quote thing?

[kreblak]

When you reply, there is a icon labled "qoute" on each post that allows you to quote the post. There is also an icon at the top, underneath the color selection, that allows you to place any quote you like.

[slipknottin]

anaerobic bacteria is NOT responsible for the denitrifying. Anoxic bacteria is.

[widdledink]

OH!!!

I got it...Thanks kreblak

Grady

[mogurnda]

While it's true that the real issue is presence or absence of oxygen, the generic terms for the dichotomy between bacteria are aerobic and anaerobic. Anoxic tends to be used to describe the conditions rather than the metabolic pathways or the lifestyle choices of the bacteria. It's also true of our own biochemistry, in which we can use anaerobic pathways in our tissues under anoxic conditions. In an aerobic environment, the presence of oxygen tends to push reactions toward oxidation. In anaerobic/anoxic conditions, reduction is the preferred direction. Bacteria tend to be specialized for one set of conditions or the other, although some aerobic bacteria can utilize anaerobic metabolism under anoxic conditions.

At least that's how I learned it.

[kreblak]

Originally posted by slipknottin
anaerobic bacteria is NOT responsible for the denitrifying. Anoxic bacteria is.

Aren't they essentially the same thing?