Flicking off the sand...

[Kevin007]

I just added 6 rusties (1 inch) and 6 aceis (2-2.5 inch) into my 55 gallon tank to go with my yellow labs 2 days ago, I recently noticed that they occasionally rub off the sand, are they sick? what is wrong? is it normal?

I did a water testing last night because I was so concerned.

pH - 7.9
ammonia - 0
nitrite - 0
nitrate 7.5


Other then that I have a few more questions

1. Can i finally change my filter cartridge in my HOB after 3 months!? I brought a eheim 2217 last month, is it seeded yet?

2. They get along so peacefully, will this change in the future?

3. Does their sexes really matter? I know for some of the more agressive mbunas, it is better to have a 2m -1f ratio.

4. How big do these fish have to be before reaching sexual maturity?

5. Pictures comming soon!!!! :)

[blue2fyre]

My fish do this pretty often as well, as long as there is no sign of disease or distress I wouldn't worry about it

Congrats on the new additions!
As for your questions

I would think you could change your cartridge now, I'm not sure how long it takes a new filter to be seeded though

All of the fish you have in that tank are peacful for mbuna so I doubt you'll have any true aggression issues. There will be some chasing here and there but I think they should continue to get along

For those species I don't think the ratios are as inportant as it is with other species

That I'm not sure, I've heard of acei spawning at 2" but I'm really not sure about the others

Can't wait to see the pictures!!!

[Kevin007]

My fish do this pretty often as well, as long as there is no sign of disease or distress I wouldn't worry about it

Congrats on the new additions!
As for your questions

I would think you could change your cartridge now, I'm not sure how long it takes a new filter to be seeded though

All of the fish you have in that tank are peacful for mbuna so I doubt you'll have any true aggression issues. There will be some chasing here and there but I think they should continue to get along

For those species I don't think the ratios are as inportant as it is with other species

That I'm not sure, I've heard of acei spawning at 2" but I'm really not sure about the others

Can't wait to see the pictures!!!

I CAN BREATHE AGAIN!!!!! WHOO HOOO!!!

Yup they don't seem to be doing it often, just occasionally.

I'll have the pictures up by tonight. :thm:

edit: oh and I've notices my Aceis vibrating infront of another acei and my yellow labs seems to be learning this too, is this some kind of mating dance?

[blue2fyre]

It can be breeding or showing off dominance, kind of depends on what genders are involved (which is near impossible to tell with those two species lol)


My dominant acei (who I think is a male) does this pretty often too one of my other aceis, though I haven't seen any of the fish holding yet.

[Tommy Gun]

My fish do this pretty often as well, as long as there is no sign of disease or distress I wouldn't worry about it


I agree...a lot of fish do this as a show of dominance and it is usually referred to as 'flashing'. IME it is even more common to see this after adding new fish but I think your concerns are still well placed so IMO it would probably be wise to keep an eye on the fish just in case they are doing it for other reasons. Without knowing more, I'd probably say it is flashing though but keep in mind that....



All of the fish you have in that tank are peaceful for mbuna so I doubt you'll have any true aggression issues.


....all of those lists which say X-species of cichlid is aggressive, semi-aggressive, or peaceful are doing so in relative terms - meaning, even the most peaceful mbuna are still territorial and can cause a lot of problems if given the right circumstances. In fact, for a long time I had a male Yellow lab who was terrorizing some Kennyi for months and right now, I can honestly say that the most dominant fish in my cichlid tank is a rainbow shark that I've had since I started out :D Point being, there are many variables in this cichlid game so shows of dominance from "semi-aggressive" or "peaceful" cichlids are common.

[excuzzzeme]

Your yellow lab population is better served by 3f/1m ratio. There needs to be more females than males. Occasional flicking of the substrate is perfectly normal as is digging and rearranging it.

[Kevin007]

thanks for the input guys. I'll add more females to my yellow lab population depending on how things are going. Maybe I can even raise some fry and add those, who knows.

I have been watching the fish for 30 minutes and 5 fishes have done the flashing or flicking, is this too often?

I added the rusties and aceis 2 days ago. I just changed the water, water parameters are great.

My only concern is the flicking. I'm praying to god its not some kind of disease.

[Tommy Gun]

I have been watching the fish for 30 minutes and 5 fishes have done the flashing or flicking, is this too often?


I'd probably say "maybe, maybe not". Depending on when you added the fish, it may be possible that each one of them is trying to gain some dominance but on the other hand, this 'flicking' is also an indication of a parasite being present and parasites can certainly infest more than one fish at a time. While I realize that probably isn't very comforting to you but right now I think you should continue monitoring this situation closely. This way you will be able to react quickly if it turns out to be something other than a show of dominance. Or in other words, IMHO it might be too early to start dumping meds in the water.

[AfroCichlid]

Shaking is normal, as is some flashing. Mine usually flashed against sand or plants if all was well, and against rocks and other abrasive things if there were problems. Change your pad in the old filter, the Eheim's media should be rinsed in tank-water. You should rinse during every water change in tank water, and replace every 3-4 weeks. I would alternate changing the pads if you don't have seperate bio- filtration. One at a time.
Your fishes' personalities may change over time, espescially males toward each other. 1 male to 3 females is a good idea with the fish you list, and will cut down on aggression between males.

[Kevin007]

The filter floss in my HOB is getting very dirty and is falling apart. I want to change it completely, there are 2 filter floss cartridges in the HOB and ontop of that I also have the 2217. Do you think I can completely change ONE of the cartridge?

BTW ,my smallest fish, a 1.5 inch rusty has a few nips on his tail and has gone into hiding, a place where the other fishes can't go.

Should I be worried? is he gonna be ok?

and the flicking seemed to die down a bit

[snoopy65]

You can change the floss on your HOB but leave the 2217 alone. It will be fine. As far as the flashing on the sand occasionally, more than likely it is just an itch from getting use to the "new water". The vibrating is either them deciding the pecking order or "Hey baby, do ya wanna". Congrats on the new fish!

[Kevin007]

You can change the floss on your HOB but leave the 2217 alone. It will be fine. As far as the flashing on the sand occasionally, more than likely it is just an itch from getting use to the "new water". The vibrating is either them deciding the pecking order or "Hey baby, do ya wanna". Congrats on the new fish!


:evil_lol::evil_lol::evil_lol::evil_lol:

Nice! I'm still keeping a close eye on them though, slightly injured fish, flicking and what appears to be, more agression.

Pics tonight! (Sorry i didnt have time the other night)

[AfroCichlid]

Yeah, change your media out, and the next water change, siphon out some of the cleaner water in the column, and rinse the Eheim's media. Do this every water change, or once a week. You should change your pads once a month or as needed, just change one at a time, your bacteria colonies should be fine.
As for your injured fish, he may need to be quarantined until he recovers. I'm sorry I don't know the tank size we're talking about. 55? With 9 Mbuna? Is that correct? If so, you may need to add a few fish, or remove males and replace with females.

[jpappy789]

Unless your pads are really nasty I wouldn't change them out completely. Just wash them off in a bucket of tank water, saves money and bacteria...

[Pittbull]

flashing is perfectly normal if they do it here and there, when it becomes an issue is when they do it and dont stop if they have ich they will flash pretty much all the time til you can cure them, if the rusty has ripped fins than you have a fish that is picking on it and poss by its own kind.

[Kevin007]

Yeah, change your media out, and the next water change, siphon out some of the cleaner water in the column, and rinse the Eheim's media. Do this every water change, or once a week. You should change your pads once a month or as needed, just change one at a time, your bacteria colonies should be fine.
As for your injured fish, he may need to be quarantined until he recovers. I'm sorry I don't know the tank size we're talking about. 55? With 9 Mbuna? Is that correct? If so, you may need to add a few fish, or remove males and replace with females.

55 Gallon - Eheim 2217 + HOB

7 Yellow Labs (2-2.5 inch)
6 Aceis (2-2.5 inch)
6 Rusties (1 - 1.5 inch)
1 RTBS

The little rusty (1 inch) is hiding in a place the other fish cant reach, he seems to be fine, the torn fins aren't that bad, just bad enough to make him go into hiding.

They don't flick as much anymore so thats good. I've noticed some ditches in my tank, whoever the hell made them lol.

Pics asap!

[AfroCichlid]

Well, your stocklist sounds fine, you might just need to swap males for females down the road.
I agree with Jpappy's filter pad advice, mine are always falling apart after a month, so I usually change them a bit early so I can plan on alternating ahead of time. Otherwise, I've had to keep a filthy pad for an extra week just so I'm not changing both out at the same time. Probably wouldn't hurt so much depending on the amount of rock structure in the tank, but I get paranoid all the same.

[Kevin007]

The smallest rustie got bullied to death, I figured he'd be alright since he was hiding in small cracks and crevices that the others cant reach.

They seem to be bullying the smallest rustie now that the other one is dead. whats goin on, I don't notice much bullying when I'm around...

Oh and heres an update. http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1706815#post1706815

[MaryPa]

Your fish could also be just trying to stir up any left overs that might have fallen to the bottom.