Live rock/sand and fish

[Eileen]

:) Hi everyone! I'm thrilled that I found this site! I'm planning on starting my first saltwater aquarium after years of freshwater. I've been reading all I can but wanted some "live" and first hand advice. I've decided to start with a 55gal. bowfront since a long won't fit in the area I want it.

Now for the question: ;) I've been reading over and over about using live rock/sand and was planning on getting some. However in everything I've read it's said that it would be useless or at least a bit of a waste since the fish will eat all creatures on it. Obviously because of the price I wanted to find out what you thought before buying.

Also, I'ld like to know what you think would be the best filter/skimmer for a 55gal.

I'm sure I'll have many more questions but I'm gonna do some searching first so I don't overload you with questions alreay asked! :D Thanx all!

[mogurnda]

Welcome to AC, Eileen!

It depends on the fish, but a lot of your sandbed creatures will survive just fine. Some creatures wil be eaten, no matter what you have in the tank. The major reason for live rock is the presence of bacteria, so this will be fine whatever fish you have. Whatever you get, get good quality. I like aquacultured live rock (I got mine from TBS (http://www.tampabaysaltwater.com)) because of the amount and diversity of life, but there are reasons to go with Pacific live rock as well.

For a tank your size, an AquaC Remora pro skimmer would be about perfect. You don't really need any other filtration, but be sure to have lots of circulation.

[OrionGirl]

Live sand and rock are the best, and easiest filtration to have for a tank. There are some critters that frequently come in on live rock and sand that will be eaten by some fish--but it all depends on what you want. For example, a variety of crabs are frequent hitch hikers on rock, and there are many fish that will happily snack on these and other crustaceans. Ditto for many beneficial macro algaes--it all depends on the fish you want to have. Very few fish will eat all of the stuff on live rock, some won't eat any of it. You'll need to decide what kind of tank you want to setup--reef, FOWLR, aggressives, inverts, etc. From there, you can select from different types of live rock, some which will not import the smae variety of fauna, but will be cheaper and still have the good bacteria.

However, the primary benefit of live rock and live sand has little to do with the 'critters' (roughly including worms, pods, corals, crabs, shrimp, algaes), and that is the bacteria. These are essential to a healthy tank, and live rock and sand not only import them into your tank, but they provide ideal living conditions as well. The other benefits of live rock are the cover it provides for your fish, and the more natural appearance of the tank.

[kreblak]

Hello, and welcome to AC! Grab something cool to drink, sit back, and listen to my rantings and ravings, and perhaps you'll glean something worthwhile.... but I guarantee nothing!

All right first things first. You are going to need to set up your tank and cycle it. The easiest and cheapest method of doing this is fishless cycling a deep sand bed (DSB). Go to Home Depot, get some southdown or Old kastle playground sand, and fill your tank to a depth of 4 to 6 inches. Add powerheads, salt water, and your heater. Get your water's salinity and temperature straight, and toss in a cocktail shrimp or two, and wait 6 weeks.

Now, there are faster methods. The above method creates your own live sand. If you add live sand, you can expect a greatly reduced cycling time, as live sand already has a large number of bio-filter bacteria. Live rock does too. However, putting live sand or live rock into a cycling tank exposes nonbacterial critters to ammonia, which will kill off the majority of animals in your live sand/rock.

I prefer to grow my own "live" DSB using the fishless cycle method and adding detrivores and such later on. Once you have your tank cycled (zero ammonia and nitrites) you can add your live rock, hitchhikers and all. For filtration, I prefer a DSB and live rock for biological filtration, powerheads for water movement, and a skimmer to keep dissolved organics down. Low maintanance and highly effective.

[Eileen]

Thanx for the info guys! Since I've had many freshwaters I'm very familiar with the cycling process. I'm planning on a fish only with perhaps some invertabrates. (obviously with only compatable fish ;) ) I'm thinking of a banded coral shrimp, and perhaps in the future a brittlestar. But I'm definately one for taking it slow with the fish. I like to look around before making decisions. I'm glad about the live sand/rock since it really sounds like the way to go. As I said, I'm gonna do alot of searching of the site! :D

[OrionGirl]

Coral banded shrimp will likely limit your invert selection considerably. They do not like sharing space, and will kill other decorative crabs and shrimps. They've been known to tag sleeping fish as well, though this is not a frequent occurance.

[mogurnda]

I totally agree. Coral banded shrimp can be very badly behaved. Peppermint shrimp and scarlet cleaners are just as interesting, and less troublesome.

I may be in the minority, but I do believe that live sand is a lot less effective without detritivores like worms, microstars, and various amphipods, copepods etc. My suggestion is to innoculate your sand bed with some high quality live sand (not the stuff in bags), either from a supplier like TBS or GulfView, or get some samples from your LFS or reefing buddies.

[BrianH]

Your getting some great advice on the LR/stocking questions. For the protein skimmer, please tell us if you plan on using a sump. I ask because if you use a sump, you have many choices for a protein skimmer. If you go sumpless, I agree with the advice above of using an Aqua C Remora pro.

Brian

[Eileen]

I've decided to go with a reef-ready tank just incase in the future..:) So I've decided to do a sump, perhaps the Berlin with skimmer in sump. Any ideas as to quality w/out extreme cost? Thanx again for all the info!

[BrianH]

I think your making the right decision in going with a sump. For a skimmer, I would go with either an aqua C EV 120 or an Euro reef ES5-2 or 5-2. Other good brands are ETSS, My Reef Creations and Life reef. I'm pretty sure you can get the Euroreef ES5-=1 for about $198.00 shipped. This should give you an idea of the price range for skimmers in this class. I learned a while ago to buy the best skimmer you can afford. IMHO the skimmers listed above are the best made for your set up.

Brian