FH with pimples

[petluvr]

I came home tonight to find that my flowerhorn has pimples. Tank stats are
Ammo:0
Nitrites:0
Nitrates:10
Ph:8.2-what it always is:)
These stats are constant. He is about 5 or 6 inches long (I suck at measurements) and is in a 55 that he has grown up in. Tankmates are 1 M. Callainos, 1 Jewel Cichlid, 11in plec-that was supposed to be 4in
You guys have any idea about pimples? Can't get a pic right now because I have such a migraine I can barely see the screen but I will get them up tomorrow.

[excuzzzeme]

Need a picture and a better description such as color and size. Any chance it is Ich?

[Coler]

Nothing wrong with your parameters as you know (presuming accurate test kit)...pimples could a lot of stuff. I suspect you'd recognise ich yourself. Really need a pic petluvr and then hopefully we can work out some course of action. You could be looking at a whole host of things. I guess because of the type of fish involved hole-in-the-head would be a prime suspect. Is there a concentration/dispersal of pimples on the head/along the lateral lines ?

This is a great link for this disease http://www.worldcichlids.com/diseases/Adamhith.html

[petluvr]

Pics:)
I am really leaning toward HITH after reading colers article (thanks) I just don't understand how this happened water quality is always great, using API test kit BTW. i do 50% wc's at least once a week sometimes twice on this tank and I am running two penguin filters rated for 60 gallons each. Not to mention there have been NO symptoms, he was fine when I went to work and had pimples 8 hrs later.

[petluvr]

double post sorry:)

[alleykat0498]

I'm leaning towards hole in the head, because of the lateral line erosion. Since we had talked about this fish's diet just the other day I'm leaning towards poor nutrition because of its finicky eating habits. Check out the fourth post here:http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=168667.
Still want me to come and get em?

[Coler]

Yep...I'd say that's classic early onset lateral line erosion - bearing in mind the excellent water conditions reported (and no issues with tankmates i.e. no stress contributory factor) what does he eat ?

[excuzzzeme]

If it is hexamita it should respond to antibiotics and frequent water changes.

[petluvr]

He will ONLY accept frozen bloodworms. I have tried and tried to give him everything from a cichlid flake to pellets and and he simply will not eat them, I even tried not feeding him for almost a week and he still wouldn't take it.
Alleykat-pm sent.

[Coler]

Hmm...he needs some green stuff and a good cichlid pellet...the green stuff in particular.

Best way would probably be cold turkey on the blood worms, plus daily water changes. When he gets hungry, he'll eat.

What do the other guys eat ? Blood worms are bad news for mbuna.

[petluvr]

No the africans eat a flake and of course any of the bloodworms they can steal from the FH, I learned my lesson with bloat on that:) So no more bloodworms and a flake staple 50% wc's daily should that take care of the problem or should I make a trip to the LFS for meds?

[Coler]

The dilemma is that you don't want an already sick fish to starve, notwithstanding that the best way to get a cichlid to eat what you want it to eat is to deny it anything else.

That said, HITH/hexamita call it what you may is a) very quickly reversible and in pristine water would take a good old long time to become permanently disfiguring/fatal and b) does not usually, especially in the early stages, weaken a fish much.

I think your best course of action is to deny it any bloodworms whatsoever while maintaining a strict regime of daily large water changes. Hopefully within a couple of weeks it will be taking other foods. A good cichlid pellet would be great - personally I really like NLS Cichlid Formula, and your other fish will be good on that as well which makes it especially nice - together with some spirulina supplement, pellet or flake. Blanched veggies can go down nicely too but it can take longer to get them eating these.

Not sure what flake you're using - but look for something high quality which indicates it is designed for cichlids. Again, New Life Spectrum is very good all round.

[petluvr]

Would adding metronidazole or the lesser aquazole help to speed recovery along?

[Coler]

Check this link http://www.flippersandfins.net/HITHarticle2.htm

The metro is an older treatment which is now thought to be ineffective against the primary infection, but can help clear up a secondary opportunistic infection once dietary issues are resolved - I'd say it is not necessary at this point in time as your fish is very early in the disease.

I think the active ingredient in the aquazole (Seachem product right ?) is metro so same comment.

[petluvr]

Yes aquazole is basically a watered down version of metro. Thanks for the help man it is much appreciated:)

[Coler]

No prob my pleasure :)

[alleykat0498]

How's he doing?

[petluvr]

He's cool still, no visible changes but hey can't expect miracles:)

[alleykat0498]

I was mostly just wondering if you had stopped the progress, because the onset was so fast I was hoping it hadnt kept up that pace. I think he wants to stay there, mighta gotten a little miffed at the idea of leaving.

[petluvr]

Yes but I want him to leave, happy and healthy of course but gone:)

[alleykat0498]

I've had a couple of girlfriends I wanted that way as well... It shouldn't take long given the right parameters and diet he'll be good as new in no time...

[petluvr]

If his stubborn self eats, I haven't seen him take a bite in 4 days. He's probably getting a "little" hungry by now. I am such a worrier though, I am scared to death he will starve:)Even though I know he won't.

[Nolapete]

I have the same thing going on with my male festae. I ordered some food from Ken's Fish; Kens Premium 5 stick Blend and 1/2 lb. of the Meat Wafers. Should be a good mix of different foods to change the boredom from the Tetra Food Sticks they've been eating. That's all the pair I got from Dan Woodland would ever eat and so the male got them too. Moving the smaller male with the head pimples to a hospital tank tonight.

[petluvr]

It seems as though the disease is accelerating as the holes seem to be getting larger so I have started dosing Metronidazole. My schedule of WC's and dosing will be, dose one day WC and dose the next day. I am going with this schedule as WC's are what I have read will be the most important factor but WC's daily will remove meds so I hope this method works.

[Nolapete]

Diet and water changes are 1 and 2. When I read about the carbon part of it, I was quick to remove the new carbon pads I recently added. There was significant acceleration after I added them. I ordered some Metronidazole with the returns I made to foster and smith. I should have just ordered it outright. I would have had it already.

[petluvr]

I actually use Aquazole which is a "watered-down" version. I treated this same FH for Hexamita RIGHT after i got him with metro and made the mistake of just putting the powder in the tank water. Some of the powder touched him and it caused chemical burning so after some research I started using the aquazole and dissolving it first. It worked like a charm.

[Nolapete]

I ordered the tablet form and will most likely put them in the filter to dissolve them.

[petluvr]

Never seen that tablet form before. I get it at my LFS, the only thing the place is good for,:)in a powder.

[alleykat0498]

Hey bud just wondered if you got em to start taking pellets of flakes yet?

[petluvr]

Nope the FH still refuses to eat but the others are eating it up like hogs.

[alleykat0498]

Hmm, I had a chocolate cichlid refuse to eat pellets one time, and I used a clove of garlic and rubbed it all over a couple of pellet's, worked. Took a little work feeding and then netting out the mess. I also read somewhere to take a piece of garlic and toss it in the food can...

[petluvr]

Garlic is my next step:)

[petluvr]

I had to euthanize him. He was getting no better and laying on the bottom of the tank when he wasn't swimming vertically.

[alleykat0498]

Sorry to hear that, I am going through some fish issues myself. With the colder temps I cant keep my ray tank at 80, and I cant afford another heater until next week. Also my arowana has some sort of issue with his slime coat and barbells decaying. All my cool fish having issues simultaneously kinda thinking about dumping the hobby atleast until summer if not for longer. Sucks
! Sorry to hear about the loss though, and sorry I rambled about my fisssues as well. Good luck to the african tank set up though.

[petluvr]

It seems like a lot of people are having issues with disease in their tanks. Hope your fissues come out OK.

[Coler]

Sorry to hear that petluvr - likely to have been more than just HITH in my opinion as he went so quickly. Probably the HITH was just a secondary infection that came up in his already weakened state - tough break.

[petluvr]

The only "good" thing about it was that I learned NO MORE MONSTERS for me:)