need clove oil euthanasia info asap

[altabc]

What a lousy heading to hit everyone with. My Mom has a Tiger Barb that seems to have somehow been injured. I happened a couple of weeks ago. He seems to have lost his upper jaw, and now his lower jaw is involved. Mom doesn't think he is eating anymore. I just looked at him, and he is the picture of misery. She thought she might put him in a "bowl" just to observe. I dunno......

[captmicha]

I'm sorry to hear that. It's hard to see any living thing suffering. But I'm not sure what your question is. If you look up "euthanasia" and "clove oil", you'll find a lot of results. There's a lot of debate about which is the best way to euthanize a fish. Clove oil seems to be a good way since it numbs them and they won't be able to feel any pain.

[deeleywoman]

melody wrote a great post here that should help you.

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1930174&postcount=7

that said, i'm very sorry for your mom's fish. =( here's to the great river in the sky v.v

[altabc]

Thanks. I did pull some info off the net about clove oil euthanasia. I was looking for Melody's method, but couldn't find it. Thank you Deely and Melody.

[mel_20_20]

I got my information from a very helpful article written by our own AC member CT-death.

The link deely used with my directions began the discussion really, but didn't give all the info you need since the thread my quoted post came from was discussing putting a fish to sleep for a few minutes to do a procedure.

I hope you have found what you needed to know how to administer the lethal dose, but here is the article by CT-death:

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1370852#post1370852

This link gives the complete instructions. My post does describe the relatively stress free manner in which I catch the fish, though.

I wish you the best, and I'm very sorry for your difficulties and for this sad situation.

[altabc]

Hi Melody, and tank-you. (typo there, but I think I'll let it stand). We went and got some clove oil....but the poor fish died in the night. I hope he didn't suffer too much. Mom took some pictures of him. As soon as I figure out how to post them, I will. It's quite extraordinary.

[jim123]

Where can you buy clover oil?

[ccla]

I bought mine at CVS.

[Hurley]

You might have to ask someone that works there if you can't find it. At Walgreens it was behind the pharmacy counter.

[mel_20_20]

Ask the pharmacist for eugenol (you geen ahl). They keep it behind the counter, usually. It is pure clove oil. Health food stores usually have it as well.

If you ask one of the pharmacy workers there, they may mistakenly take you to the toothache section and point out the Anbesol, which has clove oil in it, but you want the pure clove oil.

A tiny bottle at the CVS here is about $3.99.

Read the article at the link I posted to get the lethal dosing information. I keep about four of the little bottles, and a turkey baster. One bottle, though small, really does have enough drops in it to be sufficient for anything other than big fish, like Oscars and such.

To render the fish unconscious I suck up a the turkey baster full of tank water, then put 1 drop with the eyedroppe into the end of the baster. I put my finger over the opening and shake like crazy so the oil is emulsified. Then drop a little at a time into the smallish container that I have the fish in, in some of his tank water. If you're doing it right it takes a few minutes to start working. At first you'll think there's not enough because he's still swimming around.

Last time I had to euthanise a betta I rescued from the lfs (he was dying of dropsy and I wanted to end his sufferiing) it took about 10 minutes for him to become unconscious; peacefully asleep on the botom of the cup. Then I used the appropriate lethal dosing by shaking up the number of drops in a 24oz bottle and then administered it slowly using the turkey baster. Once breathing stopped completely, I waited an additional 30 minutes and then put him in the freezer.

The artlcle I've included, in my post above, gives excellent detailed instructions. I strongly advise all fishkeepers to keep a supply of clove oil on hand, just in case. I can't stand to see anything suffer, and if there's no hope for providing quick relief otherwise then I will do this for the fish's sake.

[excuzzzeme]

Along with the clove oil, add some alcohol after the fish is anesthetized and going to sleep. You should first put the fish in the container and slowly add the clove oil a little at a time to not stress it further. You don't want to add needless stress but to make it as peaceful as possible. Total time should be about 60 minutes from start to finish.

[mel_20_20]

The article discusses adding the alcohol, (Vodka specifically), but I have not had to use it in my experience. As long as you use the lethal dose of clove oil it's not necessary, as per CT-death, who wrote the article.

The alcohol is the lethal component, if you choose to do it that way, administered once you have induced deep unconsciousness, but you can just use the lethal dose of clove oil. Either way, it is a humane way to help end a fish's suffering.

[altabc]

Jim; I am assuming that "clover" was a typo. I don't know if you can buy clover oil...but just in case, it's clove oil you would be after to anaesthetise or euthanise a fish.

[Fishle]

i've gotten clove oil at GNC before.

here's another article on euthanasia with clove oil and alcohol: http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm

Aquarium Products makes a euthanasia product too, which is just clove oil mixed with an emulsifier: http://www.aq-products.com/APpro/euthanase.htm

[bazil323]

There's no need to make it so complicated using alcohol and freezing after sedation. The clove oil will quickly, painlessly, and effectively kill the fish with the right amount. It's one of the reasons that we puffer keepers try not to use clove oil for sedation for trimming puffer teeth unless we're in a pinch.

When I've had to euthanize, I just used a small container that was just large enough for the fish with a little extra room and enough water to cover it (for my fish that was 3 cups or less). Then I added at least 5 drops per cup of water. The last time I did it I had about 2 cups of water and added 20 drops of clove oil. It only took 5-10 minutes for them to pass on, and they seemed very sedated after only a couple minutes.

[mel_20_20]

Here's the article by ct-death.



EUTHANASIA


First, I did not plan on having this Topic become my first article; however, I have seen many posts ask about, ‘How do you humanely euthanize a fish?’ Many of those same threads provide differing opinions on not only the methods to employ but also to its necessity…

Myths: “Fish can’t feel pain right?”
This is a very common question, and myth, but more often than not I have found that most are simply looking for some sense of reassurance that what they are proposing to do is ethically/morally okay. The truth is, however, that of course they feel pain. Fish have an intricate nervous-system, but we often don't readily see the signs of distress because fish lack the facial responses and expressions we readily associate with pain and fear typical in most animals. The reality is, if you're observant to the signs, many fish noticeably exhibit either behavioral or physical signs of affliction when they're distressed or in pain (ie. vigorous and often violent movements; color-shifts, often fading or paling in nature; and changes in normal social and other behavioral activities are all clues to their distress). Many of these same symptoms we actively use in our hobby to discover wounds, diseases or other ailments earlier than we perhaps would otherwise.

What is it, and Why do it?
euthanasia (yū'thə-nā'zhə, -zhē-ə) n.
Greek, meaning “Good Death”.
“Euthanasia is the practice of ending the life of a human or animal who is incurably ill in a painless or minimally painful way, for the purpose of limiting suffering. Laws around the world vary greatly with regard to euthanasia, and are constantly subject to change as cultural values shift and better palliative care, or treatments become available.”




- Reference: Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_euthanasia)

How do I know if my fish needs to be Euthanized?



Reasons for Euthanizing a Fish –

Irreversible Disease - Cannot be treated, such as Cancer
Major Injury - Fish cannot survive on own
Suffering – Non-treatable ailment (i.e. In some cases; old age)
Culling
NOT Reasons for Euthanizing your Fish -

Fish outgrows it’s environment, or is inappropriate for your setup
Fish becomes aggressive towards other tank-mates
Lose interest
Moving, or desire to change your tank
Any other reason given that is correctable or the cause of the owner
Methods Commonly Approved:
I would like to preface this section simply by saying that many methods are in use and that most are controversial (as is the very notion of Euthanizing), but I have only tried to list those methods deem ‘acceptable’ by most and would be considered common practices. Certainly others exist…

Freezing –
Correct Approach is to place a bowl of water into a freezer and let stand until a thin crust of ice has formed. The ice should be sufficiently formed to require one to break threw the surface. The goal is to ideally reach a Fahrenheit temperature of 29 degrees (or less). Once achieved, a fish may be placed in the bowl. Nearly instant, it is a very quick and efficient method by most accounts.

Alcohol – Is not an approved method on its own (See Clove Oil).

Clove Oil – Perhaps the most commonly employed method and very economical. This method is an anesthetic-like approach in that the Clove Oil is used first to place a fish under sleep. Ethanol-based alcohol is then utilized to euthanize the fish after the fish is unconscious.
- A Common Mistake is to mix both the clove and alcohol together, or to use a non-clear, non-grained, alcohol (colored alcohols, such as whiskeys, are not allowed to fully ferment and are thus not approved due to lack of ethanol concentrations).
- Alcohol used should be clear in nature and grain-based (commonly known as ethyl or ethanol) such as a Vodka. Although effective, vodka is still diluted, and the concentration of ethanol is deliberately reduced (25% alcohol of the total water volume is typically recommended).
- Note: Clove Oil is also lethal in 5-6x the recommended concentrations (ie. 50-60 drops per US Gallon). Also, please note; it is recommended that the fish is first placed under prior to spiking the concentrations to lethal doses.

Clove Method How-To: (Fish up to 3”)
1. Using a small clean container, filled with tank water, add approx. 1 drop of clove oil per 24oz.*, and shake vigorously. The clove oil must emulsify (will turn the water a milky white). *Remember the amount of water you use (needed for alcohol concentration below).
2. Add the fish, and check back in about 10-15 minutes. If the fish is still swimming occasionally, pre-mix a small amount of clove-oil and add this to the container. Wait again.
3. Add 20-25% volume of grain alcohol. For example, if the fish is in 8oz (240ml) of water, add 2oz (60ml) of vodka.
4. Check the fish carefully after 20 minutes. If there is no sign of gill movement after a minute, the fish has expired.
*(Fish over 3”+) Follow the above instruction, but increase the Clove Oil concentrations to 10 drops per US Gallon (or 1 drop per 13oz).



- Reference: Wisegeek (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm) & Aquaria Central

Anesthetic – By far and away the most humane is through the use of anesthetics. Many of our LFS and on-line aquarium providers offer this solution. The most commonly used product is commercially named, Finquel (Link for convenience: Finquel Aquatic Anesthetic (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=12271&c=5163+5304)). From this, any of the Methods already discussed may be used, or one can simply apply the recommended dose, wait for sedation, and then spike with approximately 3-4x the dose. The effect is the fish calmly falls to sleep, and the increased concentration simply stops their heart. No suffering.

Methods NOT Approved:
First, let me be perfectly clear that these are NOT Methods of choice, nor offer a humane approach! Secondly, I am listing these so that I can be clear on the intent for this Article, and dispel ANY notion that these can be considered humane.

Frankly, as an Aquarium Hobbyist, your first obligation is to the animals we have taken the responsibility to care for, and as such, I feel it is something we have willingly accepted the responsibility to perform in the most humane manner possible. ‘Until death do us part’, if you will.

Club or Smash – I could also include the “Blender” approach here as well for it’s shear brutality… For most, the potential loss of a pet is very traumatic, and ensuring the quick and stable hand required for this approach is hopeful at best, especially to those not only unwilling, but (hopefully) novices to this barbaric approach. Simply, too many things can go wrong, and with so many other humane approaches available there is simply no excuse to employ this method.

Flushing (Live) Fish – What can I say? Well, first off, this will not kill your fish – At least not quickly or painlessly. Taking a living fish plopping them into a bacteria infested, chlorinated toilet bowl, and pushing a lever to flush a fish simply guarantees two things: 1) That the fish will suffer a long time while it is slowly suffocated and poisoned, and 2) it ensures that the fish is “Out-of-sight, and Out-of-mind”.

Freezing (Live) Fish – There is a right and a wrong way to “Freeze a Fish.” Fish are very sensitive to temperature changes, and a few degrees can easily send a healthy fish into shock (See: Methods Approved for the ‘Right’ procedure)
Wrong Approach is to simply place an ailing fish into a bowl of water and place them into a freezer. Many employ this technique as it ‘appears’ placid. However, the reality is they are freezing to-death much like you or I would. The thrashing and ‘signs of agony’ are absent because their metabolism is shutting down, their bodily functions begin to slow dramatically, and blood recedes into their core in their futile attempt for survival. Eventually, they slip into a sleep, and die. How long does it take to make ice?

Alcohol – Is not an approved method on its own (See Clove Oil). The cause of death is by alcohol poisoning.

I hope this article can be used as a resource to more humanely address this issue. The When and Why I will leave largely up to you...



I really feel that the alcohol is not needed if you use the lethal dose of clove oil.

Note: It is also recommended that you use a drop (or in some cases two) in tank water to put him to sleep before administering the lethal dose. Also, it is of utmost importance to make sure the oil is emulsified by shaking the mixture until milky.

I made the mistake , the first time I had to do this, of adding the lethal dose, altough it was shaken and emulsified, before the fish was asleep. He darted around the cup as though the concentrated mixture was irritating or upsetting.

On subsequent ocassions I always made sure the fish is completely unconscious before administering the well shaken and emulsified lethal dose of the clove oil/tank water mixture.

I usually put the fish in the freezer after death is confirmed for two reasons: to wait for trash pickup day, and as a final assurance of death, though I know that is not necessary.*



*additional comments by Melody

[VivaLaVics]

I just want to say I'm sorry for the loss of your fishy. :(

[mel_20_20]

I got so sidetracked trying to provide all the information on euthanasia that I forgot the most important thing.

Altabc, I am so very sorry for this tragic loss. Pleae let your mom know, too, that we are all sorry for this sad loss. :(

Rest in peace little fish. :tombstone:

[altabc]

Melody, I never said "Thank-you" I do so now. It wasn't so much the loss of the fish but the "how" of the death. The article you wrote is so valuable. Thanks again.

[mel_20_20]

You're very welcome, and thank you Altabc, for your kind words. I'm grateful to have been able to help in your sad situation. The real credit goes, however, to ct-death for the original article which was a compilation of information he found on Wikepedia, Wisegeek, and AquariaCentral, and his own experience. I added my experience with this method, and there are so many others who have had to use clove oil at times.

Humane euthanasia is a very sad task, but it really is an act of selflessness, courage, and compassion. I feel compelled to share it with everyone and it gives me a feeling of deep appreciation when I see someone like you that cares enough for his fish to want to humanely end suffering.

Kudos to you for being the kind person that you are.