Fish for invert tank?

[bazil323]

I've currently got an invert only tank for breeding cherry shrimp and snails for my puffer. It's a heavily planted 20g long. The cherries have quite a colony, and the snails are doing great also. I recently added about 15 amano shrimp as well. The snails are pond snails and common ramshorns. There are also a few MTS that hitchhiked on plants.

I keep thinking it would be nice to have some small bright fish, but I just don't know what to get. I want something that won't eat the shrimp, babies or adults, or the snails. The snails are pretty prolific, so I wouldn't care too much if the fish eat the eggs since I've got lots of surface area for more eggs. I'm sure that they will be fine.

I'm bidding on some Boraras urophthalmoides on Aquabid, a group of 13. I'm wondering if they would be okay with the shrimp. There are lots of places to hide, so I guess they'd be fine. It's just that they tend to hide when I've had fish in there before (diamond tetras, neon tetras, and krib fry, each at different times).

If I don't get them, I'm thinking about corys since I've heard that they will not hunt the shrimp. But what kind and how many would be okay in that tank?

[Lupin]

There are plenty of fish that will work just fine with shrimps and snails of all ages. One simple rule when you consider keeping fish, is if something fits their mouth, they will basically eat it. In your case, if your tank is heavily planted, the chances of predation happening, is minimized. Boraras sp., corydoras, hillstream loaches (for specialist river setups only), kuhli loaches, small plecos, otos, celestial pearl danios and endlers will definitely work well here.

Currently, I keep my trumpets, bladders, pond snails, nerites, ramshorns, brigs and canas with bristlenose pleco, whiptail pleco, guppies, pearlscale goldfish and fantail goldfish. The goldfish along with a few of my apple snails will be moved to a new pond later on where I am considering a few more strains of goldfish along with the new dojo loaches.

[captmicha]

kuhli loaches

I don't know about that. I know mine would eat anything they could fit into their mouth. Especially if it moves. They're voracious.

My ottos did well w/ my shrimp and snails when I had them together. I'd say go with something strictly herbivore.

[Kuhlifan]

Kuhlis would work fine, but you probably wouldn't see them much. Also, they eat what they find on the bottom, as do your snails and shrimp, so that would make for food competition, as would cories. Nothing bad about that probably, but you're sort of overstocking a certain level of fish, if you catch my drift. A good bet would be something small, bright, peaceful and mid/high level.

Cardinal/Neon tetras would be good for this. They are a good size, color and temperment. Also, they won't touch food that has hit the substrate. So, everything they don't eat goes straight to the inverts. Another good choice would be guppies, who are small, peaceful and brightly colored. They will eat off the floor of the tank, but not exclusively. Another choice could be danios, who stay near the top. If you have no problems with the concept of the glofish, they would make a good variety of danio, as they are very brightly colored. You might also look into dwarf platys, mollies or sword tails.

[Wycco]

Kuhlis and Cory are fine with adult shrimp... Both will eat some of your shrimplets though.

I'll probably having both with my shrimp in my community tank- understanding this might cut down on the number of shrimplets I have... if your goal is to breed the shrimp though- the only truly safe fish will be Ottos.

[rainbowcharmer]

I keep guppies (just male fancies) with my cherry shrimp and snails. I'm growing my snails for my 46 gal to feed the loaches. My Yoyo's and Angelicus loaches find them superbly delicious. :)

I've never seen my Khulis eat snails, but I wouldn't put it past them. They do chew on gravel on occasion, when they mistake it for food (or perhaps it is a game?? They are fairly playful).

Good luck. :)

[Wycco]

I've never seen my Khulis eat snails, but I wouldn't put it past them. They do chew on gravel on occasion, when they mistake it for food (or perhaps it is a game?? They are fairly playful).

I think I've read some Kuhlis will take in sand and filter it for food- perhaps that's what yours are trying to do with gravel?

I've been looking into Kuhlis a lot because:
a) I love Kuhlis
b) Wanted a sand stirrer that would be safe with shrimp.

Seems the vast majority of people say Kuhlis will not eat snails... yet there are enough reports by people on the web saying that their Kuhlis did eat snails to make me a little cautious... seems you're usually safe- but there's always that small chance they could be a snailer. (either that or people bought a loach thinking it was a Kuhli but it was a different loach completely).

Everything I've read says Kuhlis will not eat adult shrimp... now the baby shrimp maybe so.

[rainbowcharmer]

In my experience, when people tell me "this fish will act like this", it normally does the opposite for me... lol

I guess I'd try them, and if they turn out to be snail eating monsters, you can always put them in a different tank (or return them if LFS allows returns). The store I usually purchase from has a 14 day return policy, if for some reason the fish do not work out (or keel over within that 14 day period). You'll know within a few days if they will be destructive or not.

And I agree - Kuhlis are fun. So are my other loaches (the Angelicus are the most playful), but they would definitely decimate your stock. :) They are not snail or shrimp friendly.

[snoopy65]

I keep ember tetra, endlers, and pygmy cory cats with my cherry shrimp with no problems.

[bazil323]

I'd been thinking about loaches in the past for a different tank, but I'm just not completely sold on them. It looks like I'm gonna be getting the Boraras urophthalmoides that I mentioned before. I put a bid on them last week, and no one else has bid on them. Auction ends tomorrow. It's kinda bad timing for me though, since we had some unexpected bills come up and payday is next week. I'll manage, but I wish I hadn't been so hasty in putting a bid on. You'd think I would learn from all the times that I think, "surely someone will outbid me" and then I actually win.

I don't think I want neons or cardinals though. I had them in wiht my cherries a while ago, but the cherries never came out when they were in there, and I'm sure they were eating the babies since the population didn't start to grow until after I sold the fish.

[Kuhlifan]

A teeny tiny shrimp may end up a kuhli snack, if for no other reason that they might just get sucked up. They'll ignore snails. Trust me, I've wished dozens of times that they would eat my bladder snail infestation. Again, a baby snail the size of a "." may get sucked up, but otherwise, no. They are one of the non-snail eating loaches. That's not to say that a few odd ones might not have a taste for snails, but I've not seen it.

They're fairly odd fish though. I've been to stores and saw them burrowing into heavy gravel. When I get them home to a nice, soft sand tank...no burrowing. I don't know why. They may or may not stir the sand for you. MTS, on the other hand, do a great job of it.

I'd LOVE it if my kuhlis would burrow around in the sand.

[bazil323]

You guys are talking me into kuhlis! If I somehow don't win the B. urophthalmoides auction, I'm going to seriously think about kuhlis. I've seen them at one of the LFSs, but I don't think they carry them all the time. How many would be good in a 20g long?

[Wycco]

In my experience, when people tell me "this fish will act like this", it normally does the opposite for me... lol

Yeah... like the puffers I naively put in my community tank when I was a teenager. Everything I've read recently paints them as aggressive monsters that will terrorise fish 3 or 4 times their size.

Mine were as docile as the hatchet fish and neons they shared the tank with. I was extremely lucky I guess.

[Hebily]

I know my kuhlis don't touch snails... but I would expect them to eat the occasional baby shrimp. It would have to be really tiny, though. in my 50, I'm looking at 12-15 being a good stock.. not sure what the footprint on your 20L would be. If I had to guess, i'd say 8-10. If you've got a lot of shrimp in there, you probabaly want less. Don't get less than 6. Honestly, I could probably stock 20 or so without a problem in my 50. Also, they burrow more when they are scared, like how schooling fish school more when scared... 1 of mine likes to hide *inside* my heater, next to the cord. Be careful of small places that they shouldn't go.

[Kuhlifan]

6-12 would be great. Never go less than six if you can help it. I stocked nine in my 20 extra tall. It has a very small footprint, but lots of vertical plants and driftwood for playing on.

[Hebily]

they love 'chillin' on top of stuff... just hanging over a stem, or cord... looking dead...

[Kuhlifan]

Yup, the one in my avatar was tiny when I first bought it. He liked to swim against the filter intake and let the suction hold him there. Then he learned how to squeeze in the intake. I came in one day to find him with a big gash behind his eye. He never went inside again. If you look close, you can see the mostly healed mark in my avatar picture.

[bazil323]

Yikes! On this tank, I just have 2 sponge filters, so that, at least, shouldn't be a problem.

[Lupin]

No reason to be cautious about kuhlis. If you are feeding them right, they will not go over anything else and I seriously have no doubts kuhlis are not predatory in nature. They are simply scavengers foraging the bottom for foods.

[bazil323]

Well, I guess the kuhli talk is for naught. I won the B. urophthalmoides auction. But given their extremely small size, I don't think I'll have a problem. But, if they are larger than I thought when I get them, I suppose I could add them to the 75g community. That tank is pretty peaceful now that I've removed the male kribs. I won't be able to get an angelfish for that tank, but that's okay.