Stocking a 20 Gallon Long Tank

[lateinningmagic]

Hey guys and girls, first post here :). I currently have a ten gallon tank with 4 goldfish (feeder fish actually) and one Trinidad Pleco. After doing a lot of research, I finally bought and set up everything and starting cycling today.

What I'm aiming for here is variety and color. I took a look at some other 20g tanks and the article for stocking smaller tanks and what I have in mind is this:

Neon Tetras 5-6
Zebra Danios 4-5
African Dwarf Frogs 1 or 2
Pleco (bristlenose?)
Snail? (Haven't really paid attention if any of my LFS carry em)
Shrimps? (Definiately saw one LFS carry em, and another one probably does too)

I really want to have a couple of ADFs in there, just to make my tank a little more unique:)

Regarding the pleco, as I mentioned above, I have a Trinidad Pleco and he's about 4inches long right now, but I know he will eventually (hopefully live that long) get too big for a 20g long. I am fascinated by Plecos and definately want one, but not if he's going to end up being miserable in there. I haven't done enough research, but I hear birtlenose plecos don't grow much bigger than 6inches? I think I even read somewhere that Gold Nugget Plecos (sp?) are good for smaller tanks? That would be awesome because I saw some at my LFS. I can probably return/trade in my trinidad pleco, a friend from middle school works there now.

Anyway, I'm quite open to suggestions so shoot away!

[zaabu2]

First off, I'm very happy that you've decided to be a responsible aquarist and do some research first. But here are some things I'm a little bit worried about:

1) I wouldn't keep the goldfish with the pleco honestly because you have the get the temperatures just right where it's cold enough for the goldfish and warm enough for the plecos. It can be done. Just make sure you get a reliable heater. Don't get cheap!
2) If you're willing to keep an eye on the pleco and goldfish, take that Trinidad Pleco back to the store for a bristlenose or a clown pleco which can only reach up to 3-5".
3) Zebra Danios and Tetras are very small fish and frogs are obviously quite large. I guarantee that in no time, you'll only end up with, at most, the frogs, the pleco, and the snail with that setup.
4) I love that you're going for colorful look. If I may, I'd love to help you pick out what you're going to get for the 20g:

5-6 Neon Tetras
5-6 Zebra Danios
3 Platys
4 Red Cherry Shrimp
Snails I suppose (Warning: They will pretty much destroy any live plants you have and like guppies, they breed like rabbits)

If there are any mistakes I've made whether it's factual or some sort of compatibility issue, PLEASE reply back. Thank you and good luck to you and your new hobby! :D

[Lupin]

:welcome: to AC!

Glad you are planning everything well. The goldfish are possibly comets or common goldfish, both of which grow to 18 inches max so a pond really is a must or you may have to upgrade to at least 75g to house them.

If you want plecos, stick to clown pleco (Panaque maccus) or bristlenose (Ancistrus sp.). The latter grows to no more than 5 inches. 4 inches is usually the norm. A 20g can house one quite suitably in the long run.

If you want snails, you could try mystery snails. All the fish you planned can fortunately tolerate at least 76 degrees Fahrenheit. I would not recommend raising it any further for your snails' sake. Please be sure your pH does not fall below 7.4 as acidic water can severely damage the shells. Avoid the trapdoor snails. There is no telling how they can outcompete other snails and fish for food as these are incredibly shy and prefer temperature no more than 74 degrees Fahrenheit. They also prefer algae above anything else although occasionally, they will take soft vegetables especially when blanched.

As for the African dwarf frog, do not confuse it with the African clawed frogs. ACFs should not have webbed front legs and ADFs have not been sold with albinism trait to my knowledge. African clawed frogs are far more agile and are predatory by nature so it is not something to consider in your plan.

If you have m\any mroe questions, please let us know and we'll help from there.:)

[lateinningmagic]

Thanks for the help guys. Just want to clear or question a couple of things:

About the ADF, according to the all knowing and reliable source wikipedia: "The African dwarf frog can range in size but most commonly are found to be 1 inch to 2 inches long; though on rare occasion there have been some that have grown up to 4-5 inches." So would it really be too big for tetras and other small fish? I've read how to tell the ADF and ACF apart (and Lupin mentioned it too), so getting it confused won't be a problem.

Snails aren't a big desire of mines, I just heard they were good to have around for cleaning the bottom. I do not want to deal with hordes of snails! There's too many in my backyard as there is.

The Goldfish aren't any sort of fancy goldfish. They were of the 10 for a $1 variety. Rosy reds I believe, so I don't think they'll get that big. What I want to do with them is keep those four in the 10gallon tank until their time expires and move the pleco (well I'll be trying to trade him in for a birstle/clown) into the 20g once its cycled.

Thanks for the suggestion guys, I really appreciate it. I'm looking up platys, and cherry shrimp and everything right now. :-D

[kyryah]

Rosy reds are minnows and goldfish are goldfish, lol. Can you post a pic for positive ID?

I agree that a ADF would be just fine with your fish, they have small mouths and prefer a diet of bloodworms. I have kept them with guppies and guppy fry with no losses.

Kristina

[lateinningmagic]

Here are some pics of the current fishies in the 10 gallon tank (minus the pleco, he's harder to photograph)

http://i40.tinypic.com/xmkffb.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/33tiioh.jpg

Here's a pic of my new 20g from last night. About 2 hours after being set up:

http://i43.tinypic.com/29c5sol.jpg

[Dexmaster]

your goldfish are comet goldfish

[lateinningmagic]

Thanks for the ID and info guys.

I'll probably be removing the cover and switching back to the screen top. I have the current cover on because the heater sticks out. But it looks like the heater isn't needed and I haven't had it since I got it so I'll switch back to the screen. The filter is the black thing on the left side and I notice the fish like to swim against the current directly in front of it, especially when I had the filter nozzle at the edge of the top of the water. The fish seem to be breathing easier since I moved the filter deeper down. They don't swim up to breath as often now and spend more time nibbling at the gravel then before. Should I move the filter it even lower and crank it up to high? It's on medium right now)

[GEV83]

You need top water aggitation to have air for your fish if the top water sits still for to long it will start gettin stagnant

[lateinningmagic]

You need top water aggitation to have air for your fish if the top water sits still for to long it will start gettin stagnant

I googled it and it gave me a "did you mean" due to a spelling error. Can you explain this more? :help:

BTW, I've taken off the old cover from the pic and put the screen on top. I also set the filter to high.

[lateinningmagic]

I'm not seeing how to edit the post, so I'll go ahead and double post to say I figured it out.

[Conski]

Dwarf Frogs are often hard to keep alive for some reason? i dk why its what ive heard and seen!

[Kashta]

Hi Latein.... from what I'm reading here, you're really trying to set up a mix of goldfish and tropicals together in the same tank. I strongly advise against doing this. Plecos, in particular, should never be kept with goldfish at all... not even bristlenose plecs. Same goes with the other fish you've named on your proposed stocking list.

If you want good advice on goldfish keeping, create a new thread for that in our General Cold & Temperate Water Forum (http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=26), where actual goldfish keepers will see your post and respond with their (more relevant) expertise. To set up a tropical tank, that discussion is best to pursue here in the Freshwater Newbie Forum.

As always, we're happy to help answer the questions you have. I applaud your efforts now to seek out reliable advice for planning purposes. Enjoy the hobby and welcome to our site. Best of luck!!

[mel_20_20]

Kashta's an expert in goldies. You will get great advice from more experts in the forum section she mentioned. In addition to the difference in temperatures required by the fish you mentioned, plecos love to suck the slime coat of goldies.

There have been many threads on AC that dealt with people having this problem. It happens after dark when the goldfish are asleep, and it causes wounds to the skin of the goldie. The pleco isn't mean, and isn't an aggressive fish, it just likes to suck on the slime coat of the goldfish.

You'll find a lot of info if you go to the General Cold and Temperate Water forum.


Welcome to AC. This is a great place to get help and advice. Glad to have you with us.

[lateinningmagic]

Thanks for the welcomes, everyone here is really friendly and great.

I think I should clear up what I plan to stock:

In the 20G I want:

Neon Tetras 5-6
Zebra Danios 4-5
African Dwarf Frogs 1 or 2
Pleco (bristlenose)
Snail? (Probably not)
Shrimps? (maybe, depends on what my lfs sells)

Right now my 20g is in the beginning stages of a fishless cycle. The 10 gallon tank currently has: 4 feeder fish (which have been IDed as Comet Goldfish here), and one Trinidad Pleco. I'm going to trade in the Trinidad Pleco for a bristlenose or for store credit if a bristlenose is not available.

I'm thinking of placing the 4 gold fish in the 20g tank once the ammonia levels hits 0 instead of manually adding in pure ammonia. Good idea? Yay or Nay? The reason I don't want to be adding in ammonia to feed the bacteria is that we only have lemon scented ammonia in the house and I actually had to borrowed pure ammonia from a neighbor. (I was really anxious to start the cycle and didn't want to go to the store :))

When the 20g is ready to be stocked only the 4 goldfish will be left behind in the 10g. I don't want them messing up the Main 20g tank as they are poop machines and not compatible with plecos. (Although they've been with a pleco for over a month now and seem fine.) I realize they will continue to grow their whole lives, but I don't know what to do with em. they were my first fishies, and if I give em away to the LFS they'll be sold as feeder fish and dead withing a week. :eek3:.

Is there anything wrong with this plan? I was also thinking of buying some tetras now and QT them in the established 10g tank, but I'm worried that 4 goldfish, a pleco, and 5-6 tetras would be too much for a 10 gallon.

I do have another 10g tank in the basement that is not being used. It has gravel and smaller plants (about 2 inches tall, from a plastic tadpole kit) but no filter. Could I move the 4 gold fish (since they are considered pretty hardy) in the spare filterless 10g and QT Tetras/Danios/ADF in the established 10g one with the pleco?

Ideas? Suggestions? Encouragement? :evil_lol:

I really appreciate all this expert help guys. You guys rock!:headbang2: