Major tank overhaul, need advice. (new-ish to plants, long post)

red_wall

red_wall

Whoosh! feel the onomatopoeia
Jun 15, 2008
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SE Georgia
Alrighty, don't laugh, but here's my tank.


tank.jpg


It looks like crap as you can see.

It went from looking half-way-decent, to being overpopulated with barely surviving plants.

Overview


What you see in the picture is around 10 separate Tiger Vals in the middle

And behind that is a red melon sword. Actually it's two now, it's made another plant.

I dose nothing and the lighting is less than 1 wpg.

I've had the tank up and running for about 4 years.
Haven't replaced the lights, ever.

The stock is 1 Albino Rainbow Shark (which I'm planning to give back to the pet store due to it's aggressive behavior, yes, yes, I know, research before you buy, but I bought him before I came to AC and learned all the goodies I know now), 9 Neon Tetras, 6 Hatchet Fish, 1 Guppy, and 1 Molly.

Driftwood

I plan on taking out that piece of driftwood in favor of driftwood my dad found on the river (I live right next to the ocean, so itt'l be a bit salty)

Here's some pictures, I'm not going to use them all.

Also, there are some pieces of not driftwood, actually plants that've been dead for a long time now, but they have bulbs on the bottom that look really cool. I was wondering if I can use them (my dad also found these on the river) They're very hard, not soft AT all, feel like wood. Could they deteriorate?



thing.jpg



This one is about 1 foot long

squarewood.jpg




This one is pretty small, 2/3 of a foot

smallwood.jpg





This one is around 1 2/5 feet


coolwood.jpg




Then this big joker that I'll have to cut down, it's 2 1/2 feet


bigwood2.jpg







None of the wood feels soft.

Anything I need to be wary of with the wood?

I'm going to boil/bake it all.









What I want to do

-I want to add more plants to this tank.
-I want to dose with dry ferts (cheaper)
-I'm thinking about a pressurized co2 system
-I'm going to be getting a canister filter.
-I'll be upgrading the lights to 4 x 26 watt CFL bulbs, DIY retrofit on my lights I currently have, to bring it up to 104 total watts, 2.2 WPG
-Add black sand
-Add Rams
-Remove Albino Shark
-Remove fake-wood
-Remove gravel

I love how the lushly planted tanks look, but I'm not looking for a whole bunch of precise monitoring 24/7. Yes, I understand testing will come with the planted tank, but dang, some setups are so PRECISE. I couldn't do that every day.

If I can't do the lush plants, that's cool, this is why I'm here.




So, what I'm asking is...


What plants would you stock in the tank.

I know barely anything about the different varietys... Well, I know some, but I have no experience with laying out the plants.

Any info on pressurized co2?

I've read up on it a lot, but I'm not sure of the parts I need.
I have DIY co2, but it's a pain to use, and I'm sure it won't hold my tank over.


Dosing regime?

I've read a few fert dosing schedules, do you know of any that work amaizngly?
Or, which do you use?


Does pressurized co2 make any noise?
All I'm imagining right now is those soda machines at fast food places. They use co2 to push the drink out and it makes "CHHHHT" sound ever 5 minutes. Does the pressurized co2 do this for tanks? It's going to be in my room, so I don't think I can sleep with it on.



Anything you might change in my plans?

If you see anything wrong, let me know.




Thanks guys. Sorry for the long post.

Oh, the time for me to do this is in about 3-4 weeks, once I get enough money.

PS:going to work in 10, so won't be back for about 7 hours. I'll be reading your suggestions and replying once I get home though!
 
Eeek. A lot of questions. You sound like you've done your research so far though.

1. Plants: If you're looking for ease of maintenance, go mid-light (1.5 to 2wpg) and stock up with mosses, anubias, vallisneria, and other easy plants. You really wouldnt even need CO2 in a tank like that (Pressurized is going to cost you about $200 to set up). Since you havent replaced your bulb in 4 years, your current lighting is waaaay under 1wpg, since flourescent output decreases over time. Personally, I think 2.2 wpg is perfect, and you're on the right path. Take a look at planted tanks on this forum and other forums to decide what you like. No one can decide what plants will appeal to you except yourself.

2. Pressurized... You'll need a CO2 canister, a regulator, a needle valve, a bubble counter, CO2 resistant airline tubing, a solenoid (optional), a reactor (canister filter will work as a reactor), and a drop checker. You can purchase kits for this, or you can piece it together yourself.

3. Dosing... Dry ferts is absolutely the way to go. Google "EI dosing" aka "Estimative Index dosing". That's what I use.

4. Pressurized CO2 for fishtanks is completely silent. No fish could survive in a soda machine.

5. More input: What substrate are you going with? Also, get a black background on there ASAP.

PS - That wood #1 laying in the grass like that reminds me of something nasty. I'd keep that out of my tank.
 
im personally scared of wild wood in the tank, alt of it will rot over time and you have a mess. if you want to use wood use mopani,malaysian or manzanita , you can also use cypress if its yellow cypress and not rotten. any wood neds to be boiled to get alot of the tannis out.

what size is the tank?

4- 26 watt compact spiral 6500k bulbs is 104 watts but not really, more like 85 watts really since the bulbs shape and reflection isnt the best with these bulbs i use them on 4 tanks now and have 6- 26 watt bulbs over a 29g and get about 2.4-2.8 wpg max, i made a reflector so im gettin alittle more than no reflector.
you may want to up the lights alot more than 4 bulbs

most the other questions are answered above,

there are alot of plants you can grow with decent ligthing even 1.5 wpg
you can go to www.plantgeek.net to find pics and plant names of what you can grow.
 
If you want to have a successful planted tank I would get these items in this order. This is if your funding allows you to.
These are only suggestions

Canister Filter $110 -$150
Pressurized Co2 system Total cost about $160 with a 5lb bottle
3M Colorquartz black sand $25 for 50lb bag
Dry Fertilizers
Lighting, 1.5 to 2.0 watts per gallon
Lots of plants

A setup like this could allow you to only dose twice a week
$10 digital timer will turn your Co2 tank on and off day and night.
 
FrostyNYC said:
Eeek. A lot of questions. You sound like you've done your research so far though.

... You really wouldnt even need CO2 in a tank like that ....

3. Dosing... Dry ferts is absolutely the way to go. Google "EI dosing" aka "Estimative Index dosing". That's what I use.

5. More input: What substrate are you going with? Also, get a black background on there ASAP.

PS - That wood #1 laying in the grass like that reminds me of something nasty. I'd keep that out of my tank.
Click to expand...

Would I really not need any co2? If so, then that comes as a MAJOR help :]

3 - I remember that one, the EI.

5 - I'm going with black sand.

PS - Yeah, I kinda thought It'd be a bad idea.



Jag1980 said:
If you want to have a successful planted tank I would get these items in this order.
Click to expand...

Thanks!


customdrum said:
im personally scared of wild wood in the tank, alt of it will rot over time and you have a mess.

what size is the tank?
Click to expand...

I'll probably keep it in there until my levels start changing, then I can take it out I guess.

The tank is a 46 bow front.
 
Sorry for the double post, but I've found the plants I'd like to use, after much research of course.


I'd like a carpet plant, but I'm not sure which.
blank.gif

Hemianthus callitrichoides seems like a good choice, but I'm wondering if it will stay in the substrate, and not grow up, just across. I'd hate to trim it every 3 days :/ Also, I'm not sure on the light requirements, plant geek has them listed as 'Medium' which gives no indication of the WPG. I'm guessing 2-3 WPG is considered medium.


Lilaeopsis mauritius is a lawn-like plant, I think it would look okay, but I'd prefer the Hemianthus over this.


The other plants

Compact Hygro (placed in a corner)
Bacopa australis (Bunched random spot)
Green Hygro (background)
Pearlweed (random bunch)
Rotala rotundifolia (bunched)
Egeri najas (bunched)
Red Tiger Lotus (centerpeice)
Possibly a few Anubias spread around

Might not use some of these further down the road.

A few questions

When dosing with dry ferts, would my requirements be lower than the recommended since I'm not going to use co2?
I've read around and found this, a dosing chart, is it right?

¼ tsp KN03 3x a week
1/16 tsp KH2P04 3x a week
1/16 tsp (5ml) Trace Elements 3x a week
50% weekly water change


Since I'm using lots of plants, is co2 is a must?

(Maybe I can just put some airline into the tank and blow bubbles to give the tank some co2 : / ... Just kidding)


I think I'm going to order my ferts from Rex Grigg (http://www.bestaquariumregulator.com/ferts.html)

Anyone have experience with him?

If you check out that page, would the fertilizer combo pack be all that I really need?

Comes with:

KNO3 (Potassium Nitrate)
K2SO4 (Potassium Sulfate)
Plantex CSM+B(Micro's? But what's in it?)
KH2PO4 (Phosphates, which I don't really want to add)



:help:


Thanks for helping me, or reading this far if you did.
I know I'm a pain, I'm an endless pit of questions.
 
red_wall said:
Driftwood

Also, there are some pieces of not driftwood, actually plants that've been dead for a long time now, but they have bulbs on the bottom that look really cool. I was wondering if I can use them (my dad also found these on the river) They're very hard, not soft AT all, feel like wood. Could they deteriorate?

No telling what those rhizomes are. Try them first in a damp boggy area of the garden.

thing.jpg



This one is around 1 2/5 feet

This looks the best. Boil it. Scrape any soft bits, then soak it in a tub in the backyard for several weeks or months. Scrape some more if your water is turning very dark.


coolwood.jpg


What I want to do

-I want to add more plants to this tank.
-I want to dose with dry ferts (cheaper)
-I'm thinking about a pressurized co2 system
-I'm going to be getting a canister filter.
-I'll be upgrading the lights to 4 x 26 watt CFL bulbs, DIY retrofit on my lights I currently have, to bring it up to 104 total watts, 2.2 WPG
-Add black sand
-Add Rams
-Remove Albino Shark
-Remove fake-wood
-Remove gravel

I love how the lushly planted tanks look, but I'm not looking for a whole bunch of precise monitoring 24/7. Yes, I understand testing will come with the planted tank, but dang, some setups are so PRECISE. I couldn't do that every day.

If I can't do the lush plants, that's cool, this is why I'm here.




So, what I'm asking is...


What plants would you stock in the tank.

I would do a few things differently. First off, black sand is beautiful, sends the PH way up usually, most of it is too sharp to have any bottom feeders in the tank, and it does nothing for your plants.

Eco-complete substrate is black, is not sharp, and contains heaps of nutrients for your plants. It is specially formulated for planted tanks. So you can replace your black sand and your dry ferts with that.



Any info on pressurized co2?

I've read up on it a lot, but I'm not sure of the parts I need.
I have DIY co2, but it's a pain to use, and I'm sure it won't hold my tank over.


CO2 is useful for the hard to grow plants. It's also an expensive pain in the *** IMO and if you have accidents with it it can kill all your fish.

I don't have CO2 and I have a beautiful planted tank. The key is picking the right plants for the environment.

With Eco-complete and a bit of supplemental ferts and your new lights you could grow these without CO2.

Wisteria
Hygrophila
Anubias (on wood)
Java fern (Windlov is a beautiful bushy plant - attach to wood)
Mosses of your choice (tie onto rocks or wood)
Green or Red tiger lotus
Bolbitus (on driftwood - grows best in the current)
most Aponogetons
most Crypts
Amazon swords
most echinodorus
fissidens

Basicly, if Plantgeek classes it as easy, low light, it will grow in the above set-up. There are heaps of choices and life will be easy and your tank will look great.

If you really, really want the hard to grow ones, get the CO2.

Anything you might change in my plans?

If you get the cannister filter I'd recommend an Eheim 2215 for a 46g tank. Get the one with the effi-substrat pro, not the 5 foam inserts.
Click to expand...

..My answers in red. Good luck.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the reply.

The sand is for marine tanks.
I have no clue if it's sharp or not.
I just looked into the eco complete, and it's 17.99 for a 20lb bag.
9.99 for shipping, which isn't bad at all. I'd say 2 bags.

I'm going to have to get what's at my LFS. I think its Eheim. Might be Fluval.
I checked the model you said and It's only 69.99, whith 5.99 shipping. Geez, shippings really been lowered.

I've decided no co2.

And I'm still thinking on dry ferts. Pretty sure I'll do them. I'm just trying to get the dosing schedule down?
 
red_wall said:
Thanks for the reply.

The sand is for marine tanks.
I have no clue if it's sharp or not.
I just looked into the eco complete, and it's 17.99 for a 20lb bag.
9.99 for shipping, which isn't bad at all. I'd say 2 bags.

I'm going to have to get what's at my LFS. I think its Eheim. Might be Fluval.
I checked the model you said and It's only 69.99, whith 5.99 shipping. Geez, shippings really been lowered.
Click to expand...

I second using eco-complete instead. I'm no expert, but glancing at marine sand seems to suggest it's not suitable for a planted aquarium. I used 2 bags of eco-complete in my 28 gallon to have a substrate depth of about 2.5 inches, so you might want to order another bag. Either that or mix it with black gravel...I did a layer of gravel on the bottom of my 5.5 gallon when I ran out of extra eco-complete. I know Foster&Smith have flat rate shipping, so you won't have to worry about paying extra for weight.

I have around the same lighting on my 28 gallon, and I have dwarg sag, anubias, Ludwigia repens, and needleleaf java fern growing very well. Crypts are beautiful as well!
 
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