filter opinions

[marcos]

im trying to decide on a new filter for my 100 gal freshwater im not verry imprest with bioweel filters which it currently has 4 im thinking of iether getting a fluval 404 with a fluitized bed filter or a wet dry any opinions would help i cant make up my mind ,my tank currently holds 1 silver arowana and i datanoides if that helps. thank you

[SayersWeb]

A properly setup and maintained wet/dry will always be better than a canister.

Why don't you like the bio-wheel filters? You have 4 of them on there?

[marcos]

well i was thinking i would use the canister filter for mechaical filtration and the fluitized bed for biological ive heard the are great for that i should refrase what i said about the bioweels its dot that i dont like them they do their job but i think i need somthing better

[NJ Devils Fan]

I would go with 2 canisters, like 2 rena filster xP3s.

[TNoFXK]

what do you suggest for my 70 gallon tank? I wanna try to save some cash

[SpellCheck]

marcos! :shake: you make the baby jesus cry with your horrible use of the english language :sad
go here before it is too late! www.dictionary.com

[SayersWeb]

Originally posted by marcos
well i was thinking i would use the canister filter for mechaical filtration and the fluitized bed for biological ive heard the are great for that i should refrase what i said about the bioweels its dot that i dont like them they do their job but i think i need somthing better If you do get a canister, I recommend you keep the bio-wheel filter running on the tank also.

[SayersWeb]

Originally posted by TNoFXK
what do you suggest for my 70 gallon tank? I wanna try to save some cash I've setup a new 120 gallon with two of these Bio-wheel 330s, at $20 each you can't beat the price -
Bio-Wheel 330 (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=3631&Ne=1020&R=7087&N=2004+22768+2147013787)

[marcos]

i dont think you guys understand my question forget it

[NJ Devils Fan]

Well, you pretty much need at least two filters on that tank. If you are going planted, then two canisters would be ideal because they do not create the surface agitation that the HOB filters create. What do I not understand, what are you asking? I thought it was an opinion on what filtration to get for your 100 gallon tank.

[marcos]

thank you for trying to answer my question my tank is a fish only tank no plants or anything im just curious which would do better id like more boilogical filtration and have heard that fluitized bed filters work good but i would need something to power it and do mechanical filtration like a canistor filter or would a wet dry be the way to go :D

[NJ Devils Fan]

I really don't know much about wet/dry filters, but if you do not have any plants and don't like biowheels, then I would go with two Aqua Clear 500 filters. One of the best power filters around.

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by SayersWeb
A properly setup and maintained wet/dry will always be better than a canister.



I'd like to know what the basis is for this statement. I don't think it's necessarily accurate.

What makes a wet/dry "better" than a canister?

Jim

[SayersWeb]

Originally posted by JSchmidt
What makes a wet/dry "better" than a canister?More media area, better biological filtration (more oxygen), more flexible.... Placing bio wheels on a canister can help I guess. You can place your heater in a wet/dry. They are easier to clean.

How often do you clean your canisters? What happens to the bio filtration capabilities when you do so? How long does it take them to recover?

What is your take on the comparison between canister and wet/dry filters?

I've had both wet/dry and canisters.... Back in the mid 80's used to build my own wet/dry systems using smaller glass aquariums (10 or 15 gallons) as the container, and custom acrylic boxes to hold the media, with external overflow boxes fed by syphon intakes. Wet/dry's were not very common back then. :)

[DeVitaf]

Another added benefit of a wet\dry is that the overflows constantly skim the suirface of the watyer catching any floating waste and debris.

[RTR]

In defense of canisters, I have never, repeat never, had any upset in biofiltration from cleaning a canister. If someone does have this happen, they are not maintaining the canister properly or they are not cleaning it correctly when they do clean.

In defense of W/Ds, they are awfully convenient for large tanks, as they scale up so nicely due to not being limited on media volume by the requirements for a sealable canister, or even worse, by the volume of a hang-on device.

But I do not consider either option "better" as a broad brush, one or the other may be better for a particular size tank or a particular setup. Both are and can be very useful filteration devices.

Fluidized beds are even good biofilters, but the technology available in the hobby is not the best or the most reliabe. To me this is not mature technology for the hobby, where canisters, HOBs, and W/Ds are - although still with room for improvement.

IMHO & IME, the best filtration scheme is likely to involve more than one filter on most tanks, and may well involve more than one type of filter. But that is customed based on the particular tank and the individual's comfort level on maintenance. Only three of my 24 tanks rely on single filters (the three shrimp breeding trial tanks, all air-driven sponge filtered). All others are multifiltered, at minimum with separate units for bio and mechanical filtration.

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by SayersWeb
More media area, better biological filtration (more oxygen), more flexible.... Placing bio wheels on a canister can help I guess. You can place your heater in a wet/dry. They are easier to clean.

How often do you clean your canisters? What happens to the bio filtration capabilities when you do so? How long does it take them to recover?

What is your take on the comparison between canister and wet/dry filters?

I've had both wet/dry and canisters.... Back in the mid 80's used to build my own wet/dry systems using smaller glass aquariums (10 or 15 gallons) as the container, and custom acrylic boxes to hold the media, with external overflow boxes fed by syphon intakes. Wet/dry's were not very common back then. :)

By wet-dry filters, are you referring mostly to a sump-based system? If so, I think they are much more prone to overflow, etc., particularly for less-experienced users, than are canisters.

I agree there is greater oxygenation with an open wet-dry filter, but I'm not sure that is a limiting factor; I've got numerous bio-only canisters (prefiltered, packed with ceramic noodles or bioballs) that seem to be pretty efficient biofilters. Other than rinsing the prefilter sponge, they rarely require maintenance. Mech filtration, beyond the prefilter, is handled elsewhere by filters that are specifically for that purpose.

There's also the weird breed of canister-based wet-dry filters, such as the Eheim 2227/9. I'd put my 2229, packed with Ehfisubstrat, up against just about any sump-based system, even one 2-3 times the size. I cannot imagine a sump-based wet-dry being more efficient (in terms of ability to oxidized ammonia/nitrite and space required) than the 2229. (And the 2229 is available with an integrated heater, I believe.) In terms of efficiency, FBFs are probably even better than any sort of wet-dry at oxidizing ammonia/nitrites.

I think sump-based filters have a place and you and RTR point out some of the advantages, but I still have a hard time seeing them as being better -- maybe more appropriate in some instances, less in others.

Jim

[RTR]

Jim - I certainly would not dispute anything you said (and I certainly like bio-only canisters :D ), but for my >275 gallon central system, a W/D is just so much simpler than multiple canisters on the system - why have it central otherwise?. Running the big tanks on multiple canisters I considered a bit much (each was a 180+ 120). I still used multiple internals for mech, but for bio I liked and still like the large W/Ds when you get much over 100 gallons or multi-tank.