Newbie Needs Help

I would check you level before you put anything in the tank... in case you wake up one morning and your son is horrified at finding a dead fish. Ive never had any exp. with loaches. I would say just go with the loach and a bottom feeder ( pleco or otto.)

i hate to say it but a 15 is too small for a gold fish. i believe stone loaches get too big for a 15 also. any other fish your son might like?

dollars4free said:

Ok

my son was given a fishtank setup kit for his birthday and to be honest after reading various bits on this forum i decided that the tank was really too small. So i collared a mate who has various saltwater tanks if he had one which he hasnt used.

Hes given me a 15 gallon tank with top, filter and pump. The thing is ive been to my local pet store and purchased more gravel and a replacement filter. Ive thoroughly washed the tank out and set everything up how my son likes it.

Ive had the tank running for the last five days and noticed in this forum about the cloudy water is just the cycling thingy. Ive woken up this morning to find that now only the top inch of the water is cloudy and i think that its time i put one or two fish in to get the bacteria going.

Now my son wants some miniature goldfish and a couple of bottom feeders. So what im asking is if i get two stone loach will the goldfish leave them alone or will they fight.

MY SON LIKES THE STONE LOACH so would really like to get them.

Any advice would deeply be appreciated.

Cheers

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It is very hard on fish to use them to get the bacteria going. Sometimes it will kill a fish. There is a good sticky thread here on fishless cycling. Give that one a thorough study. You will need to find some pure ammonia to do it, NOT the stuff you buy in the supermarket for cleaning windows. Other option is to throw in a dead raw prawn. Then get a test kit for ammonia and one for nitrites, better still get the Aquarium pharmacuticals kit which contains 5 liquid tests. Do not get strips, get the liquids.

You can speed up the fishless cycle by adding some of the bottled live bacteria such as Cycle or Stability.

When your ammonia and nitrite levels are both 0, you can add fish.

Stone loaches grow to over 8 inches. No way a 15 gallon tank would house even one. Ditto goldfish. I have never hear of a miniature goldfish. I think it is someones wishful thinking. Even a small fancy goldfish will grow to 12 inches given the proper conditions. If a large fish is housed in a small tank, its growth will be stunted, but its internal organs keep growing, eventually outgrow the body, and the fish will die a slow unpleasant death from organ failure. So don't buy any "fish only grow to the size of the tank" line from your local fish store employees.

Your son's tank is big enough to house about 5 or 6 fish that stay less than 3 inches long max. If they are tiny fish such as cardinals or neon tetras, a few more. If he likes the goldfish colour, he may be happy with some platies. They are brightly coloured and not too big. Get all males or all females or more females than males.

Some dwarf cories might be good. Cories like company. Get three as the absolute minimum.

Other possibilities are cherry barbs (not rosy barbs). They stay quite small, 1.5 to 2 inches. Get equal numbers M and F. The males get brightly coloured to attract the females. Don't get more males because they are prettier, they will wear out the females. A group of them will be quite playful and active.

You could have one dwarf gourami, or a honey sunset gourami, or a pearl gourami with some neon tetras and 3 dwarf cories.

Kuhli loaches are a possibility for your bottom feeders instead of cories. They have a low bioload. Again, they like company of their own kind so need to be in a group.

Ember tetras are also small and pretty. They are a schooling fish so again, get a group of them.

Guppies are a possibility. They are small fish and very pretty. Males have the big fins. Do not mix males and females unless you want dozens of baby guppies to rehome. The smaller the fish the more you can have in your tank.

A betta with some small, non nippy tetras and three dwarf cories or kuhli loaches would make an interesting tank. Don't mix bettas with gouramis, other male bettas, or nippy fish. Otherwise they are great community fish.

If you go for barbs you have to be very careful what else you put in the tank (which is almost nothing) as they are extremely aggressive. (except cherry barbs) You can mix different colours of barbs, though. They are colourful and fast.

Check the profiles for any fish you are considering so you know its adult size and what it is compatible with. Work out what you think you want, then post it here for feedback.

Good luck and enjoy.

dollars4free said:

Now my son wants some miniature goldfish and a couple of bottom feeders. So what im asking is if i get two stone loach will the goldfish leave them alone or will they fight.

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:welcome: to AC!

I understand your enthusiasm to pick those fish you and your son would like however there are a few things that we have to prioritize first before we acquire the fish we want. In the end, we want to minimize the issues as much as possible and enjoy the hobby almost free of problems that would hound and even at one point, drive you into frustration.

Could you please tell us what your water parameters are right now? This would entail your ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and your pH. In the end, we need to make sure the nitrogen cycle has completed itself and that your ammonia and nitrite should read zero before it is declared safe for your fish to start moving in your tank. Ammonia and nitrite are extremely toxic to the fish especially in very high levels and we must avoid that. If you have not yet, I recommend you read this thread for better understanding of the cycle.
Freshwater cycling

If you haven't acquired your test kit yet, please get the liquid form by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, Inc. You will find that a majority of the members here will also recommend you the same brand as we trust it for its excellent reliability. It's a long-term investment and can last you a year. This is one way for us to know when your tank has completed its nitrogen cycle.

Could you please tell us what brand of filter you use and its capacity? For a 15g, do make sure the output is not too powerful that it would make a whirlpool effect thus stressing most fish who are intolerant to powerful flows. For filter media, I use only sponges and filter floss. If you managed to get activated carbon, keep that aside for now as you will not need it. I use carbon mainly to remove the tannins (substance that causes yellowing to the water as it is leached by driftwoods although no harm is done) and medicines (while treating the tank for health issues).

Next, we turn to the fish. Ch-47 soldier is correct in stating that your tank undoubtedly is too small for your planned goldfish. There is no such thing as "miniature" goldfish, almost all the goldfish we get grow to 6 inches and above and note that as they grow, they also grow bulkier. If space and finances are not an issue, I suggest you buy another tank, the biggest that you can afford. If possible, try a 75 gallons to make your options quite flexible. For cheaper rates, look into Craiglist as it is always notorious for best tank deals especially as most are secondhanded or surplus stuffs. Do beware of the deals you get into and check thoroughy first if they're defective or not. Your 15 gallons work best as a quarantine setup if you hope to start with goldfish.

You will find that with goldfish, we divide them into two categories: fancy and pond. The fancy category would involve mostly the round bodied types such as the popular orandas, ranchus, lionheads, fantails, tikus pearlscales, etc. Fancy types are smaller than the pond types usually ranging from 6 to 10 inches in size. I also keep fancies myself focusing more on lionheads, ranchus, orandas and ryukins with the largest being the 7 inch oranda. For fancy types, I aim for a general guideline of 15g per fish. Certainly, this does not mean your 15g is quite feasible for use as it is rather tight for even a single goldfish in the long run. Goldfish are sociable by nature and I would advise against keeping one by itself.

The pond types consist of comets, shubunkins and common goldfish although the watonai, wakin and jikin seem intermediate between the two categories but nevertheless all the types mentioned here grow to 12 inches and above, something you would not want in a 15g tank at all They are quite quirky and need plenty of space to swim around. Our dear members here, Kashta and Flaringshutter keep mostly pond types and their goldies are quite large beauties at 12-16 inches in size range. For pond types, we aim for 20g per fish. A 75g certainly can fit at least 3-4 of them.

If you do hope to keep goldfish and get a large tank, I would not advise using grave as your substrate for that. I admit having difficulties cleaning the poop around as goldfish excrete a lot of wastes. Sand would be a much better option and I use it for most of my tanks although my large goldfish tanks are barebottom to make it easier for me to clean out the wastes. I plan eventually to add some decorative pots there with live plants.

Please let us know what your final decisions are and we will be able to recommend more for you and please do not hesitate to ask if you have any more questions.

Hope this helps!

Lupes