SPS Question

[Conski]

Mainly directed towards ace but any input is welcome.

Im only putting sps zoas and palys into my tank (maybe a few LPS if i find them unique enough) and im a little worried about nitrates.. im sure with the skimmer, more gallons of water, the mp20 and everything else that itll be sort of difficult to keep the sps.

I will probably do 2 water changes a week unless i can keep them under 10 on my own but i guess i wanna know what i should do or if i should worry at all

[Ace25]

Just taking a guess right now since we really are not 100% sure on how well your tank will run, but I suspect it will run very good, is that if you do a 10G weekly waterchange you will not have a problem with Nitrates.

Once you get into SPS corals the beginner water parameters should not really be much of an issue. Usually people make the leap from LPS to SPS once they feel they have the foundation of a reef tank down good.. but SPS just opens a whole different area of water parameters to stay on top of which ends up being much harder than simply keeping nitrates as close to 0 as possible. With SPS you have to worry about Ca/Alk/Mg for health and growth and the bad parameters that you really need to keep low are Phosphates and Silicates. All of those are not nearly as critical with LPS corals so you can slack a little on those things, but when you get into SPS corals the margin of error gets much smaller, but IMO if you keep your tank within proper parameters the SPS corals will look better and grow much faster than any LPS coral. It makes it all that much more rewarding when you can keep SPS corals alive because you know your keeping the water parameters in the happy zone which is a testament to your commitment to the tank. :)

[Amphiprion]

My recommendation is to just keep an eye on nitrate. Don't get too stressed about. The easiest thing to do is to try a small frag of something hardy, such as many Montipora species, and see how it does. If you keep on top of everything else, I don't foresee a bit of nitrate being an issue at all. I have seen thriving tanks with relatively high nitrate--it may not be optimal, but corals can and often will still do well.

[Conski]

Im am obsessive with my 14 gal reef. so i feel if i get into SPS i will be even more obsessive and try even harder. i will buy a phosphate and silicate tester. and keep my nitrates as close to 0 as i possibly can. is there a recommended ALK? i know mine in the 14 gal is 10 but it could change cause i am switching to a different RO unit and water source.

[DoctaQ]

when you start with the sps you need to dose alk and ca

if your tank is small you can use a two part solution like b ionic

personally i use seachem powders which i make my own solution and strength.

[Conski]

im going to be using B-ionic and dose as the instructions say.. i take it ill be doing daily dosing i just wanna know what the ideal alk/ca is for sps and Specific gravity? im used to testing ALK and CA but i need a mg tester as i will be new to MG?

[DoctaQ]

alk 8 to 12
ca 400-450
sg 1.026-1.027
test a bunch at first then develop a daily dosing regimen then test less often

[Amphiprion]

Im am obsessive with my 14 gal reef. so i feel if i get into SPS i will be even more obsessive and try even harder. i will buy a phosphate and silicate tester. and keep my nitrates as close to 0 as i possibly can. is there a recommended ALK? i know mine in the 14 gal is 10 but it could change cause i am switching to a different RO unit and water source.

Sounds like a good plan. Be careful of being too obsessive. You can end up doing more harm than good, actually, if you try too hard. Alkalinity in the ocean is around 7 dKH. I actually recommend levels higher than this for many reasons. One is the added stability of pH (primarily to upward swings, not downward) and the other is calcification. If you are looking to maximize calcification and growth, higher alkalinity levels are necessary. Studies have shown that carbonate/bicarbonate (or inorganic carbon in general) is a limiting factor in calcification. Rates rose linearly with increased carbonate/bicarbonate concentration. The acceptable range is 7-11 dKH, with the upper values being advantageous to coral growth. I personally like to keep mine between 8-10 dKH, preferring the upper end.

With this, you may ask "why not keep it at seawater levels?" The short answer is that sea alkalinity levels are falling and corals evolved to take advantage of much higher alkalinity levels. Some evidence shows levels as high as 14 dKH, though I have personally noted problems with alkalinity this high, which is why I stick to the aforementioned range.

Calcium is good between 380-450 and isn't as crucial to monitor as alkalinity, primarily due to the relative abundance when compared to carbonate/bicarbonate.

[powerkit]

Conski, Good luck with your new frags!!! I hope you will share some pics when you get them all placed! I just got my first 2 frags last week, I too am using seachem products, however, I find the liquid 'Reef' series to be easier to dose accurately (but thats just mho). I used phosgaurd to remove phosphates before bringing my frags home. I definately recommend that stuff. 4 days and my phosphates were undetectable! Again, good luck and hope you just have fun with it!!!

[Conski]

Conski, Good luck with your new frags!!! I hope you will share some pics when you get them all placed! I just got my first 2 frags last week, I too am using seachem products, however, I find the liquid 'Reef' series to be easier to dose accurately (but thats just mho). I used phosgaurd to remove phosphates before bringing my frags home. I definately recommend that stuff. 4 days and my phosphates were undetectable! Again, good luck and hope you just have fun with it!!!

thanks man but the tank isn't even up and running yet! but yes all sps for it is the plan :) thanks for the vote of confidence and phosphate remover!

i am so anxious to get this started.. least ill have my mp20 by monday. i know that will be perfect for sps

[Conski]

Thanks everyone for the advise so far.. after i get a tester SPS i am gonna buy the 10 sps mix frag package off of live aquaria. im going to be getting B-Ionic as my supplement set, its what ace uses and (not trying to be a brownnoser) but the dudes reef is looking nice and i know he uses it. does anyone know if API has a decent testing kit for mg phos and silicates?

[Conski]

if anyone has any other advise or comments feel free to let me know

[Ace25]

I agree, Phosguard is good stuff. I have actually been seriously contemplating switching from GFO to AO because it actually does a better job at removing Phosphates. One problem with Phosguard/AO (Aluminum Oxides) is it can leach aluminum into your tank. Whether that is an actual problem or just a perceived problem is definately debatable but I have never seen any conclusive evidence showing AO can have a negative effect on the tank.

As far as the "Directions on the Bottle" goes for B-Ionic, that is one direction you should NOT follow. Those are extremely "general" directions and all tanks are so different in consumption levels that the bottle is rarely correct. Testing/getting a regiment dialed in is the best way to go about dosing B-Ionic. I also have the 3rd part, the Magnesium, from B-Ionic as well, but as far as ratios of what I put in my tank goes something like this, and remember, this is on top of using Kalkwasser as my top of water.. B-Ionic dosing for me daily = 60-70ml of Alk, 20ml of CA, 7ml of Magnesium daily on my 75G but as you know I have a ton of corals consuming the stuff. In the beginning I only had to dose about 10-20ml of Alk a day and 0/0 CA/Mg for the first few months. Waterchanges were enough to replenish and keep CA/Mg within check early on.

Personally, I think Phosphate test kits are completely worthless when you get into SPS tanks. Only a Hanna meter will give you "usable" results. Test kits can't test low enough for SPS tanks. API is good for Alk/CA test kits though. With Silicates, if you use good RO/DI water and use Phosguard or Rowaphos then silicates should never be an issue for you. I bought a test kit, used it when I had a problem, but then it just sat in a drawer until it expired because I never used it after I learned about silicates and got them down to 0.

[Conski]

yea thats what i was thinking. i am gonna have barely any corals for a few months so dosing wont be much of a problem with water changes.. when tests show i am running low ill start to supplement.

Ill get phosguard, also im gonna get a coral dipping set becuase i want to start doing that before i put them in my new tank.. any suggestions on what to dip with?

[Ace25]

Revive and MediCoral is what I use for dipping. Interceptor is great also but is a prescription dog medicine only a Vet can give you so it is harder to obtain than the other stuff. I would say if it is possible for you to get some Interceptor LEGALLY then that is always a great step/dip to do on all new corals before you put them in your tank. It will kill certain flatworms/red bugs that nothing else will. I just printed out this link below and brought it to my local vet and was in and out in 5 minutes with a prescription, but I have heard some vets can be difficult about it.

http://www.melevsreef.com/redbugs.html

[Conski]

my father will never let that happen haha as much as i want it! so ill just use the other too.

is a dosing regiment hard to figure out

[Ace25]

Lots of these Reef Calculators out there, this was the first one google brought up.. This is what you need to figure out the amount to dose daily once you test. Like Amph said though, take is sloooowly. Don't overdose. If you test and use that calculator and your CA is say at 400 and you want it at 440 and says to put in X amount of B-Ionic and you do and the next day it is only 410 that is ok, just put in a little more B-Ionic the next day. That is only to raise it though.. ideally you want to find the "balance" of exactly what you need to dose to maintain the levels at a certain spot, not trying to play catch up the whole time.

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chemcalc.html

and another one

http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/i6/Calcium-and-Alkalinity-Calculator./information.html

[Conski]

well the dosing sounds scary but im sure once im down and into it wont be that bad.. hopefully i don't screw it up. or maybe somehow i wont even need to dose in the long run, just test. i guess well see. plus all my corals have to be from online my lfs has a huge selection of nice LPS and zoas, but nothing in the SPS category.

so the more i order offline the slower i get them because its 30x more expensive.

sigh :( scooternerd is a lucky dude i know that much ahaha