Fishless cycling with shrimp - cloudy water

[Bobho]

I am trying to cycle a new 26 gal bowfront tank for tropical fish. I first used live fish (at the advice of the pet store) and the fish died. I cleaned out the tank and started over again with flake fish food only instead of fish themselves. All I got after a week was no readings on my test strips but tons of dirty water with fish food specs all over.

I cleaned out my tank - again - and decided to use a shrimp. I only have the temp at 76 degrees because higher than that and the shrimp stinks. It's been a week and all I've got is very cloudy water.

ph about 7
ammonia between 0.5 and 1
nitrites 0
nitrates 0

Is this a normal cycling result?

This is my first real tank. Before this I only had a 16 gal coldwater with gold fish and because I knew nothing about water testing they of course, sadly, died.

[swinneyw]

you don't need to clean out your tank the idea is to get baciteria if the shrimp stinks thats o k thats what you want if you don't have live fish in the tank you don't have to do any water changes for a while after about two weeks you can start doing 20% water changes every few days until you get the readings you want it your nitrates are below 20 and there is no amonia you can start to add fish slowly im sure some one else on this forum will give more advice

[Lowryder]

Turn your heater up to the mid 80's. It will stink but a higher temp will help the bacteria grow faster.

IMO get rid of the shrimp and use pure ammonia. You then have control over your ammonia levels. Not to mention it will be faster than the shrimp method.

[THE V]

Turn your heater up to the mid 80's. It will stink but a higher temp will help the bacteria grow faster.


Actually the ideal temp for nitrifying bacteria is 80F however a few degrees above or below this temp is not going to slow them down significantly.

You are getting an ammonia buildup which is great. The stink from the decomposing shrimp is not surprising. One of the best ways to remove this is by running activated carbon in your filter. What kind of filter do you have on the tank? If possible adding in some more carbon will help but it depends upon the filter if you can or not.

The trick with this type of cycling is to let it get dirty and leave it alone until the bacteria colony is established. It will look ugly for a little bit but in the long run it is much better. I've used the fish food technique before to successfully cycle a tank. It was ugly and people thought I was crazy for doing so but it worked.

You can got with the ammonia method of cycling but generally you will have blooms of the organic decomposing bacteria in the tank after you add fish. This is safe but unsightly.

If you have any friends with healthy tanks, squeezing the nasty black stuff from there filter into your filter can cut the cycle time down to less than a week.

If you want to add live plants to the tank now is the time to put them in. They will greatly help with the cycle.

[ianab]

Sounds like things are starting to work.

The test shows ammonia, your nose confirms that, and the cloudy water is a bloom of bacteria caused by that ammonia being in the tank.

This is only the first stage of cycling, getting some ammonia in there. Warmer water means the shrimp rots faster, makes more ammonia, and smells worse, but it will speed the process up.

As the cycling progresses the ammonia level will decrease, you may see some nitrite appear for a while, then the nitrate level should start to increase. This is probably going to take a couple of weeks.

If you can seed the tank with gravel or filter media from an established tank that will speed things up a lot. Bringing in some real live bacteria that can then multiply quickly is faster than just waiting for the random ones that happen to have fallen into the tank.

The idea of doing a fishless cycle is that this stinky, cloudy, ammonia stage is happening while there are no fish in the tank. If you just dump too many fish in a new tank it happens anyway, and the fish die. This way, even if you mess up totally, no fish get killed.

Ian

[GusBus]

Sounds normal but i recommend getting a liquid test kit

[Bobho]

I feel better about my cloudy tank now, am appreciating all the advice.

I have a Marineland Penguin power filter #150.

I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and turn up the temp a bit, though it sure stank up our little apartment when it was up in the 80s.

I can't seed the tank because I don't know anyone with an established aquarium and I don't trust the pet stores.

I have a liquid kit for ammonia only, but it was so expensive I'm using the strips I already have instead. I have strips for all the other water tests.

Here's hoping....

[ianab]

The tank will still cycle at 76F, or even 60F, it will just take a bit longer, so if it's getting a bit smelly you could leave it down, in the interest of domestic harmony.:barf:

Ian

[Jspigs]

The problem with test strips is they are not very accurate.

[GusBus]

the API liquid kit costs 30 dollars and i dont see why you shouldnt trust the pet stores with media i mean they have established tanks so it would help you

[Bobho]

I guess I don't trust the pet stores because I see dead fish everytime I go - it doesn't instill confidence. Unless that's the norm?

[tranced]

yeah its pretty normal man. its just a numbers game, when you have thousands of fish instead of dozens you see alot more deaths. the good ones will get the dead ones out ASAP but if you go there during a busy period i wouldnt be too worried.

though i wouldnt trust em completely...

its good to build a relationship with a store so u can get things like this i suppose. when people are setting new tanks up i squeeze out a sponge filter from a tank that i know is disease free and give the squeezings in a bag. most of them look at me like i escaped from a mental asylum, but they usually come back and say the fish are doing well.

[Bobho]

I turned up the heater to 80 degrees yesterday and my shrimp looks "interesting" now.

My water cleared up over night, however, and I can't figure out why. This morning I used test strips from two different bottles (both with the same expiration date) and neither showed nitrites (they NEVER have showed nitrites) but one showed nitrates though the other one showed none.

I know I should have nitrites first - something must be wrong with the test strips, not to mention the fact that they both registered different from each other (and also on hardness and ph).

I'm going out today to buy a liquid test kit. The strips are a waste.

[jpappy789]

Good idea.

[ducatigirl]

I agree! get the master test kit,
I cant believe my lfs uses test strips! but then again, due to their advice, my gold saum died.
Get better advice on here!
Remember, the nitrate test...to shake the vial after first drops, and shake bottle no.2 before adding drops.
I didnt do that and had no nitrate reading till i did.

[ducatigirl]

I have a liquid kit for ammonia only, but it was so expensive I'm using the strips I already have instead. I have strips for all the other water tests.

Here's hoping....

I have issues with cost too, my local store costs $69 for the master kit, and I bought it online for $30 (aussie website).
If you wernt in a hurry, look online, or perhaps do it before you need your next kit.

[Bobho]

I bought the API master test kit this afternoon for about $32.00 at my local pet store. Did all the tests and came up with Ammonia 1.0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0.

It's great to finally have something that actually works and I can count on.

[ducatigirl]

excellent :)

[Michwol42795]

I bought the API master test kit this afternoon for about $32.00 at my local pet store. Did all the tests and came up with Ammonia 1.0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0.

It's great to finally have something that actually works and I can count on.

Those are good numbers for now, just be patient and give it some time and it should cycle in a few weeks.

[Bobho]

I'm getting bummed. It's been a total of two weeks now and my ammonia is only at 1 today (though I think it was between 1 and 2 when I checked it a few days ago), and my nitrites are at 0.

I've had the temperature at 80 degrees all this time, but nothing is progressing.

Should I throw in another shrimp? I only have only one shrimp and it's a 26 gal tank - is one enough? Does it matter if it's cooked or raw, tail on or tail off? Sorry these are dumb questions, but I must be doing something wrong. Seems like I should have nitrites by now and higher ammonia.

[joel.uejio]

Tossing in a few more shrimp should be fine -- you should start seeing some nitrites soon. In the meantime, try to resist the urge to start "fiddling" with your tank -- best to let the biology of the tank evolve on its own.

Good luck!

[Bobho]

Thanks! I added a couple more shrimp, this time I pulled off their tails. That must help the process because the stink got worse within a few hours.

I'll test in a couple of days and see if my ammonia is rising.