Fishless cycling question(s)

Saje

AC Members
Sep 27, 2009
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New York
Posting here because I am a total newbie to fishless cycling so figured this was the place. I've only ever cycled with fish-in, so...

Okay, had a small tank (just 5.5 gallons) that I had to set up and move 2 diffusa snails into. I used a bit of media from a cycled tank (though that tank has only been cycled for about 3 months) and put the snails right in, testing twice a day just in case. Params were fine for the first however many days, then ammonia started rising slightly to about .25. I did small water changes (like 15% or so) and added some Prime. When it climbed to .50 and nitrite started showing up at .25, the snails were stressing, so I removed them and decided to cycle fishless. (I'm assuming that there just weren't enough bacteria on the media I put in to do much but speed the cycle along rather than avoid it altogether...)

Problem is, I cannot find ammonia without surfactants ANYwhere. Just not around here at all. So. I've been putting ground up fish flakes in (read that it's not a great idea to put them in whole and let them get fungus-y, ditto for using a cocktail shrimp) and also siphoning some of the snail poop from the cycled tank and dumping that in. The ammonia stayed at nearly 1.0 for about 2 days, then relatively quickly dropped to 0. No matter how much crap I put into this tank now, it stays at 0 or just between 0 and 0.25. Can I make the assumption here that the bacteria is established and is processing the ammonia and that's why I'm no longer getting readings?

Now, as expected, the nitrite has risen substantially. This morning it was 2.0. (Last night it was 1.0.) I didn't test my nitrates today yet, but a day or two ago they were 10.

So - a bunch of questions:
1) Can I assume that allllll the stuff I've dumped into this tank (you ought to see the bottom) is breaking down and feeding the ammonia-eating bacteria?
2) Can I assume that the ammonia-eating bacteria are doing their job processing the ammonia and that's why I have little to no reading on the test kit?
3) Can I assume that since my nitrites have risen fast and high, the ammonia-eating bacteria MUST be doing their job and be established now (nitrites are a by-product of the ammonia-eating bacteria, yes?) ?
4) Do I have to keep adding ground up flake food and snail poop to the tank? How often? I'm worried about starving the ammonia-eating bacteria somehow.
5) Once my nitrites drop to 0 and I have measurable nitrAtes, do I assume the cycle is done and the tank is safe for inhabitants?
6) How big of a water change do I do at that point?
7) I assume I gravel vac all the icky stuff (flake food, snail poop) up at that point?

Sorry for so many questions ... this is actually more complicated than I thought! :)

Thanks!
 
Just an update to the params. Just tested and the ammonia is either 0.25 or 0.50 (I absolutely cannot tell which color it is), nitrites are 5.0, and nitrates are somewhere around 30.

Just in case it helps with answering my above! :)
 
1) Can I assume that allllll the stuff I've dumped into this tank (you ought to see the bottom) is breaking down and feeding the ammonia-eating bacteria?

Yes

2) Can I assume that the ammonia-eating bacteria are doing their job processing the ammonia and that's why I have little to no reading on the test kit?

Yes

3) Can I assume that since my nitrites have risen fast and high, the ammonia-eating bacteria MUST be doing their job and be established now (nitrites are a by-product of the ammonia-eating bacteria, yes?) ?

Yes

4) Do I have to keep adding ground up flake food and snail poop to the tank? How often? I'm worried about starving the ammonia-eating bacteria somehow.

Yes - Daily
5) Once my nitrites drop to 0 and I have measurable nitrAtes, do I assume the cycle is done and the tank is safe for inhabitants?

Yes - Am 0, Ni 0, Na + = cycle complete
6) How big of a water change do I do at that point?

I usually do at least 50%.
7) I assume I gravel vac all the icky stuff (flake food, snail poop) up at that point?

Yes

See you do know what you are doing! Good job.
 
:) Thank you so much!

One more question - since my ammonia reading is currently either 0.25 or 0.50 (wish the colors weren't so close!), do I add more flake food and/or snail poop today or just leave it since there already is ammonia in the tank?
 
Sounds like you are getting there.

If there is an Ace hardware store in your area they have a janitorial strength cleaner that is pure ammonia, 10% thats what I use.
 
I used a method of fishless cycling where I just put drops of ammonia in my tank. It worked well and in a week my tank was ready for fish.
 
I searched in vain for ammonia without detergent etc in it and cannot find any at all. :headshake2:
 
:) Thank you so much!

One more question - since my ammonia reading is currently either 0.25 or 0.50 (wish the colors weren't so close!), do I add more flake food and/or snail poop today or just leave it since there already is ammonia in the tank?

I would add some anyways, since there is no fish to worry about it can't hurt.
 
In continuing to add ammonia when there's a small amount of ammonia already there (0.50), am I risking this cycle going on forever in the form of a high nitrite as the nitrite-eating bacteria keep struggling to keep up with the ammonia-eating ones?

This may be idiotic - bear with me: Since I already have nitrate present (around 40 now), and this tank is NOT going to be heavily stocked, is there a chance that the reason I'm showing such high nitrites and even still showing ammonia because there's SOOO much gunk in the tank (flake food and a ton of snail poop), and if I was to clean that stuff up, those levels would fall to 0 and I would indeed have a cycled tank? In other words, is it possible that it IS cycled now but badly out of whack because of all the gunk? Or is that wishful (and dangerous) thinking?

Also, once I'm finally cycled (0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, measurable nitrate), and I do a 50+% water change and gravel vac, do I also squeeze out the foam that's at the first level of the filter (have Eheim substrat as second & third levels)? The foam has to be FULL of the gunk I've been throwing in that tank... ? Obviously I know not to CHANGE the foam, but do I swish it out in used tank water once the cycle is over or leave it be?

Xman: I keep reading that if the ammonia froths a bit when you shake it, it should be avoided. The ones I've found with surfactants (but not listing detergent) froth a bit. ??
 
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