Water too hard! What can I do?

[ducatigirl]

My kh is normal for angels, but the gh is way too high (took 8-9 drops to change the colour on the api test solution).
I dont know what has happened.
Now the electric yellows tank has had way less water changes than all the angels tanks, and that water has gone soft (ironic isnt it?)
So I dont know what has made it hard.I have been losing a few new small angels here and there. and although my other parameters are normal, the gh has risen.

Any ideas on what has made the water hard?
would rock salt do it?
I also added seachem neutral to get the ph to 7 for the angels (4 tanks) and it has not moved it down (its 7.8 and 7.4)
I added kent blackwater expert and it has not made the water softer.
I just bought two peat blocks from bunnings, it is all I could find, all 3 shops had nothing to help. they say its organic on packets, and nothing added so hope it helps.
BUT will it only soften kh? and not gh?
What are some things you can think of that would make the water harder?
I have considered its the water supply, and called the waterboard today to enquire if they have added stuff.No reply yet.
I admit I do too many water changes. and I am going to stop, problem with my obsession see, is that as soon as I see a raised ph, a touch of ammonia, nitrates too high, fish look sad, anything...I get the hose out and do 15% wc, or 25% depending on what I find...
I would be better off not testing the tanks daily, and leaving them be perhaps.
Its these **** fish I get from the shop. I buy 3 put them in qt, notice closed fins or stress whatever, I worry, do a wc. After 2 weeks move them to tank, and a few days later they float, one a day. kind of. Well 2 out of 3 fish die.
Obne is often fine and joins in with other fish.

I bought 3 large angels last week.
I saw them a week before, they looked tattered with fluffy dorsal (long fins to balance with)? so left them there for a week, they lived except one, they said jumped out of the tank.
Brought them home, 1 died after a week, one died same night I got it.The other is fine.

I'm baffled. Shop says my water is too hard, so until all my water is tested for all the products i add, no refund. ($20 each fish).

Anyway.......
to try cut a long story short, what makes water go hard?

[KarlTh]

Rock salt makes water salty, not hard. I wouldn't worry. Angels are very tolerant of water conditions these days; a local shop used to breed them in Bedford (UK) which has water so hard you have to give the fish a hammer and chisel for them to get around.

You can ignore pH as well. Anything from 5.5 to 9.0 is fine. Loads of rubbish talked about pH.


I admit I do too many water changesNo such thing.

Your LFS is squirming.

[SubRosa]

What do you mean by rock salt exactly? If it's the stuff sold for melting ice and it's not calcium chloride then Karl is right. You need to be more specific.

[gmh]

My water is harder than yours and I mix in 50% RO. My softwater fish do just fine in ph 8 and tds of around 300ppm. I think you were doing exactly the right thing with those frequent water changes. They should not raise the gh but wil certianly help keep the ammonia and nitrates down and that is priority one.
I long ago gave up on putting peat and other additives to the tank. It just complicates things and can lead to swings in water parameters that can harm the fish.
Adding some RO water in with your tap is the safest, surest way to lower gh.

[gmh]

How much salt are you adding? I put in zero salt. No need for it unless you are treating for parasites or some illnesses.

[ducatigirl]

I'll have to not buy any more fish then, cos all the new ones die :(
yeah trail end of white spot...
Anyone bought peat blocks for softening water?
I presume i will need to boil it?

[ducatigirl]

mmm. so basically the angels i bought that died, has FA to do with my GH and the shop is full of ****?

I have read many comments on peat for use as a filtering medium, and since I bought it, I would like to try.
I'm scared to lose any more fish!

[ducatigirl]

I have no idea where to get ro water, and Its out of the question to purchase an ro filter.

[KarlTh]

mmm. so basically the angels i bought that died, has FA to do with my GH and the shop is full of ****?

Abso-****-lutely ;)


I have read many comments on peat for use as a filtering medium, and since I bought it, I would like to try.
I'm scared to lose any more fish!

It doesn't do a great deal, but does lower GH a little.

[gmh]

It sounds like they sold you some products that you don't need. I'd be curious to know what water they use in their own tanks. I'll bet they just use city tap water. Your paremeters are fine without adding anything, at least once you get past that ich problem.
I get RO water from vending machines outside local Supermarkets. Don't know how hard it is to find it over there however. You should be ok as is anyway.

[ducatigirl]

I think it would blow my mind to see things like that at a supermarket vending machine.lol we are like a 3rd world country at times, like public transport here is still one bus an hour, none on sunday. ha ha.
I met two people yesterday, one guy works in the lfs, he is cool. he says he has 20 tanks at home, and doesnt do a thing to any tanks, all he adds is prime.
wc once a month, doesnt test, doesnt lose fish, except when the water corp add something to water supply.
and a woman i met who gave me free fish, her tank is like a tank of fish **** colour of tannin with no driftwood.lol its disgusting and heavily overstocked...with all the baby labs that have been born in the cess pool, and all she tests for is ph, and tops the tank up, never wc.she owns water ager and nothing else. Her fish are breeding like mad. and she has 2 dozen baby bristlenose too.

As my water was getting harder the more wc I did, I started to wonder if I should cut down. Maybe to once a week... I do like to feed my fish often, but i dont chuck a handful in, i put in enough to give them 3 pellets each then twice more that day before bed. The tanks i do wc on are the unstable ones btw. The electric yellow , chipokae, and saums tank, are all stable.
All the angelfish tanks are unstable and alkaline.I get ammonia spikes, ph fluctuations, and dead fish... mmmmmm.....I need to test them on a daily basis.
changing the water too often maybe gives me a mini cycle?
I am making bags for carbon today and going to run it in all tanks, get rid of some residual chemicals, dissolved minerals etc, and maybe that will help.

thanks Karl and gmh for your comments, and suggestions, they are always welcome, and gives me reassurance when i get a bit freaked out :)

[gmh]

PH fluctuations are probably due to that ph neutral stuff you are adding to the water. It only drops the ph temporarilly. Also, you may want to check the ph of water out of the tap, let it sit 24 hours and then test again. It will likely test higher because CO2 will gas off overnight and raise the ph. If you do fewer water changes the ph will come down over time as a result of poorer water quality. Ammonia drops ph.
Reallly, just keeping it simple and adding nothing but prime to the water, and doing frequent water changes, like 25% every week, should keep things stable for you fish over time.l

[tranced]

^^ couldnt agree more. finding a decent LFS would be nice too, you arent in WA by any chance are u?