Thinking about GBRs. Questions- grow out and more

[Kristinann]

I've done my research, but still have some questions.

I want to do a breeding pair in a 20 gallon. I don't expect large amounts of fry, as my water is a bit hard and pH (http://www.fishlore.com/fishdictionary/p.htm#ph) a bit high (I'm working on it before I add them, but doubt it will ever be perfect). I don't necessarily want huge amounts, I wouldn't know what to do with them all.

1. Are Indian Almond leaves an acceptable method of lowering pH for Rams?
2. What is the smallest acceptable size grow-out tank for these fry?
3. How old/at what size are they big and strong enough to be moved, shipped, or sold?
4. Where would I be able to find a pair of GBRs for sale (online or in Phoenix)?
5. Would a couple snails be ok in the breeding tank, or would they just mow right over the eggs? What about a dwarf gourami?
6. How common is it for the male to be aggressive to the female, and her need to be moved? If she needs to be moved, is a 10G an acceptable temporary home?
7. I've heard that the tank needs to be running for 3-6 months before adding them as they need "old water". Is this true, or just due to cycling?

[Kristinann]

So far, on other sites, I have gotten these answers:

1. yes, also peat, driftwood, and CO2
2. 40G (can I go any smaller?)
3. 1 inch, 2-3 months. Smaller would mean higher mortality rate and less money
4. ebay, craigslist, aquabid (only found balloons there), this forum, fishlore, etc
5. unknown
6. just provide driftwood and plants to break line of vision
7. yes

What do you guys think?

[ronw007]

Kristinann, a 20 gallon tank should be fine for a breeding pair of GBR's. As far as survivability (SP?) it would all depend if you had parent raisers or you were to pull the eggs. You will almost always have more survivers with the later method.

1. Yes they are acceptable methods of lowering pH as well as you stated, peat.

2. I start out with smaller grow out tanks 5 to 10 gallon tanks and then they are moved to larger 29 gallon tanks and up.

3. I normally won't sell mine until about 1 inch or larger and about 3 months in age. Their colors will not start to develop until 2 to 3 months and beyond.

4. You can find pairs as well as individuals for sale on Aquabid. Best bet would be to find someone local to deal with if you can. See if there are any local aquarium clubs in your area and ask around. I am selling 4 month old juve's in the classified ad's. I have some that are starting to show pairing behavior. PM me if interested.

5. Snails are ok it the breeding tank. I also house some small BN pleco's in there as well to cut down on the algae. Neither seems to bather the breeding GBR's.

6. They will have their spats once in awhile, but nothing I have witnessed to make me seperate the pairs. If you have a need to, a 10 gallon tank is ok for temp housing.

7. Yes, in my opinion GBR's do better in a well established tank.

The most important thing I have found with the GBR's is temp, established tank and a varied diet and who you obtain the GBR's from. Alot of breeders use R/O water, so if you are not, it is alot harder to acclimate them to your water. Hope this answers your questions and if you should need any other help, let me know.

Ron

[Kristinann]

Thank you, ronw007. I saw your ad, and have been interested in both your fish and your advice.

In all honesty, I am a kid, with 2 part time jobs, moving out for college in a year or so. I am interested in a pair for their color and for thier personaities, from what I have heard. I like the idea of having fry every so often, I like the excitement, but I don't want a huge breeding progect. I would like to parent raise. I just want a tank with personality that I can really enjoy, I thought these might be ok if I can work out the details.

Though my mom loves fish tanks, I'm not sure if I can get away with having a lot of them, or a larger one. I might be able to get away with 2 more 20s in my room if I can find or make a stand that would hold one on top of the other. I'm not looking to make a lot of money, or any really. I would probably sell most of the fish off at about a month, at just the price of shipping + breather bags or whatever (I have never shipped fish before).

I'm thinking about a pair, plus some mystery snails (or maybe ramshorn or malaysian trumpet), and maybe a few otos, possibly a dwarf gourami. I'm also curious about keeping a couple shrimp with them. What do you think about all this? I wouldn't mind occasionally losing a couple fry to tankmates, as I really don't have the room for a ton of them anyways. I just don't want to lose the whole batch of them, as I feel might happen with tetras (which is sad, I think it would nice with a school of neons).

My tank has been running for maybe a month and a half. It's cycled, with a single danio in it (yes, I know this isn't right, long story) that I will probably be getting rid of. I may keep him until I get the GBRs to keep everything cycled. Without a heater, my tank stays a consistent 80-81F. I'm thinking about adding a heater to keep colors nice. I use conditioned tap water. I feed mostly flakes, sometimes freeze-dried bloodworms or tubiflex worms. Looking into getting frozen bloodworms, daphnia, and/or brine shrimp. If I do breed GBRs, I will start hatching brine shrimp, will start a culture or two of infusoria, and would like to find a culture of banana worms or something similar.

What do you think? Do you think I can make this work for me? Again, a single 20 gallon planted breeding tank with maybe the tankmates mentioned. 1 or 2 growout tanks, either 10 or 20 gallons in size. 80-81 degrees F, or a heater to bring it to 83-85?

[Krilorn]

I keep my breeding pair in a 29 gallon community with rummys and corys. I would recomend getting a pair locally if you can, easier on the fish with similar water conditions. I live in Omaha Ne, and our water is terrible for GBR from what i have read, but since i got them from a local breeder i havent had any issues. Mine breed about every 2-3 weeks, and i just remove the rock they use to lay eggs and place it in a 2.5 gallon and dose with methlyne <sp?> blue and drop in a air stone. Within a few days when i see wigglers i lower the water level to about half a gallon and just pour them into my 10gallon. At about 2months or so they are close to big enough to transport to my LFS, but not really big enough to sex yet.