Discus... with rams?

[shaynablizard]

I have a 75 gallon and I'm getting ready to upgrade by 7 young discus into, as soon as I can catch and remove all the fry from the 75.
My LFS has some electric blue rams - they're beautiful fish! I'm thinking down the road I may look into adding a couple of these to the 75 gallon discus tank when it's planted up. Aside from that, there will be my santarem plecos or mega clown plecos (not sure which I'm moving in there yet) and some brigg snails.
I haven't had rams before... are these appropriate tankmates? I'm just wondering if this would be a good or bad idea.

[BettaFishMommy]

i have read and seen that rams and discus go well together, but i think at 7 discus plus plecos and briggs in a 75 you're full up stocking wise already, if not a tad overstocked once everyone is adult size.

[shaynablizard]

i have read and seen that rams and discus go well together, but i think at 7 discus plus plecos and briggs in a 75 you're full up stocking wise already, if not a tad overstocked once everyone is adult size.

Oh really? I thought discus need 5-8 gallons as an adult fish. Mine would have 11 gallons per fish. Plus 6 or so briggs will add a minute amount of bioload (which the plants would more than make up for I'd think). Then there's my 4 hypans, but they stay quite small, much smaller than a bn. I can't imagine they'd add much bioload. Aren't rams small as well? I didn't think with two rams I'd be pushing my stocking. Never crossed my mind.

I'm definitely up for more opinions on this. Am I overstocking?

[BettaFishMommy]

briggs are pretty messy snails, and poop a lot when cared for properly.

i would give each discus at least 10 gallons. they are a good size fish once full grown and will thrive best when given ample space. 5 to 8 gallons IMO is not enough per fish. think of it this way: would you put one full grown discus in a 5 to 8 gallon tank?

and a 75 gallon doesn't equate to 11 gallons per discus. it'd be closer to 8 gallons once you factor in the 'gallonage' required for the other creatures in the tank. briggs want at least 1 gallon per snail, and although your plecos are a smaller species, they too will create a fair amount of waste.

it's not so much the space given to the fish, but the water volume and the capacity for a clean environment between water changes once you factor in the species living in the tank. if you had a sump on that tank that was at least half the size of the 75, then i'd say go for the rams, since your total water volume is more than 75 gallons.

[shaynablizard]

I have seen full grown discus (and they're beautiful - that's when I decided to try discus), so I know they get very large. I do think 5-8 gallons is on the small side, which is why I chose 7 for a 75 gallon. But I also thought that would give a little bit of room for some smaller fish that would stay out of the discus way and still allow them their swimming space - such as the plecos and maybe rams would. They'd help clean up the blackworms that hit the substrate too.
Of course I wouldn't put a discus in a 5 to 8 gallon tank, nor would I put one in a 10, 15 or 20 gallon, so I think that's a silly way to look at this picture. This isn't an inch of fish per gallon talk.
My concern at this point is water quality, if I'm legitimately looking at a stocking issue and I'd like to address it now before I get the tank going. Whether or not I add two rams is kind of on a side note now - am I really on the verge of poor water quality or my fish not having the swimming space they need? I would like to know that now. I may rethink my whole plan if it's really that tight. I appreciate the info.
My filtration is 2- aquaclear 500/110s and I change 50% of my tank water weekly.

I do want to add that I'm not asking what my fish will survive in, but what they need to swim around happy and healthy. That's my primary concern for them. I didn't think I was overstocking, but if I am I'd like to be sure before I proceed.

[Star_Rider]

7-8 Discus will fit in a 75..adding plecos will affect the tank some..plecos are known to produce large amounts of waste...
average adult discus usually hit the 6" range..dinner plate sized Discus are not really the norm for Discus.

but in a 75 with a relatively high stock ratio.. you should really consider 2-3 Water changes per week. opposed to 1 large water change.
plus look at upgrading the filtration.. there are several affordable canister filters on the market(sunsun)
currently in my 75 I have 3 large discus and a runt.
this tank originally housed 7 Discus but over the years some had been moved around(aggression, pairs etc)

[shaynablizard]

Thanks - the aquaclears do great filtration for a HOB, but I may consider getting a canister for that tank. I considered putting the discus in a 90 gallon I have, however the 75 gallon with a black stand and canopy will make a much nicer display tank.
As the discus grow, increasing their water changes to twice a week isn't an issue.
I've also been pondering the idea of rehoming my malawi cichlids someday that reside in a 125 gallon built in my wall, which has a nice FX5 canister filter, and putting my discus in there when they grow up. That would be a couple years down the road and is still a big "if" at this point. Not sure I can give up those fish.
Just wanted to make sure I'm not setting myself up for failure or unhappy fish with my current plan.

[Star_Rider]

with proper maintenance you can keep them in the 75.. it will require more maint than a single water change per week tho and as long as you are willing to make the sacrifice then you should be ok

[shaynablizard]

With 14 tanks running, my daughter and I are doing water changes all the time anyway. Adding one more water change to the routine isn't going to be a big deal. I spend all my free time messing with the tanks anyway.

[Temptress]

I too think this is fine, discus aren't exactly a "swimming" fish anyway, so I wouldn't be too concerned about the swim room aspect of it my discus move from plant to plant picking at things and looking around but I never see them doing laps or anything.

I would be more concerned about the briggs being in the tank at all tho, briggs need cooler temps than discus, especially younger discus wanting the 86* temps, I learned from experience that they don't fair well.. I lost all my briggs before I believed it was true =( I would try nerite snails.. that's what I have in my tanks now.. amazing algae eaters and they can't reproduce (most species) in freshwater!

I do think the only concern here is regular water changes and it seems like you're more than willing to throw in an extra one so no worries! Not to mention the plants help a ton with water quality! =)

Rams and discus go great together! They both love the warm temps and clean water =)

HTH

[Cerianthus]

My concern would be temp you intend to keep the discus at. Although kept gbrs with Discus @ 84-86F but gbr did lot better in lower temp than 84F and same goes for most Amazonian Dwarfs I kepted with Discus.

Discus did just fine at bit lower temp as well.

Good Luck with new set up!

[shaynablizard]

Thanks for all the info. I really like the aquaclear filters and think they work great, but I do think I'm going to upgrade to a canister filter in the future when I come across a good price on one. I have my discus at 84 right now, however they've grown fast, they're not too small anymore. I'm going to move them up to the bigger tank and slowly decrease the temp to 82. The briggs are distributed in my other fry tanks now, not with the discus, because I have assassin snails in with the discus now. After I get the discus moved and their temps down to 82, I think the snails would do well in the larger planted tank. Anyway, so that's my plan. Adding the rams was something I hadn't planned, but more of a side thought and I wondered if it would be possible. I suppose I'll wait it out and see what I think will be best down the road. I had most been concerned about if rams would pick at discus or something like that, the crowding factor wasn't something I thought would be an issue. I could always put rams in another tank when/ if I decide to get them in the future. Thanks again for the help and advice.

[pinkertd]

7 discus will be fine in a planted 75 tank I've kept 10 in my 72 bowfront without issue and with a small pleco or two and other small fish. I did 2 50 percent water changes weekly until they were old enough to only need one feeding a day. I have always run 2 large HOBs on that tank also without issue. I use the large marineland biowheels because the lip of the tank is too thick to accommodate the aquaclears. Over the years I've kept various small fish with the discus including rams. And would never put rams back in with them again because the rams get too aggressive towards the discus when the rams spawn. I did not like seeing the discus get pounded. On the head by the anxious ram parents. I have some black tetras in there now and they are nice companion fish, not afraid to swim around with the large discus. Smaller tetras and even the rummynose tetras hardly seem to confidently swim with the discus out if fear of their large size. If I could get my hands on some emporers I'd have them in there.

[shaynablizard]

7 discus will be fine in a planted 75 tank I've kept 10 in my 72 bowfront without issue and with a small pleco or two and other small fish. I did 2 50 percent water changes weekly until they were old enough to only need one feeding a day. I have always run 2 large HOBs on that tank also without issue. I use the large marineland biowheels because the lip of the tank is too thick to accommodate the aquaclears. Over the years I've kept various small fish with the discus including rams. And would never put rams back in with them again because the rams get too aggressive towards the discus when the rams spawn. I did not like seeing the discus get pounded. On the head by the anxious ram parents. I have some black tetras in there now and they are nice companion fish, not afraid to swim around with the large discus. Smaller tetras and even the rummynose tetras hardly seem to confidently swim with the discus out if fear of their large size. If I could get my hands on some emporers I'd have them in there.

Thank you - this is very helpful info! I wondered if rams would pick at discus at all. If I decide to get them at some point, I suppose it's going to be best to put them in their own tank. For the discus, I have considered rummynose and cardinal tetras, but right now I'll just worry about getting the discus into their new home. I do have 2 of the marineland biowheel 350 filters, I like them too, especially since they fit well on my tank that is too close to the wall for the aquaclears!

[wesleydnunder]

7 discus will be fine in a planted 75 tank I've kept 10 in my 72 bowfront without issue and with a small pleco or two and other small fish. I did 2 50 percent water changes weekly until they were old enough to only need one feeding a day. I have always run 2 large HOBs on that tank also without issue. I use the large marineland biowheels because the lip of the tank is too thick to accommodate the aquaclears. Over the years I've kept various small fish with the discus including rams. And would never put rams back in with them again because the rams get too aggressive towards the discus when the rams spawn. I did not like seeing the discus get pounded. On the head by the anxious ram parents. I have some black tetras in there now and they are nice companion fish, not afraid to swim around with the large discus. Smaller tetras and even the rummynose tetras hardly seem to confidently swim with the discus out if fear of their large size. If I could get my hands on some emporers I'd have them in there.

Agreed.

I've kept rummy nose and cardinals with discus and they go well together.

Mark

[duffer]

Rams are good with discus. Cardinals are a good choice too.

http://www.aquariumhobbyist.com/discus/water/index.html

http://www.discushatchery.com/discustankmates.html

[Aquanero]

Rams are fine with Discus as far as water and temp requirements go but agree pairs will be a problem if you only have a 75. All male rams would be ok. I also use HOBs on my planted tanks. I have found Bio-wheels tend to drive off more CO2 than the regular type so I don't use them on planted tanks any more. One of the nicest dither I've kept with Discus have been Harliquin Rasboras there movements tend to be a little smoother than some of the tetras and swim nicly among the Discus. Another tetra I've had that was a total disaster with Discus were BATs too fast and hyper.

[discuspaul]

7 discus will be fine in a planted 75 tank I've kept 10 in my 72 bowfront without issue and with a small pleco or two and other small fish. I did 2 50 percent water changes weekly until they were old enough to only need one feeding a day. I have always run 2 large HOBs on that tank also without issue. I use the large marineland biowheels because the lip of the tank is too thick to accommodate the aquaclears. Over the years I've kept various small fish with the discus including rams. And would never put rams back in with them again because the rams get too aggressive towards the discus when the rams spawn. I did not like seeing the discus get pounded. On the head by the anxious ram parents. I have some black tetras in there now and they are nice companion fish, not afraid to swim around with the large discus. Smaller tetras and even the rummynose tetras hardly seem to confidently swim with the discus out if fear of their large size. If I could get my hands on some emporers I'd have them in there.

I'd like to add my complete agreement to this as well. I've been keeping 10 - 3"-4" discus in a 75 gallon planted tank for some time, along with a small school of cardinals, a few copper rasboras and cories, and some Amano shrimp. All doing very well with 2-3 50% wc's per week, and filtering with 2 AC 110's, which do a great job. You didn't mention the size of your discus, except that they had grown and were not too small. At any rate, you should be just fine.

[shaynablizard]

Thanks for the info. Mine are also 3-4" right now, but I want to know that they won't be growing out of it anytime soon. I would like to rehome many of my malawi cichlids and move them into a 125g built into my wall, but that's a looooong time away and not yet decided for sure. I did decide against the rams, but may look at adding a school of cardinals or rummynose at some point.

[discuspaul]

IMO you'll still be ok when they grow out to 5" or more, and that will take some time. Even 7 adult 6" fish will be ok in that 75 gallon, so long as you maintain adequate-sized, reasonably frequent wc's with that good filtration, and as long as you don't have too many other dither fish along with them. Maybe a small school of 20 cardinals & rummies, but not 40 or 50 other fish.
Hope this helps.