tanganikian cichlids, are these compatible?

[Ben]

hi, im setting up a 4' tank for tanganikians with lots of caves and rocks around, and a couple of vassilias(however its spelt) around. would these fish be compatible?
2xneolamprologus brichardi (male and female)
2xAltolamprologus calvus-white (male and female)
2xAltolamprologus calvus-Black (male and female)
2xTrophious Dubosi (male and female)
2xPseudotrophious daemonsoni (male and female)
2xJulidochromis marlieri (male and female)
2xFrontosa (male and female)
2xsynodontis angelicus (male and female)

ive been told to buy them as young fish in small groups, how many of each should i buy, and how long will i need to keep them until pairs form? one finial thing, what do i do with the other fish after a pair has formed, will my lfs accept them? cheers

[mosammy121]

you'r gonna need more than a 4ft tank,esp for 2xFrontosa (male and female)

and the tropheus need a strict veggie diet and should be in a species only tank.
the demasoni are malawi and should not be mixed w/tangs-

2xsynodontis angelicus (male and female)these guy's won't be able to handle the ph (should be 8 or higher)-how can you tell male/female?i have 2 and i can't tell :confused:

imo,the best mix would be-
2xAltolamprologus calvus-white (male and female)
2xAltolamprologus calvus-Black (male and female)
2xneolamprologus brichardi (male and female)
2xJulidochromis marlieri (male and female)

[Barbie]

demasoni aren't tanganyikan, neither are syno. angelicus, frontosa will eat everything in the tank eventually, the calvus types will interspawn with no respect to color variations,and tropheus really only thrive in a tank full of them and nothing else, due to their activity levels.

IME the Neolamp. brichardi will mature first, and manage to defend half the tank from everyone in it, keeping the pressure on the other fish all of the time. If you intend to take the pair out and use them to raise fry in another tank, that wouldn't be a problem. I have 9 calvus in a 75 gallon, and they do great. Most of the enjoyment I get out of them, is in watching the territorial behavior and bickering, with no real damage to the fish involved.

A colony of calvus (one color variant, you'll still see light and darker fish according to dominance) or gold compressiceps, some cyprichromis leptosoma to utilize the open space in the water column and act as dither fish, and 6 synodontis petricola, would make for an extremely interesting tank. You could add paracyp. nigripinnis, and a pair of julis pretty easily in a 75, but I'd recommend staying away from them if you're talking a 55 gallon. Each fish really does require their own space.

Hope that helps.

Barbie

(EDIT NOTE: Oops, seems I was typing while the original post was being answered by someone else. Please disregard the facts that I repeated:) )

[Kit Walker]

As a Neo. brichardi breeder I agree with barbie, the brichardi's if a breeding pair will defend a large space (usually only 2 pairs will command a 4ft tank but not always). You can get away with having a brichardi pair or 2, given the condition that all other inhabitants are strictly mid-top dwellers.

[Harry Tolen]

Lots of good advice given here already, so I'll just reinforce what some others have suggested.

It does make a small difference, by the way, whether the 4' tank you are setting up is a 55 gallon, or a 75 gallon, or a 90 gallon.

Of the fish you have listed, the N. brichardi and J. marlieri will do well in the tank you have proposed. You could also have one T. duboisi as a specimen fish, as long as it has lots of algae to graze on. My experience with the duboisi is that they can handle a certain amount of "standard" flakes and dried food, if they also get plenty of algae to act as roughage. Regarding catfish, of the synodontis species indigenous (and endemic) to Lake Tanganyika, S. multipunctatus would do best (well, S. granulosus would do well too, but I've only seen one in my entire life; they're not that common). Other synodontis species (such as angelicus) come from softer-water riverine environments, and may survive but won't be terribly comfortable in a Rift Lake environment.

If you could then find some Lampricthys tanganicanus (a killifish native to Lake Tanganyika) or Cyprichromis leptosoma (a schooling cichlid native to Lake Tanganyika) to occupy the upper water layers in your tank, you would have an active and interesting setup.

What are you going to do for filtration and water conditioning, by the way?

[Ben]

ive been told this on another site, is this bad info?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hmmm this is quite difficult because theres not really any hard and fast rule about fish stocking that really makes more sense than others. I like to understock all my tanks by about half because i enjoy working on the background effects.

To start off, if you get a new tank 4 foot tank get one that is Loooong and not tall (like the juwels) because most tanganikans like ground level (rocks and caves), some like mid range but very few hang around on the surface.

In a long 4 foot tank i would add 14-20 tanganikans, tanganikans tend to hit out at their own species once paired up but will leave others alone. The water needs to be hard in the tank at least 10dh. Crushed coral is a good substrate to place on the base of the tank.

You need rockwork in the tank with plenty of hidy holes set apart from each other.

Neolamprogus lelupi are vivid yellow (marine yellow) in colouration. The males are slightly larger in apperance teh feamles look a lot thinner. Ideally you need to find a pair of these but if you want to have more then make sure you get females and not males.

Trophious Dubosi are black in body with turquoise spots placed at regular intervals. The pattern changes to bands as they mature. Again the males have a white spot on the anal fin. I have been told that males like to have several femals around but personally think that a pair in their own little territory looks good. These are mouth brooding fish.

Pseudotrophious daemonsoni are another excellently marked chichlid with white bands on dark purple finished off with a vivid violet tint. You can get multiple females (3-4) to one male in your tank. They lay egges in caves.

Julidochromis marlieri are beige and dark brown/black chequered with a neon blue strip along the dorsal fin. If you choose these then get a pair because they will chase of any other julies.

Frontosa's are also nice fish to have, They are perlescent white with black bands and neon blue dorsal fins. They don't travel well so look for one that is well marked with erect finnage. One pair.

2 synodontis angelicus as target fish to be added last.

Thats at least 10 fish. Unfortunately not many Tanganikans shoal as they are too interested in keeping flippant neighbours off their territories. And you will find that although some male species like one than one female partner that most pair up with a single female. This is why they make such excellent parents.
The effect to expect when the tank is up and running is heavy rockwork with very vivid mixed colours flashing around the tank from mid to bottom range. These are the closest you can get to marine fish colours without buying a marine setup.

[Ben]

cheers barbie, its a 75g tank. could you give me numbers of how many calvus to start with, and how many cyprichromis leptosoma (look like stunning fish, cant think why i didnt see these first) and how many paracyps, nigripinnis, and i presume a pair of julies. whats this about buying a shoal of young ones and letting them grow on?how many should this 'shoal' contain and how long will it take for pairs to form?
cheers for all your help everyone saving me lots of heart ache for the future!

[Ledslnger]

Most of the questions have been answered. I wouldn't recommend a pair of Tropheus though. The males are too hard on the females and sooner or later the female would probably expire. Just my opinion. Most people recommend large groups of 12 or more. Check out JDtropheus.com for some info.

[Deb2]

I wouldn't put cyps and paracyps together.

[Barbie]

Why wouldn't you keep them together Deb? Mine do just fine. Cyps tend to school midwater, and paracyps tend to hang out at angles along rock walls or plants, higher in the water column than the calvus. They won't interspawn, have complete different, inoffensive behavior.

I'd recommend starting with 10 calvus, 8 cyps and 6 paracyps, with 6 syno. petricola, minimum. The juli. ornatus would probably be the julis I'd recommend for that tank. If you tell us where you're located, I can point you in the direction of the most reasonable place to purchase those fish. Right now, the only supplier that I use regularly that has them all is http://www.cichlidlovers.com. They're located in Arizona. http://www.frybabies.com is near philadelphia, if you're closer to them.

Hope that helps at all. Thanks,

Barbie

[Ben]

cheers barbie, thats great. im actually located in the uk, so both are a very long way away, but thanks alot, and if you know anywhere over here any good itd be much appreciated! thanks again. ben

[Ben]

just one final thing, how many males and females of each? sorry im fussy i know, next thing ill be asking you to come and set the tank up as well! cheers

[Barbie]

Young calvus are impossible to sex, and older calvus can be quite expensive, and are usually only available as wilds. They grow very very slowly. If you're going to buy adults, I'd recommend 2 males and 4 females personally, with two separate rock piles for them to claim and defend.

I used to do commercial tank maintenance, but I think the plane ticket to get me there just to set up a freshwater tank would be a bit cost prohibitive :D

Barbie