HELP! My Goldfish is dying!

[DrummerGirl]

I just got a goldfish on Saturday, we put the fish in a brand new 10 gallon tank. We put the bag in the tank first to get him use to it, then we used the stress coating liquid. Wednesday night I noticed he was sitting in the bottom corner of the tank, looking depressed, but I thought he was sleeping or something? However, all day Thursday he never moved. I went online and checked out fish deseases and I thought he might have Swimbladder or Flukes. It suggested to take out half of the water and replace it, then add 1 teaspoon of salt per gallon, which I did. I was going to get the Fluke medicine, but it said to try the salt first. Now it's Friday and the fish still seems the same.

How long does it take for the salt to work? Does it actually work?

Now I'm thinking the fish has Ick because he has the sugary/salt looking substance on his fins and tail, but I don't know if that is because I put the salt in the tank.

Help! :sick:

[OrionGirl]

So the tank was completely uncycled? Sounds like ammonia levels are spiking. Either get a test kits (ammonia, nitrite, nitrates, pH, KH and GH would be good) or take a water sample from the tank to your LFS for testing. Read up here on cycling--threads in the this forum as well as more in the Archives--and start doing frequent water changes to prevent the ammonia levels from getting any higher. You will need to use the salt, as it does sound like the fish has ich (a common occurance in some types of goldfish, especially those sold as feeders). Salt is effective, but it will be a long treatment, as raising the temp much will be detrimental to the fish.

You might want to consider getting a larger tank as well--most goldfish outgrow a 10 fairly quickly. What kind of filtration is on the tank?

[DrummerGirl]

It has a Whisper Power Filter it's meant for 5-15 gallon tanks. It has av disposable micro mess bag in it.

[victimizati0n]

um.. you cant put a goldfish in a 10 gallon tank.

He is probably more happy being dead then living in a tank that small.

[sdb]

um.. you cant put a goldfish in a 10 gallon tank.

He is probably more happy being dead then living in a tank that small.

That's not very nice, nor is it true.

[DrummerGirl]

:OT: Everything that I read online said that the rule is 1 Goldfish per 10 - 15 gallon tank. I'm not going to get an aquarium the size of my house to hold one Goldfish.

Anyway........
I started the cycling process yesterday, I got the test kit and something that takes the Ammonia, etc out, the water levels are a whole lot better now, almost where they should be for the Ammonia, only off by .02.

I have my fish in a smaller tank treating him for the Icks. This morning he didn't eat as much, but about an hour later he seems to be swimming around a little more.... we'll see how that goes.

Do you know if the Icks/Parasite medicine makes them eat less?

To be honest I am a little upset because I told the salesperson at PetSmart that this was the first Golfish we were buying, she basically said just put him in a bowl and he'll be fine. When I said I was getting him a tank no one said anything about cycling or Ammonia . What's up with that?

Thank you so much for your help and pointing me in the right direction.

[StreetCypher]

To be honest I am a little upset because I told the salesperson at PetSmart that this was the first Golfish we were buying, she basically said just put him in a bowl and he'll be fine. When I said I was getting him a tank no one said anything about cycling or Ammonia . What's up with that?


Well, the LFS, like any other place, is out to make money. So, cycling a tank=no fish you take home the day of purchasing your tank=less money for them. Although some employees are more helpful than others, i wouldn't recommend taking what they say for face value.

[~*LuvMyKribs*~]

And its best not to use the 1" of fish per so-many gallons of water rule. All fish are different, and a 5" fish will need A LOT more space than 5 x 1" fish. Its great you've gotten the goldfish a tank instead of a bowl, its a step in the right direction. However, goldfish do grow big and will probebly outgrow the tank. I suggest maybe making an outdoor pond out of an old Oak Barrel (get a lining and a pump and your set!). Goldfish prefer cooler water and will be happier outside anyways. Then you can use the 10 gallon tank for smaller tropical fish such as tetras or killifish (very colorful and pretty).

However for now its best to concentrate on curing the goldfish which you are doing a good job at. Ich will be gone within a week using Ich medication, during which the fish should be eating normally. Make sure he does because if he doesnt eat then he will get weak and the Ich will probebly kill him. Ich is caused by stress, and stress can be caused by an uncycled tank. Be sure to add ammonia to the tank if you are not keeping the goldfish in there or else the tank will not cycle.

I wouldn't reccomend shopping at PetSmart for fish. You can find an occasional employee who knows a lot about fish, but mostly they are not hired based on thier knowledge, they are hired for thier sales and people skills. Try to find a local pet shop that has more knowledgeable employees. Its hard at first but if you look around you will be able to tell what stores know what they are doing and which ones dont.

Well i hope that helps, and asking questions on here is a great way to learn things :D

-Diana

[31337]

Well, the LFS, like any other place, is out to make money. So, cycling a tank=no fish you take home the day of purchasing your tank=less money for them. Although some employees are more helpful than others, i wouldn't recommend taking what they say for face value.

Thats not very true, you can find really good, helpfull lfs's! That don't just want your money, coz unlike an organization(petsmart) they need repeat consumers, so if your fish dies straight away there rep will be damaged(lots of other reasons to)! So you can always find a nice lfs that will help you and make money out of you :dance

[PumaWard]

31337,
Most LFS's will not be truthful to you, period. Either they don't know, or they want you to come back every month to buy more fish to replace dead ones.... It's better, for us, to say that almost all LFS's give bad advice so, they learn from us and then can judge on their own who and who not to trust.

Drummer girl...

Pretty much, the "rule" is more like 20g for your first fish, then 10-15g after that. Often times, people leave out the 20g part.

Truth of the matter is, goldfish aren't really very well off in a 10g. They get big and they produce a lot of waste. Unless you want to do water changes 2-3X a week, then keep him in the 10g, but a 20g will give more leeway for both him and you. The other option is to take him back, finish cycling the tank, then go with fish more suitable for a 10g, such as White Cloud Mountain Minnows or all male guppies. The choice is really yours, and it's good at least your cycling the tank.

HTH, Puma

[31337]

31337,
Most LFS's will not be truthful to you, period. Either they don't know, or they want you to come back every month to buy more fish to replace dead ones.... It's better, for us, to say that almost all LFS's give bad advice so, they learn from us and then can judge on their own who and who not to trust.

What i'm trying to say is that some will, you just have to find the right one's. I have 4 fish shops close to me, and one i an excellent shop, i know the people in there, they help me with anything they can, give me free stuff, have never given me bad advice ect...But things like wallmart ect...are not like that, they basically suck at specilist things coz they huge organizations, but in your lfs(lochal fish shop, not organization, that would be lfo(lochal fish organization)), get to know the people there, get talkin, get friendly, get to know there faces ect...

[PumaWard]

I know, but a new fish keeper usually doesn't know the difference between good and bad advice :). I have a good LFS (though the owner tells certain people what they want to hear ;), and another where the guys spouts mistruths and lies.

[redwing191]

Seriously people stop bashing all lfs. I work at one and all my co workers have plenty of fish themselves and know what they're talking about. Given some employees at other stores have no clue about fish,(one told me a ram liked hard water like all cichlids). But not every employee at every fish store is like this. For a rule i dont trust wal-mart because they arent built around pets so obviously wouldnt have as much expertise in the area. I hate to see dead fish come in and never think "wow, more profit for the store, lets sell some more fish just to die so we can make money" i feel sorry for the fish and always try to correct the problem. I wont sell fish to anyone who i can tell wont beable to take care of them. Also customers need to do their part in taking care of pets.They should research before hand and know what they need, what to expect, and what fish are compatable. I seriously had a guy come in today and said he had a clown knife and a parrot cichlid in the same 10g tank and wanted to know what to add i told him neither of those should be in there. When i was working stock people would come in with a puppy and say "what do i need to take care of this?" why dont some people take any responsiblity for their pets anymore? Sorry but i just had a long day of work and i've seen so many posts bashing all LFS. Please dont generalize people.

[StreetCypher]

Theres no LFS bashing here. Just giving a friendly heads up that there may be misinformation coming up for newbs. I'm just saying that it would be wise to be skeptical about what they say, and then, based on your experience with your LFS, you can then judge whos reliable and whos not.

[Crabbypatty]

yep thats ich first of all how big is the gold fish??
the other thing is it might be becoming sensitive to light or lonely and stressed.

[the_dougie]

,
Most LFS's will not be truthful to you, period. Either they don't know, or they want you to come back every month to buy more fish to replace dead ones.... It's better, for us, to say that almost all LFS's give bad advice so, they learn from us and then can judge on their own who and who not to trust.


"Most LFS's will not be truthful to you, period."
Not be honest, period? The employees wouldnt keep their jobs long if they give nothing but false information. There would be plenty of complaints eventually.

"Either they don't know, or they want you to come back every month to buy more fish to replace dead ones...."
Unless all the employees work on commission, which is obvious they dont, ("oooh i sold some feeder guppies. Yeaa, ten cents in my pocket!") most wouldnt go out of their way to haggle you into buying a fish that's going to die several weeks later. Thats just evil :mad2.
If they do know, they'll tell you. Anyone who's worked with anyone else can tell you a fed up customer is a pain in the neck. There are a few who will make things up (or just be ignorant), and there will be some who will make the gutsy move of getting someone who knows more to help them.

"It's better, for us, to say that almost all LFS's give bad advice so, they learn from us and then can judge on their own who and who not to trust."
Don't be stereotypical. There's always those kinds of people but to label all of them like that is just...bah.

Anyways. This may not apply for your goldfish (as I've never kept those things -too messy and creepy looking) but he may be just depressed. After being moved to a new home and isolated, quite a few kinds of fish would just lie around like that. Sounds like ick, though, but IMO that stuff's easy to get rid of. good luck!

[Beeker]

It is never good to generalize about anything. Some people are well informed and others are not.

Drummergirl,
I have goldfish too. Through my own experience, I found that the people I have delt with at pet stores don't want to tell you that it is best to only have one goldfish for a 20 gallon tank because they will lose money. They would rather sell more fish. They don't tell you about the cycle because they will get a lot of money from people who want to buy products to try to clear the water and/or take care of their supposedly sick fish by buying medications, most of which are not cheap. I spoke to about 20 people at different pet stores (no exageration), and one person actually told me what was really going on. It is unfortunate, but true. You will most likely do well for your pocket and your fish if you checked the species profile and looked up goldfish.

[chrisinha]

something out of ordinary happened to me yesterday. i went to a petco and was decided to buy a pearlscale goldfish. i called the employee and asked her to get me one (there were 2 of them, really cute ones), but she turned and said "you dont want to get these, see the little white spots on their fins? It's fungus. We're going to start treatment today." I was shocked... by her honesty!! Then, she said that if i wanted to come back in one week they would be receiving more of those guys, or even if i want one of those, they will be available in one week. Unbelievable!

[Holly9937]

Maybe we should start a new topic to debate the LFS issue.....
Drummergirl As for the goldfish, it did sound like ich, you could try an ich specific medication as opposed to salt. It might work better than just salt. However, since the tank was not cycled, he might be in bad shape to begin with. Also, you don't have to get a tank as big as your house to hold one goldfish" but what you can do is buy fish that when FULL GROWN are of the appropriate size for the tank you have. Even if they are small enough at first, they will outgrow the tank and simly die prematurely and be VERY disease prone due to the stress of improper housing. Getting the right fish for you tank is not only good for the fish, but it will save you alot of money and trouble replacing fish!
Good luck

[Tuolumne]

Edit: Nevermind...that was weird....(don't ask)

[jdizzle1000]

Digging up an old thread just to bash the other responses? Really? Why? OG

[Larissa]

ummm, the last post on this thread was back in March.

[Kasakato]

Mar. 23, my birthday!

[Blueiz]

I think that we all could be more helpful to the newbies if we explained the reasons for posting something . Instead of posting vague things, for instance (sorry to pick on you , you are not the only one)

um.. you cant put a goldfish in a 10 gallon tank.
He is probably more happy being dead then living in a tank that small., that will only confuse a person more, why not try and be more helpful.
The person that started this thread genuinely wanted help for there fish. There are lots a varying opinions which make this place great for solving problems. There are alot of ppl on here that are just starting to keep fish, and learning how to do so. Years ago when I started my tanks I had no idea about water quality or fish, I just new I wanted one because it was pretty. Now I know that you don't get fish just because they are pretty and you can't just throw them in water and feed them every now and then for them to live, and thrive. After all this is the "newbie Forum". It is excellent that most of us know that a large goldfish will not work with a 10 gallon tank, but a 3 inch goldfish will work in a 10 gallon tank, the fish may not be the happiest in the world, but it can live. (if you raise a fish in a 10 gallon aqarium all its life, how is the fish to know any different?).
I know this is way off topic, but the way this thread went from somone honestly trying to help another person to ppl bashing other ppl for there own views and opinions about everything, I just think that was wrong. I love to here everyones views and opinions even if I disagree with them. I do not like to hear ppl thinking there way is the only way and not being open to anything else. Above all I don't think it is fair to the person that comes here to get help with there fish to have to put up with a bunch of ctiticism just because they want help with there fish and are truely concerned, and they truely do not know anything different than what the lfs has told them because they did not know any better until they had a probem.
I am by no means putting anyone down, lets all try to be helpful as much as we can to educate the ppl out there that are asking for education in the way of keeping fish. If you know how to help them then fine, but posting comments like the one above in quotes does not help, and leads to hurt feelings. There is no need to try and make yourself look better by putting someone else down, no matter what the reason is, in the end it is you who appears ignorant.
Everyone Have A Great Day!!.

[yohkos]

I have two petsmarts that I shop. Both of them seem to have knowledgable fish people. They always ask about my tank and specifics. I have to say I have been very pleased with them. It just depends on the salesperson. Unfortunately you ended up with a bad one.

Hope everything goes okay with your goldfish.

[chuckinwdc]

:OT: Everything that I read online said that the rule is 1 Goldfish per 10 - 15 gallon tank. I'm not going to get an aquarium the size of my house to hold one Goldfish.

You're quite right, DrummerGirl. One goldfish -- I'm assuming it's a juvenile fantail -- should do fine in a 10-gallon tank for a few years at least. That's assuming, of course, that you do weekly water changes and clean the filter regularly. I'm also assuming you'll have him alone there without other fish. Goldfish don't usually work well with tropicals.

I think your obvious concern for your goldfish and the efforts you're making to bring him back to health are commendable. It does sound like he's got ick.

Keep doing daily water changes while he's sick. Make sure the water temp for the new water is the same as the old water. Fancy Goldfish are very sensitive to quick changes in water temperature, and it often creates problems for their swimbladders.

I've kept goldfish for almost 10 years, and even have a 10-inch common goldfish that was originally sold as a feeder. So I know a bit about them critters. Contact me offline if you want more info or help.

Chuck in D.C.

[OrionGirl]

Check dates before adding to a thread. Really.