Non-Stem Suggestions Please

[Captain Hook]

I'm looking for a NON-stem background for my 24x12x22" tall tank. It's about 25 gallons with 40 watts of fluorescents, so roughly 1.6 wpg and no CO2 injection.

I was thinking about a sword but realize that it will just be too big. I don't mind if the plant takes over the back from left to right but it can't take front to back as well.

Aponogeton maybe? Any other ideas? RTR I know you are a big non-stem fan. Any thoughts?

[Leopardess]

A crypt. retrospiralis may work. They're very pretty. Any vals. I don't think you have enough light, but cyperus helferi is also a pretty grass plant, sans runners.

Java ferns. Narrow or regular.

If you don't mind switching the sword out when it's too big, it will work for you. It shouldnt' grow too fast in those conditions. Also,some LFS's will buy them back from you once they're large.

[RTR]

I use Val for the back and one side of my 30XH, but I'm using more light for a slightly taller tank with deep substrate - the tank is total 24 3/4", but only 18 1/2" from substrate to water level, 19 1/2-20" to the tubes. I started the setup with 4x20W, cut back to 3x20W so a nominal 2W/gal. The Val is gangbusters, have to thin and trim back runners regularly, but I love the look. The floor/carpet is Crypts, three variants of C. wendtii. Neither C. balansae nor C. spiralis did well in this tank for me - likely shaded too much by the Val.

There are small swords - both 'Compacta' (aka Tropica) and 'kleiner bar' are small, but I think that they would need more light.

I have done plenty of Apons (mainly the cheapie tubers dry packed which are largely crispus hybrids) at 2W/gal, but I don't think I have taken them below that either. They can get awfully big quite fast. Many are larger than anything shy of a several-year-old standard Amazon sword. They are spectacular while they are going. That light bright green really jumps out at you (or rather at me - I like it!).

Stems? Those things from the veggie filter that you feed to the goldfish?

[Captain Hook]

Thanks for the suggestions so far. Leopardess I may still consider the sword and the vals are definitely near the top of my considerations list. I have some in the 72 so once they start going wild I can try them out, see if I like the look or not.

RTR funny that you mention small swords because I do have a young one in the tank. It doesn't seem to want to grow very tall, I'm guessing because of the low light like you mentioned. I believe it's this type, identified on plantgeek as ech. bleheri. Looks almost identical to the pic in the 72. I'm gettign sick of the stem plants! I know how you feel now. They require constant pruning and I can't get them as dense as I would like.

http://www.plantgeek.net/images/plantpics/aquavisie_1951.jpg

I'm leaning towards the vals. I think they'll be easy to manage in these conditions. The rest of the tank is dwarf sag and crypt (lucens I think) foreground, small sword and java fern midground, and ambulia back right.

[Captain Hook]

Any experience with Bolbitis?

[RTR]

For me it is really current hungry (not an issue in my tanks), slow-growing, but it gets big eventually. It may like more light than my average tank and also for me requires the presence of Amanos or Cherry Reds to keep it clean. I will not use it in a tank with Java Moss - every stray strand gets captured in the Bolbitis and I have to pick it clean regularly with forceps, a PITA.

[Captain Hook]

Hmm, thanks RTR, doesn't sound like a good idea.

What about a lotus? Will it's leaves get too big and crowd the entire tank or will I be able to keep it fairly small?

I'm thinking about buying a bulb variety pack from Wal-Mart and see what I can get. If I don't like the plants I figure I can always use them for store credit.

[djlen]

Under your light the Lotus will probably grow straight toward the light and eventually cut it for the lower plants. Very difficult to keep them low when they are light hungry.
Vals. should do well, and look great for back drops, but once they take off, must be watched. They will send runners everywhere and into everything.
Apons. are a good choice. When they get tall, they can be selectively pruned back to reduce height.
Under your light, Barclaya Longifolia might be a good option, and give you some pink as well. They get tall and grow very fast under high light, but are more manageable at 1.5 watts.
In one of my tanks, I use a large piece of wood, covered with Java Fern and Anubia as a background that looks nice.

Len