DIY tank size recomendations

[Matak]

Yahooo! My wife gave me the green light to go ahead and build a dream tank. All I have to do now is to finish the bathroom and a small remodel of the bedroom and I will be set to go :rolleyes: (Like, this fall maybe)

It will be a plywood laminated with fibreglass tank that will measure five feet in width to comfortably accomodate four foot flourescent tubes. What I want to glean from this post is what depth (front to back) and hieght (top to bottom) is ideal for a planted tank. Take into consideration factors such as light intensity drop off with tank hieght, plant hieght requirements, ease of maintenance & pruning/planting etc. I am aiming for a wabi sabi Amano type of environment.

My thoughts on depth and hieght were 18" to 24" in either direction at 5' in width. What are your recomendations?

[SnakeIce]

I don't know what kind of space you have to fill...

since you are going to custom the tank why not an odd size like 5' by 4 or 5' and the 18-24 inches in height. I would want to be able to view several sides of such a tank, at least have two sides viewable.

if you can't go with that much front to back space, what about the foot print being 5' by 2.5'

55 gallon tanks are the extreme but alot of tanks have effort put into them to make them look farther front to back than they actually are... increase the distance to the horizon ie back of the tank and more possibility of design of the inside of the tank becomes possible.

part of the design of such a tank as you are after is the consideration of the room it is going to be in. it needs to be on a similar scale. strike a balance between loosing the tank in the room and overwhelming the room with the tank. if you are working with a small space you might have to push it a little bit on size and have to do some more work to make it look perportional with the rest of the room.

take some easily manipulated material to mock up the tank in the space you want it to get some idea of how the space is related to the tank. make sure you include the hight of the hood you build to make it apear clean and uncluttered.

take into consideration how you will be spending the most time viewing it and put the bottome of the gravel below the eye level or the water line above eye level for the majority of vewing time. consider variences in hight when you do this, making the tank the most viewable might make some chalenges for maintenance. create solutions; an elevated behind the scenes work area, a stool that give you the best angle to work in the tank or something to kneel on that lowers you to the most comfortable height.


yes I have spent some time dreaming about large custome tanks and about the things about my current ones that I enjoy or wish was different.

the hight the tank sits is less of an issue with taller tanks, I find the height it sits at most bothersome with my 5 gallon tank.

I would say the biggest factor I would pay attention to is the scale of the room and the over all impact of it. granted any size can be worked in and made to fit but if you arn't changing the rest of the room to match the tank I would do the opposite.

another way to look at the dimensions is taking things like the golden ratio and letting that have some input to your dimensions.


for the usual flourescent lighting over 24 inches is getting more taxing on the space required to light the depth.
but there are solutions for any depth, the tank that has me the most wowed of amano's is one that I guess to be 4-5 feet tall, 5-6 feet fron to back and 12-15 feet long. that tank is lit by 12 or 14 spot type lamps. I don't know what type but some high output lamp like halogen or somthing along those lines.

[Matak]

Wow SnakeIce, you have put a lot of thought into your reply. It is really appreciated.

Attached is the room it will be going in. The width of the room is 12' and it would be behind the blue couch.

I like your idea of the 2.5' depth. It does leave a lot of room for options. The aquascaping I had in mind has a series of hills & valleys so the extra back to front space would work well. It would mean that I would need almost 3' in total depth, front to back so I will have to take your 'overwhelming the room with the tank' point into consideration. But I want it :drool:

The tank will be viewed mostly from the couches or from a point at least 10' away so I won't have to raise it too high, probably typical counter top hieght.

One of the neat things about building a fibreglass tank is the flexability it gives to backgrounds and hiding equipment. I can drill a hole right through the back wall and hide it amongst some fake rocks or whatever.

If I want to go for 2.5 - 3 watts/gallon and want to grow a lush grass, should I stay relatively shallow, like 18" deep?

[SnakeIce]

my 20 gallon has 1.5 wats per gallon, is 15 inches from bulbs to where the dwarf sag is right under it and it is growing only very slowly.

if you almost double that amount of light I think 18 inches of hight will have way more than enough light to grow a carpet well.

75 gallon tanks are 20 inches tall and you are making your tank a foot longer

I think with that amount of light 20-22 inches of hight will be fine and with the extra length be a nice look

is the room longer than it is wide? if so you could make it take up the 3 feet and find some way to nicely use the small amount of space on either side(the holes) that would be nice.

while we are dreaming here you could make usefull built in cabnets on either side that are not full depth like the tank that would soften the space around the tank nicely. kind of how a fire place can jut out a little and still look ok. just keep mantenance in mind if you do :)

if you had 18 inch depth cabnets/bookshelves on either side and the front 12-18 inches of the tank sides are viewable glass like the front glass that would be an awesome set up and adress the context of the room... :) you could have your 2.5' depth and have it look nice too. If the room is still 13 to 15' by 12' or so without the 3 feet where the tank will sit that wouldn't be a problem with looks. I just didn't want to suggest a 3 foot chunk taken out of a room that is 8' by 10'. ;)

I've put alot of thought into what I like about tanks estheticly yes
so it was just a matter of writeing it down for you.

[Matak]

SnakeIce, you ROCK!

If you look at the left hand side of my little pic, you will see a cheesy metal cabinet that is our pantry. Your built in cabinet idea will really take care of that need and improve it asthetically in the process.

I am copying & pasting this one as a 'sticky' in my personal fish notes for when I get around to building this dream.

Gotta go finish a bathroom now :D

Thanks again buddy.

[geoffgarcia]

My thoughts on depth and hieght were 18" to 24" in either direction at 5' in width. What are your recomendations?
is there any reason your trying to break from the norm of 4' or 6' tanks?

I'm confused why you would even want to custom build a tank that isn't >200gallons?
surely its cheaper to just buy a prefab tank?

also I wouldn't go with NO lighting, explore PC and MH

[beviking]

I would consider the length of your arm when considering depth and width of the tank. It's a little less to consider if you can get to the front and back of the tank. Even with tonges/pincher tools, you can't really move rocks and other decor very well. Though I guess once it's set up, all you'll really move are plants...right? My tank is 24" high and to reach the bottom near the back of the tank is a stretch for me. I'm sure you considered this already but I didn't see it mentioned yet. :)
Good luck! SnakeIce certainly gave you some good info! Kudos.

[roliva]

is there any reason your trying to break from the norm of 4' or 6' tanks?

I'm confused why you would even want to custom build a tank that isn't >200gallons?
surely its cheaper to just buy a prefab tank?

also I wouldn't go with NO lighting, explore PC and MH

I have to agree. If you break down the cost for the plywood, fiberglass resin, and viewing pane(s), anything below 150-200 gallons would cost about the same as a regular glass tank.

[SnakeIce]

I would definatly include maintenance helps as a part of the design considerations. a small section used to hide the stool you climb on to reach in better, hooks in the ceiling to hold your hang glider sling just over the tank :D, special tools made or obtained to make it so you don't have to have your hands all the way in to the spot your working... just something that works for the design configurations. if you got those tools befor hand I would practice with them on tanks you have already to get to where you are comfortable with the idea.

with good husbandry you shouldn't need to do major rearanges, but the stem plant trimming and replanting from time to time should be made so its not to hard to do. require concentration maybe, entail a small ammount of effort yes but not be to hard to set up so you can do those jobs.

[Matak]

I have to agree. If you break down the cost for the plywood, fiberglass resin, and viewing pane(s), anything below 150-200 gallons would cost about the same as a regular glass tank.I currently work at a fibreglass factory and have 30lbs of scrap fibreglass pieces and expect to get about 50lbs more before I go back to my seasonal job in March. Really good quality glass too. My warm weather job involves applying dozens and dozens of gallons of epoxy so I wind up with at least 4 gallons of jug drain drippings alone each season. So my only real cost is plywood & glass.

As for the five foot mark, I want to go bigger than four feet, but I think my wife would be overwelmed with a six footer (she was surprised I wasn't going to build another 3 footer). Besides, my thinking is that a five footer would accomodate 4' long flourescent tubes better than a 4' wide tank, but I could be wrong. Also, customising (read: drilling) a wood/fibreglass tank is much easier.

Cost is a factor, but I will definately look into MH & PC lighting.

Beviking, your and SnakeIces comments are well heeded. I am built comfortably close to the ground so reaching into the tank will be a consideration, and this takes the maintenance issue into consideration as well.

*edit* :laugh: HangGlider eh? Show me the plans! go big or go home

[SnakeIce]

the lights I am planning to use on my 75 are T-5 HO flourescent

Drs Foster and Smith's T-5 bulbs and fixtures. (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/NavResults.cfm?N=2004+113175)

from the research I did on them I am planning to use just two 4' bulbs on the tank that now seems proverbial in that its allways planned but never done :rolleyes: :cool: :sad :p

they seem to have all the benifits of power compact without the drawbacks, the fewer bulbs than NO, and ballasts used to produce the light seems like it would make for less heat, not to mention their smaller size that makes reflectors for them more eficient-less restrike on the bulb.

they aren't real common yet so finding a way to diy them might be harder, but I thought the difference in electricity to run was a selling point that somewhat made up for the difference in initial cost.

I was planning to make my own parabolic reflectors, I can scan my diagrams in and send them to you if you want, Matak.

hehe the hang glider comment was just for jest but I was trying to make a point to consider unusual ways of dealing with it. :D

it gave me a thought :) after I got done laughing about it...

you could have a board that you put across over the tank between the built ins that you could hang a sling to support some of your wieght on to leave your hands free. would save those close calls leaning way over trying to reach something in the back... might be a chalenge to design your cabnets so it looked normal and still worked with your board when you needed it. and finish that board so it doesn't look to out of place with your nice cabnetry :)

and cleats around the edge of the stool if you are going to need one. wouldn't want you to loose your footing with your weight on the sling if you were up on the stool. those raised edges around the stool would give you an idea of where you are on it as well, so you don't have to be feeling around with your feet to figure it out.

I'd consider two stools. one that is the right hight so you can work in the front of the tank without bending over to much... you don't want to be up to high on this one. and the other one high enough so you have your belly over the top of the tank when you lean over it with the sling support and are reaching for the back of the tank.

make them nestable and a partition of the built in section to put them away when you don't need them would be the ideal arangement.

[roliva]

I currently work at a fibreglass factory and have 30lbs of scrap fibreglass pieces and expect to get about 50lbs more before I go back to my seasonal job in March. Really good quality glass too. My warm weather job involves applying dozens and dozens of gallons of epoxy so I wind up with at least 4 gallons of jug drain drippings alone each season. So my only real cost is plywood & glass.

As for the five foot mark, I want to go bigger than four feet, but I think my wife would be overwelmed with a six footer (she was surprised I wasn't going to build another 3 footer). Besides, my thinking is that a five footer would accomodate 4' long flourescent tubes better than a 4' wide tank, but I could be wrong. Also, customising (read: drilling) a wood/fibreglass tank is much easier.

Cost is a factor, but I will definately look into MH & PC lighting.

Beviking, your and SnakeIces comments are well heeded. I am built comfortably close to the ground so reaching into the tank will be a consideration, and this takes the maintenance issue into consideration as well.

*edit* :laugh: HangGlider eh? Show me the plans! go big or go home
Wow I wish I could get free epoxy!! Did you check to make sure it's water potable? Anyway, with your dimensions, you would need two 8X4 sheets of plywood, correct? If so, you could optimize and make a 6'X3'X2' (LXWXH) out of these two sheets. You would probably be happier in the long run. :dance

[beviking]

I currently work at a fibreglass factory and have 30lbs of scrap fibreglass pieces and expect to get about 50lbs more before I go back to my seasonal job in March. Really good quality glass too. My warm weather job involves applying dozens and dozens of gallons of epoxy so I wind up with at least 4 gallons of jug drain drippings alone each season. So my only real cost is plywood & glass.

As for the five foot mark, I want to go bigger than four feet, but I think my wife would be overwelmed with a six footer (she was surprised I wasn't going to build another 3 footer). Besides, my thinking is that a five footer would accomodate 4' long flourescent tubes better than a 4' wide tank, but I could be wrong. Also, customising (read: drilling) a wood/fibreglass tank is much easier.

Cost is a factor, but I will definately look into MH & PC lighting.


*edit* :laugh: HangGlider eh? Show me the plans! go big or go home

Free supplies are always a bonus! You lucky guy!
The initial cost has always kept me with NO lighting. Fewer bulbs with MH & PC lighting may be beneficial to some, but leaves less room to mix and match to your taste. It's been awhile since investigating pros/cons of either and I'm not claiming one superior over the other.
As for the hangglider/sling idea. Put it on a roller bearing track that spans over the tank and over your couch. Might make things go easier convincing your wife if she knows she's you're thinking of her too! ...just think about it :idea2: ;)

[Matak]

As for the hangglider/sling idea. Put it on a roller bearing track that spans over the tank and over your couch. Might make things go easier convincing your wife if she knows she's you're thinking of her too! ...just think about it :idea2: ;)
:laugh:
:laugh: :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

:idea2: . Hmmmm

[Matak]

Hey, why not. I've already got one of these:
http://www.paraglidingshop.de/airchair.gif

[beviking]

Hey, why not. I've already got one of these:
http://www.paraglidingshop.de/airchair.gif

...and look how happy SHE is!!! ;) :D

[Starry]

I don't think this was mentioned yet, but have you thought about an open tank? When I build my "dream tank" it will be open for sure. Especially since you're building it custom.

[Matak]

I don't think this was mentioned yet, but have you thought about an open tank? When I build my "dream tank" it will be open for sure. Especially since you're building it custom.
Open tank? I'm piqued, go on ..... :idea2:

[Matak]

Hey Starry, haven't seen you for awhile, how is U going? Could you explain to me what you mean by 'an open tank'?

[SnakeIce]

an open tank is just that, the lights are raised up from the water so the plants can grow out of the water. there are afew water plants we grow that won't flower under normal submersed growth but if they can grow out of the water they will flower.

however there are some draw backs to open tanks. the lighting has to be a little more for the same growth since its farther away. because the tank is open you might loose some fish to carpet surfing. and water loss will be greater, which might not be a bad thing if your house is usually very dry, but moisture problems are a concern.

it is another dimension, that has benifits only for a couple of applications. if you are just going for the underwater garden then I don't think it is to your advantage.

[Matak]

Thanx SI. So I guess the idea is similar to Aqua-Botanics cube tanks?