Ok, I give up!

[Corax]

I'm gonna make a pond this summer... I've talked about it for years, and now I'm finally gonna do it... So, I went to Home Depot yesterday and checked out what they had for me... I found kits that say they're complete, but we all know nothing is ever complete...

So, what all do I really need?

My plan is to build either a 4'x6'x1.5' 270 gallon or a 6'x4'x1.5' 550 gallon, so spec accordingly please...

Also, let's talk stocking... Besides Koi, what can be kept in a pond in East Tennessee? And how many Koi would be right for each of those sizes?

[aquariaddictus]

Koi and goldfish - thru the winter anyway. I breed tropicals outside in the summer in mine. I don't know much about lined ponds - I do have a good book. I'll go hunt for it, and send the name your way. later, that is
judy

[Corax]

I was reading at www.liveaquaria.com, which is a great place for saltwater fish, and I saw they had Koi... So I checked em out and found the minimum size suggested is a 1000 gallon pond... UGH! Is this the case or are they trying to push a bigger pond?

I guess a better stocking question would be..... What size pond would properly house 5-10 Koi? And, would an RTC winter in the pond happily?

[TJcanada]

Sorry, but no Koi would be suitable for those sized ponds..not long term anyways. Average minimum suggested volume of water per adult koi is 500gallons. If stocking is kept on the high end you may get away with 200gallons per adult. Keeping in mind adult koi can reach upto and beyond 30". You'd be better off to go with a few goldfish(comets/shubunkins). Depth is the issue in my opinion, not just for winte months but summer as well - shalower waters tend to flux rapidly in temperatures from night to day - and then there's the possible preditory issues. I don't know what kind of winters Tenn gets, but if your temps drop to and below freezing then 18" isn't deep enough in my opinion to over winter fish. Unless you plan on heating in the cold months then there aren't many other species of fish you can choose from - except natives - and again either size pond's depth just wouldn't be suitable.

As to what you'll need..... liner(ridgid or EPDM or concrete/fiberglass), an appropriate sized pump(external or internal - up to you), abs/pvc for plumbing(pipe/valves/couplers/adaptors), suggest some flexible tubing, some sort of filter(buy or DIY), and an electrical source near the pond with a GFI(this is a "must have"). Big consideration - add a bottom drain, you won't regret it.

That RTC...no go in my opinion, not if the water temps get to 65F and below.

If you like I can post some pond building/design site for you - some personal websites some commerical.

Just my thoughts,
TJ

[Corax]

well, you just effectively blasted my reasoning for having a pond right in the head... No koi = no need to pursue this idea any further..

Ohwell, I'll spend the $$$ on my salt tanks =)

Thanks folks!

[goldfish freak]

I am curious why you are not willing to build a bigger pond?

[Corax]

The location I want it, just outside my office window, is limited... The 550 MIGHT fit, but I doubt I'd have room for the rose bushes and bench I had planned... The 4x6 would have been perfect there.. That's really the only place in my yard I've considered putting it and anywhere else would be a let down... So, no biggie, I'll think of sumthin else to go there...

[TJcanada]

Now I feel like a "meanie"....... :( Sorry.....

EDIT: had a thought......since it's the depth that's the main issue here..why not "think deeper"?

a 4' x6' x 4' based on a rectangular shape with straight sides equals approx. 720gallons - good enough for 3 Koi , giving them a little over 200gals a piece.

a 4' x 6' x 6' based on a retangular pond with straight sides equals approx. 1080gallons - good enough for 5 Koi, giving them a little over 200gals a piece.

I didn't mean to discourage you RaVen..... there are many ponders who keep koi in less that "ideal suggested" conditions and their fish do well for a time. Going deeper is a solution - unless there's a reason it's not feasible - other than back breaking work.

Regards,
TJ

[Stephen]

Since the pond is out of the question... How about some bird feeders. Not fishy but there are only a few things better seeing what types of wild birds you can attract to your feeders and watching them eat and bathe.

[Corax]

I'm not totally discouraged, kinda bummed over the koi though... The pond for me was to be a place to relax and sit with my finace after a long day at work, so it wasn't going to be just an outdoor tank... That in mind, the Shubunkins and maybe some comets might work... Here is my first draft for a layout, a 4x8ish kidney... Whatcha think? The brown thing obviously is a bench or a swing or something 2 people can enjoy :D

http://members.aol.com/JustCluless/Raven/layout.jpg

[TJcanada]

Hey I like :D ..how deep? Ya know, after all the hard work..that's what it's supposed to be there for...peaceful, tranquil, and throughly enjoyable(besides the weekly maintenance, which I find some how relaxing anyways)...

I hope you do it RaVen.

TJ
p.s. if ya still want those links..let me know.....

[Corax]

I dunno, 15'-20' maybe? hehehe I'm sure it would seem like that by the time ya hit 3' by hand! Luckily I know a guy that knows a guy that owns a Bobcat with an arm... He can go to 4' down I think, but I'll probably go like 2' terraces and a 3' center... Gotta check with the city and find out what all is on my property, don't wanna blow anything up =)

I'm gonna try to get a scale drawing of my location together this weekend and do a better draft... I hate not knowing EXACTLY what will fit =)

Of course, I'm still convincing my finace that the pond is a worthy project... She wants a deck and jacuzzi, I do too but the $ isn't there heheh

Realisticly speaking, how much SHOULD this pond cost me?

[Ozma]

My pond is a similar size and shape and it cost me about $300 total. Hubby did the hole - by the way - think now about where all that dirt is going to go! Used old carpeting for the underlayment. The EPDM liner was about $100 (there used to be a good web site called affordableponds.com). I have 8' long stream with waterfall powered by a pump which also cost about $100. I used rocks from my property to anchor the liner and to be decorative. I do not have a filter, but lightly stock and use plants (particulary water hyacinths) as a veggie filter. Added fish, tadpoles, and plants for about another $100. I also picked up a heater ($15) to keep a hole in the ice in the winter and screening ($15) to keep the leaves out in the fall. overall, it has been rather low maintenance and great fun to have around.

[Wench]

Ya know Raven, just because your not sure if your doing the pond thing, don't mean the rest of us aren't interested in TJ's pond links. Will you ask her to post them already!! :D

[Corax]

lol! I'm sorry =)

TJ? Would you please post those links please? That was a total oversight, cuz I clicked yer sig link and assumed that's where you were talking about... Btw, yer not a meanie =)

[TJcanada]

:D that's good to know RaVen....

There are several ponding/koi links located on my sites LinkPage, but here's a few I don't have there.....

Links:

PetSolutions - commercial products list (http://www.petsolutions.com/cgi-bin/cgicatls?l=44)

WernersPonds - commercial site - good articals (http://www.wernersponds.com/)

Pond Building:
A Guide to Planning, Constructing, and Maintaining Recreational Ponds (http://www.aces.edu/dept/extcomm/publications/anr/ANR-1114/anr-1114.htm)

PondRushes - Chucks site his views on ponding (http://webpages.charter.net/crush11/) (site is being moved shortly but the info is there for now)

PondDoc - commerical site with some good info (http://www.ponddoc.com/Topics/construction.htm)

KoiFishPonds - under constant construction but helpful (http://www.koifishponds.com/)

KoiCymru - info on bottom drains (http://www.koicymru.co.uk/constbd.htm)

GuardianFilterSystems - commercial (http://nanaimo.ark.com/~podltd/guardian.htm)

FishDoc.net - informative site (http://www.fishdoc.net/filtration/koi1pollution.htm)

VetCentric - artical GoldFishPonds (http://www.vetcentric.com/magazine/magazineArticle.cfm?ARTICLEID=985)

These are just a few.. do a Google (http://www.google.ca/) search and you'll find plenty more..... just weed out the mis-information cause like with anything there's lots of it.

I do have plenty of my own opinions about products(pumps/filters/etc)..... always here to provide those if asked.

Have fun!
TJ

[Wench]

Thank you :p