RTR, I have a question.

[goldfish freak]

Hello RTR, I have a couple of questions concerning Dupla's Minikaskade. I know that you use these bioballs and the Eheim classic canister filters. Approximately how many of these bioballs would I need to fill a 2217? A 2215? I talked to a supplier that has this product and will ship to Canada, and he told me that the Minikaskade is sold in a package size rated on the amount of water in liters of an aquarium. He told me that he has the 100 liter and 200 liter sizes available. Are you familar with these package sizes? How many of these should I use for two 2217's and one 2215? Thanks.

[RTR]

I'm very familiar with that packaging - there is a row of stacks of those strange triangular boxes in the closet beside the fish room - I mean who packs spheres in triagular boxes? :rolleyes:

I use the tank volume (in liters) plus a 50% margin. As they already have a margin built in, I'm doubless way over-providing biosubstrate, but I am very conservative. I also have/had some very messy fish (puffers, the only fish that make Oscars look neat) in the tanks I used to develop the proceedure.

Don't forget the prefilter -that is a good part of the trick to the technique- have self-cleaning biomedia and keep the biomedia clean from incoming debris which could suffocate it.

Good luck with it... I love not having to clean my biofilters often.

[goldfish freak]

Thanks RTR. So then you use what ever size canister(s) that holds what you deem to be the appropriate amount of bioballs? In your experience how many boxes fill an Eheim classic 2217 filter? I want to get an idea as to how many boxes I will need to buy for my canisters. Thanks.

[RTR]

My canisters having the minikaskade are not full - they all have empty space at the bottom. The ones with the Ehfisubstrat are more nearly full, as I have no accurate surface area for that, I just run it most of the way up. But I much prefer the minikaskade - it really is self-cleaning.

I really do go by the tank volumes I'm using the units on more than the canister itself. But the Eheim site gives the contained volume of the units, and if Dupla does not give the volume of the packaging in space required, I'll measure the boxes and get an approximation for you tomorrow.

[goldfish freak]

Thanks RTR. I looked in the Dupla web site and I could not find any information as to the volume of the packaging in space required. Also what do you mean by: " I am using the units on more than the canister itself" ?

[Harry Tolen]

RTR: so the primary reason you choose Minikascade is that it is self-cleaning? In other words, all bio-balls can be colonized by bacteria equally well, but the Dupla product clogs less and thus requires less maintenance?

[RTR]

Exactly Harry - of all the media I've tested, this one (or these two, I use the Biokaskade in my W/Ds) is the best self-cleaner. It also does the job on the manufacturer's suggested volumes for biofiltration.

GF - apologies, I missed your last post, sorry.

I use circulation numbers more than the internal volume of the canister. If Eheim says canister model 1234 is good from 50-75 gallons, and I'm setting a tank in that range, that is the canister I use. This is wasteful of canisters, but I don't want to shortchange my tanks on turnovers for biofiltration - Eheim is not a high number of turnovers per hour company.

[goldfish freak]

No problem RTR, thanks for the info.

[RTR]

Harry - I realized I did not fully respond to your question. It has been some time since I did all my bioball tests, and most were done on W/Ds. For submerse use, I only tested the Minikaskade at first, because I liked the larger version best of the emerse bioballs. When Dupla became unavailable in the USA, I tried Eheim's Ehfimech (it works), fired clay balls (need the fine floss after, defeated my purpose), and large pea gravel (not self-cleaning at all) for submerse use, so the field was much narrower. I can't say about the efficacy of current brands for submerse use other than Dupla as I have not tested them. Any established company should give pretty reasonable estimates of voume or numbers need per tank volume.

GF - I finally measured the internal volume of the 200 liter (52.8 gallons) Minikaskade box. It is about 82.25 cubic inches. Dupla rounds off freely, they call 200 liters =~50 gallons.

[goldfish freak]

Thanks for getting that information for me RTR. Call me slow but I am a bit confused as to the 82.25 cubic inches of internal volume. Are you saying that the amount of bioballs that are in the 200 litre size box take up approximately 82.25 cubic inches in any given space? If this is so then what ever amount of bioballs there are in that size box would fit in a box that measured approximately 4.35"x4.35"x4.35". That seem like quite a small amount of bioballs to support a 50 gallon tank. Please enlighten me.

[Harry Tolen]

RTR, thanks for the clarification. I was wondering if you had tested other bioballs and found them wanting. I guess that experiment is still waiting to be run.

[RTR]

Harry, I did about 8 forms for the W/D tests, cut way back for the submerse as stated before - I was prejudiced toward Dupla since they were clearly 'way superior in W/Ds. If there had not been the supply interruption with import paired with my wanting to do the article on bio-only canisters, I would not have tested anything else submerse. I got a huge stockpile from when Burleson quit being the Dupla importer for the US and remaindered his warehouse. I did not need any more, but I could not do an article for mainly US audience without alternatives or the technique would have been of little utility.

GF - Yup. That is what totally self-cleaning does for you. And that has a wide safety margin. Remember that I do boost that by another 50% - if they call for that box in 50 gallons, I use a box and a half for 50 gallons. I'm neurotic, but I have not had a biofiltration blip since I started - In the now >12+ years I've been running bio-only canisters. And they need so little attention other than the prefilter rinses.

I pulled one of the fliers from the as-yet unused boxes, they say 3900mm2 per sphere = 29 cm2 each, or about 4.5 sq. in. each. They say that package has 140 spheres (I did not confirm that ;) ), so that would be about 630 sq. in., or ~4 1/3 square feet.

Compared to Ehfisubstrat or other glass media, that is small, but it is IME much more than adequate, in part because it never changes. The old biofims shed well, leaving space for new colonization. The original test Classics are still going strong. I'm using more FilterMaxIIIs as prefilters now, less DIY, but the same functionality. I do still have the original prefiler setups going, not all the original sponges though.

[goldfish freak]

Thanks again RTR. You mentioned that you use Filter Max III prefilters on your canister filters. Does the Fliter Max I work as well as the III? Is there any difference besides size? I would prefer to use the former since it is a smaller size sponge, which I would be able to hide more easily.

[RTR]

Now you are confusing me - I thought I & III were the same size, I being a finer foam than III, and II being 1/2 size?

The suitability of the half-size model, whatever the number, would depend on the particulates in your tank. If you are using other mechanical-only filters, it might go. If the tank is large enough to use a 2217, the half-size prefiler is going to clog fast.

[goldfish freak]

Hmm...I don't know. I know that there are different sizes but I just assumed that the "I" was the smallest and the "III" the largest. I did not know that one was a finer foam than the others. I will have to see if I can verify what inforamtion is correct. By the way I have 120 gallon tank, and I am planning on using the prefilters on a classic 2217 and a 2215(filled with Minikaskade) and using another 2217 for mechanical filtering only, filling with only the coarse filter pads and a fine filter pad on top. What do you think?

[RTR]

That should work fine. i'm too lazy to open canisters for frequent mech cleaning, but it does work.

[Richer]

goldfish freak - I'm curious, who is this supplier that is willing to ship up to Canada?

-Richer