Help controlling my PH!!!

[pzuzu]

I have been using a DIY CO2, actually 2 of them running at the same time in 46g. Is this too much, or is it okay?

I just did tests on my tank and my tap water.

Tank specs -

PH 6.4
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0.25ppm
Nitrate - 10ppm
GH - 3
KH - 2

Tap Water specs -

PH 6.4
GH - 3
KH - 2

It seems that my CO2 has not affected my PH, but that my PH is that low concerns me. I would really like to raise it to 7. Is there anything I can do to achieve this? The fact that my tap water is so low is troublesome. I bought some Seachem PH 7.0 Liquid Neutral Regulator but wanted some opinions/advice before I poured that stuff in my tank. Not to mention that it appears to take the entire bottle practically to make it work.

Also, is there anything I can do to harden my water, or those specs okay? And if so, will this in turn raise my PH to a more balanced level? I do keep some maylasian driftwood in my tank, but it has been cleaned of all tannins. I also keep a lot of plants in the tank.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!
Fernando

[reiverix]

Let the tapwater sit overnight before taking a reading if you didn't already do that. Your KH is also just a wee bit too low for safely injecting CO2 (even DIY). Think about adding some aragonite or crushed coral to your filter to buffer it up a tad, to at least 3KH.

Also, don't bother adding pH altering chemicals. They will cause nothing but trouble. You'll find that most fish and plants are very tolerant of a wide range of pH levels.

Do you have fish in your tank? Nitrite is on the high side.

[NowherMan6]

Well, to answer your question, if you want to raise you ph along with your hardness, get a little mesh baggie and put some crushed coral in it, then put it in your filter. Crushed coral will rasie your ph and buffer your water, but it may make it too high for you. Use a little bit and keep testing to see if it works. using chemicals to acheive a certain ph is artifical and temporary. In general, the less chemicals you add to your tank, the better.

But more importantly, if you don't mind me asking, why do you want a ph of 7.0? Any fish will adapt to the water you have, and having a constant ph is much more important than having a certain ph. Usually when you try to mess with ph it causes fluctuations that are more stressful and harmful to the fish. If I were you, I'd just leave it as it is. Just MHO.

[pzuzu]

Thanks for the quick replies!

I'll definately try out the crushed coral idea. I hope this is something I can attain from my LFS easily. And the main reason why I would like a higher PH is because I have plants in there and need to feed them CO2, and after all I've read on how CO2 causes a drop in PH, I figured I probably couldn't have anything like that happening. So I would like to raise the water hardness and PH levels to keep it more balanced. Is there another alternative to keeping my plants with plenty of CO2 and not drop the PH levels anymore and just leave it as is at a PH of 6.4? I've read that Flourish Excel can provide plants with Carbon... but wasn't sure if this was enough. I've also read that they thrive even better with Flourish Excel AND CO2 injection.

Is there another route I can take here? You're right about leaving it as constant as possible, especially since the water I'll be using for water changes will be my low PH tap water. That means that I'll always have a PH fluctuation (I think, even though I would only change a small percentage maybe once a week or every other week). So it makes sense as to how that would cause extra stress on my fish.

I do have fish already in there. I had cycled my tank for about six weeks and all the levels read very well. So I went ahead and added fish only to discover it wasn't fully cycled because the Nitrites went up to 5ppm. I did a small water change everyday and the Nitrites still wouldn't go down (I imagine it was because they were much higher than 5ppm but that's the highest my test would read), so I bought some Seachem Stability to aid in the cycling process (though I have read how this stuff doesn't really do anything at all). And within two days the Nitrites dropped to 1ppm, two days ago. And today it is at 0.25 ppm. All my fish seem perfectly healthy for the moment. I hope it remains that way. I'll be doing another small water change today. Hopefully that will clear out the rest of the Nitrites. I think I have this aspect under control. I just need help/advice/other options as to my PH and plants needing CO2 dilemma.

Also, if I use the crushed coral, which I will go try to find today... how big should the PH increase intervals be? I know I shouldn't just change it all at once, but little by little. Perhaps .25 every other day? More gradual than that? Less?

Okay...thank you so much for the comments so far.

[reiverix]

Well apparently aragonite seems to better than crushed coral at buffering your KH. I've used a half cup in my filter for the last four months and it's still going strong. It will also raise your pH. Try using a tbs or so at first and keep checking every day. Add/subtract as needed.

When you measured your tapwater pH did you let it sit overnight? You might be surprised at the change. My tapwater comes out at pH7 and left overnight it rises to around 7.5(ish).

[pzuzu]

Reiverix -

I'll definately try out the aragonite. Hopefully it will be easily attainable. Also, I have not tried letting my tapwater sit overnight. I will make sure to do so. Perhaps this increasing is what makes my tapwater and tankwater have the same PH, considering I'm using diy co2. But the aragonite sounds like it's worth a try. I'll make sure to get some ASAP and give it a shot. Even if I just raise my PH a little bit more, it'll make me feel more comfortable. Even if I don't get it to a neutral 7, I would settle for 6.8. I just fear for my fish.

Thanks for the help!

Fernando

[reiverix]

No probs. But still, a pH of 6.4 is nothing I'd worry about. I keep mine around 6.5 and I've accidentally let it bottom out to 6.1 with no signs of distress to my fish. Your KH is one thing I'd address.

[pzuzu]

Reiverix - I tested my tapwater after letting it sit overnight. It came out with a PH of 6.8, I retested my tank and it is still at 6.4. I guess there has been a drop due to the CO2 after all. I still haven't gotten the aragonite, but I will as soon as I can and go from there. Again, thanks for the advice. Another reason why I'm worried about it is because of my platies. They need to be at a higher PH and with slightly harder water, so I just really want them to be comfortable as well. Which explains why lately they haven't been very active and stay low in the tankever since I put in the diy co2. I think just a little bit higher PH might do the trick...here's hoping.

Fernando

[Left C]

Nitrite - 0.25ppm
KH - 2
Tap Water specs -
PH 6.4
KH - 2
I bought some Seachem PH 7.0 Liquid Neutral Regulator but wanted some opinions/advice before I poured that stuff in my tank. Any thoughts?

Thanks!
Fernando

Hi Fernando,
You really need to get your KH up to a level between 3 to 5 dKH. Seachem makes an Alkaline Buffer in the powder form and in the liquid form. Both products are made for planted tanks and has no phosphate.

Powder: http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/AlkalineBuffer.html

Liquid: http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/L_AlkalineBuffer.html

If you have not used the Neutral Regulator, you need to take it back and get your money back because it is a phosphate buffer. Phosphate buffers can cause algae build up. With the Alkaline Buffer, you can raise your pH and your KH. If your KH is 2 dKH or lower, you can have large pH swings with your CO2. As mentioned, your present pH should not be a problem. Most aquatic plants do well at a pH a little lower than 7. An inconsistant pH is what normally stresses fish out. Platy's, Swordtail, and Guppy's like an alkaline pH but they should do fine in your slightly acidic pH.

Use can also use Baking Soda (like Arm & Hammer) to increase your alkalinity and your pH. You can use 1/2 to 1 teaspoon per 10 gallons of water daily to get your target pH and KH. Keep a record and you will know how much to add when you do water changes.

If you are using crushed coral to increase your alkalinity and pH, that's fine.

To increase your GH, you can use Epsom Salt (MgSO4*7H20) or Seachem's Eguilibrium for this.
Equilibrium: http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/Equilbrium.html
MSDS for Epsom Salt: http://msds.farnam.com/msds/m000676.htm

Your Nitrite level of 0.25 ppm needs to be addressed. This can certainly stress the fish. Hopefully you plants will help here. My question is: if you have a lot of plants, why do you have any measurable Nitrite level? Is this a new tank or is it overstocked? If you've mentioned this, I missed it.

I hope this helps you a little.

[djlen]

To reiterate what John mentioned, address your kH issues as soon as possible because with that tiny (almost non-existent) buffer you've got, you're playing with fire by injecting.
To be safe, you need a kH of at least 3°H and 4°H would be much better.
My advice is to take back any chemical buffers you have and pick up some crushed coral for the long term and some baking soda for the short.

Len

[pzuzu]

Thanks for the newest replies. I just did another test on my tank and got the following results. Actually I have two tanks, one ten gallon and one 46 gallon. The diy co2 injection is in the 46g. Here are the results to both of them:

10g

PH 6.8 (like the tap water after it sat overnight)
Am - 0ppm
NI - 0ppm
NA - 75ppm (eek!!! don't worry, just did a water change)
GH - 3
KH - 2

46g

PH 6.4 (decrease from tapwater probably due to diy co2)
Am - 0ppm
NI - 0ppm (yes, it was at 0.25 but I knew it would come down today, tested it twice just to make sure!)
NA - 10ppm (even with all the plants...)
GH - 3
KH - 2

I added 1/4 and an 1/8 (what's that 1/6?) teaspoons of baking soda to my ten gallon tank first to experiment before I added to the 46g and it took the PH to 7 from 6.8 and the KH went to 3 from 2.

Then I added about 4/5 of a teaspoon of baking soda to my 46g and it took the KH to about 3.5 and the PH to 6.8. Wow...those are some quick results. I'm almost afraid of the sudden increase. I hope this doesn't harm my fish in any way. I was crossing my fingers the whole time I did it. But I trust you guys. I'm so glad I didn't put in two teaspoons for the 46g!!! I almost did.

So now I guess I want to know if I should go ahead and get aragonite or crushed coral for the filters or if I should just add a little baking soda after each water change. Which is more beneficial of the three? And if anyone minds explaining the reasons I would really really appreciate it! I like to know why stuff works and not just that it does. :)

Thank you all for bearing with me!
Fernando

[djlen]

I have no experience with argonite so I won't address that.
Baking soda is a quick fix for buffering up your water, but as you know must be supplemented to maintain effectiveness.
Crushed coral placed in a nylon filter bag and into a filter, will buffer up the water for a longer (months) period of time and breaks down so slowly that it's more of a 'permanent' solution for soft water issues.
I usually suggest that if you are injecting and have low kH, start with the Baking Soda and also add the coral. In about 3 weeks or so you should see your kH holding and not need further supplementation with the Baking Soda.
Crushed coral is usually available at any LFS that deals in salt water tanks. The trick is to get a small quantity which I found elusive in my area. You don't need a lot of the stuff. I noticed a bucket of used coral on the floor of the LFS and asked if I could buy a pound of it. They gave me a couple of pounds, which should last me several lifetimes:). Very slow acting but effective. Try a tbsp. in your filter and keep an eye on your kH. Adjust as necessary for 4°H or so.
If you can wangle some used coral bring it home, spread it on a cookie sheet and bake it at 350° for 15 mins. in the oven to kill off any varmints/bacteria and you're good to go.

Len

[Left C]

Here's some articles about aquarium chemistry. I hope this will help you.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/articles/chem.shtml
and
There's two good articles at Seachem's site. "CO2 in the Aquarium" and "Understanding the General Chemistry of the Planted Aquarium." They're the last two on this list.
http://www.seachem.com/support/Articles.html

[RTR]

Aragonite does the same job as crushed coral, it just does it a bit better largely because it is more soluble at FW pHs than is crushed coral, otherwise the effect is the same.