New Goldfish Tank Advice, Please

Roan Art

Roan Art

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Oct 7, 2005
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Posting this in Freshwater General as well
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I'm going to be upgrading all the tanks in the house at the end of November. The fish in my 36g bow will be going into a 90g, the fish in my son's 20g will be going into my 36g bow and his 20g will be going to his sister.

Now, I'm replacing my son's 20g tank with a 30-40g one. He's decided that he would like a fancy goldfish in his tank. Okay, so now to the questions:

1) What is the actual difference between a Fancy Tail and a Ryukin?

2) I've read that the temperature should be 35 to 75 degrees. Our house is usually on the cool side at 72-74 year round. This is sufficient, I hope?

3) Possible to put both a Fancy Tail and a Ryukin in a 30 gallon tank? Not sure how big they would be, but the Fancy Tails we were looking at were about 2½-3"

4) If yes to #3, do they have to be the same size?

5) Possible to have tropicals that have a temperature range within the limits of the goldfish in with them? I was thinking of transferring his candy stripe pleco (72-77 degrees) and adding a small school of Corydoras (72-77 degrees) to help with the maintenance. Whiteclouds?

6) Any other compatible fish suggestions?

Thanks for your time!
Roan
 
Have a look at the links below; there is a lot of information on Fancy Goldfish (every fish to be precise). It’s never a good idea to mix “cold water fish” with “warm topical water fish.” You’re Candy Stripe Pleco needs a temperature around 74–79; While a Ryukin Goldfish needs a temperature around 65–75. A Cory Cat will stay too small to be kept with such a large fish like a Ryukin Goldfish (remember this; any fish that will fit into their mouths will become snack). 30 gallons is recommended for one Fancy Goldfish, they can live for up to 20 years, get up to 14 inches, and a heater is not required for them (room temperature will be sufficient). Goldfishes in general are very messy by nature, so a filtration system rated for two times the size of the tank is recommended (a 20 gallon tank will need a filter rated for a 40, a 30 needs a 60, and so on).

links

Fancy Goldfish!

Candy Stripe Pleco!

Ryukin Goldfish!

Cory Cat!

I hope I have provided you with enough information for you to make an informed decision. If anything is unclear to you, then let me know, and I will explain with more details.

I wish you the best of luck!
 
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Master Zero said:
Have a look at the links below; there is a lot of information on Fancy Goldfish (every fish to be precise). It’s never a good idea to mix “cold water fish” with “warm topical water fish.” You’re Candy Stripe Pleco needs a temperature around 74–79; While a Ryukin Goldfish needs a temperature around 65–75. A Cory Cat will stay too small to be kept with such a large fish like a Ryukin Goldfish (remember this; any fish that will fit into their mouths will become snack). 30 gallons is recommended for one Fancy Goldfish, they can live for up to 20 years, get up to 14 inches, and a heater is not required for them (room temperature will be sufficient). Goldfishes in general are very messy by nature, so a filtration system rated for two times the size of the tank is recommended (a 20 gallon tank will need a filter rated for a 40, a 30 needs a 60, and so on).
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I had also posted this in the Freshwater Forum and have answered some replies there. They pretty much agree with what you've said, however I'd advise you to *not* to use LiveAquaria's data for advice. They are usually wrong in respects to temperatures, size and just about everything else. I've sent them at least 3 emails with corrections to their web site and they are in the process of fixing them. I think the worse mistake I saw was in their listing for otocinclus cats. Apparently they have no problem at all breeding in aquariums and it's a very common occurence. They are fixing that little faux pas.

The correct temperature range for the candy stripe pleco and corydoras are as I posted, 72-77 degrees. LiveAquaria's data is incorrect. I correlated my data between 3 different sites, including Aquaria Centrals species database and PlanetCatFish.com.

Thanks for taking the time to respond to my inquiry. Majority rules, so no tropicals :)
I'll ponder the wisdom of getting a larger tank for my son so he can have 2 goldfish. He's only 4, so it's me that actually looks after it.

Once again, thanks!
Roan
 
I'd advise you to *not* to use LiveAquaria's data for advice. They are usually wrong in respects to temperatures, size and just about everything else.
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I have to disagree, their information has proven to be very accurate in conjunction with my experience. See, before I had been introduced to their site, I used to make a lot of mistake, and my fishes always paid the ultimate price. For example I used to put 20 small Goldfish in a 40 gallon tank; although I had an outdoor pond I thought that they were too small too survive in it. Of course I was wrong, and as a result they died of ammonia poisoning. When I got my Oscar, I was told that they were very aggrieves by my LFS. They told me that I should not put a small fish like a Black Convict in with them, because the Oscars were too aggrieves and would probably eat them. Well, they were dead wrong; in fact my Black Convicts murder two of my Oscars. If I only had giving them the recommend tank size like the site told me, then my dead but not forgotten fishes would have been alive today. After I visited they site I have been able to keep my finned-friends alive and healthy. I got them they recommend tank size and temperature settings. I have 12 Goldfishes that I once thought were too small to survived in an outdoor pond, alive and healthy; they have grown quite large in about close to one year’s time. I have been able to successfully kept two Oscars three Bala Sharks two Columbine Sharks in a 125 Gallon tank, with absolutely no problems at all (I think that the only reason that they have Oscars mark a aggressive is because they will eat small fish, but that same characteristic goes for every fish, not only the large ones). The Convicts are thriving in a 40 gallon tank, they even had fries! I also have ten Ghost shrimps and 5 Neon Tetras in a 20 gallon tank (will be upgrading their tank soon), no problems there either.

The point of all this is that it’s not really fair for you to say that they are always wrong in “just about everything else,” because their information is good enough to keep your fish alive and happy. They have been accurate in the recommend tank size and aggressiveness of a fish to me. You are right about one thing; they are not always accurate when it comes to the maximum size of the fish. I can easily disprove every site out there, by saying that every tropical fish will do better with a temperature setting that is closer to 80 (75-80). See, most people turn the temperature up to 77-80 when a fish is sick. Why not keep it up there? They seem to be healthier with that temperature setting (recover form illness, wounds heel faster, they are more active, more energetic). Remember this; you must always take information with a “grain of salt,” unless you know how that conclusion (information) was reached!

*** Side Note: I also looked up the Otocinclus Catfish, and there is nothing there about them not being able to breed in captivity! ***
 
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I research and correlate everything with 3 or more different sites. I never take the word of any 1 site anymore. I always go to LiveAquaria as a starting point, take their information and verify it against at least 2-3 other sites.

That's why I know much of their information is incorrect.

They've even told me they are in the process of fixing a lot of their pages that are wrong.

Master Zero said:
*** Side Note: I also looked up the Otocinclus Catfish, and there is nothing there about them not being able to breed in captivity! ***
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If you are referring to sites other than LiveAquaria: check http://www.otocinclus.com
It's only been documented a couple of times. It's not a "normal" occurence at all and it's definitely not being done commerically.

However, if you are referring to what LiveAquaria had on their site: That's because I wrote and told them it was wrong and they fixed it. I doubt they would just go by what I said and would have verified it themselves. Right?

Hah, they fixed the Ghost Shrimp page too. Good job and quickly done. A+ for that, LiveAquaria. Most sites would drag their butts on fixing things like that.

It used to say they grew to 1" and had black eggs. It's 2" and green eggs. Threw me for a loop when I saw the shrimp I bought from them grow double the size they said and carry eggs of a different color. Consulted two sites to verify that I did, indeed, have ghost shrimp. I let LiveAquaria know they were in error.

Regardless, use whatever you like. I was only advising the verification of any one site's information. Any research should be verified by more than one source. It only makes sense.

Roan
 
I would love to see pictures of your tank. Do you have any?
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Sorry, but I don’t have any pictures as of yet, but I will be taking some by Christmas and I may resurrect this old thread are start a new one to post them. So be on the lookout (just kidding)!
I never take the word of any 1 site anymore.
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Regardless, use whatever you like. I was only advising the verification of any one site's information. Any research should be verified by more than one source. It only makes sense.
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I never intended to imply that they should be your only source, but that they are in-fact a reliable sources. Dr. Foster and Dr. Smith are Doctors in their fields; they have more than 3000 written articles, which have to stand for something. They have earned credibility for their degrees and years of hard work and experience; you can’t say that about most sites. I visited http://www.otocinclus.com (I’ am just using this site as an example, it could be any site), and there was nothing there that show me why I should believed the author of that site over two veterinary; which one has more credibility? I just can’t understand why you made such a forceful statement like that (I'd advise you to *not* to use LiveAquaria's data for advice), without a compelling explanation. No one really follows information that precisely that their information would be dead wrong to provide as guidelines for those that come here in desperate need of help. Remember when I said, you must always take information with a “grain of salt,” unless you know how that conclusion (information) was reached! Well, I know how their information was reached (years of study).

Ok fine, maybe they had some mistakes (and they still do), it nothing major that will kill our finned-friends; as long as you follow the recommend tank size and take into account their aggressiveness, then everything else should fall in place!
 
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