Should I "euthanize"?

[TXSlug]

I've had a tank set up with cichlids for a little over a year. Until a few weeks ago, I had not had a single death in that time. Then I had a single fish die without apparent cause. The LFS, which is very reputable, diagnosed the death as murder b/c the cichlids were reaching sexual maturity. The LFS also recommended increasing the number of cichilds in the tank to reduce aggression by overcrowding. At the time, I had 10 assorted cichlids (and 2 plecos) in a 72 gal tank. They were all about 3-4 inches long.

After waiting a week with no further signs of distress in the fish, I added 3 cichlids to the tank, and then 3 more a week after that. Perhaps a week after that, I noticed that the fish started behaving strangely...no appetite, gasping near the surface. A day or so later, they began swimming erratically and rubbing against the gravel and rocks as if they had parasites. One fish died.

I treated for 3 days with Clout, but there was no improvement and another couple died. I performed a 50% water change, then treated for 5 days with Quick Cure, the maximum number of days listed on the bottle. Yesterday was the fifth day. Since I started on Quick Cure, one more died, last Friday, but in general most of the remaining cichlids are eating and behaving normally.

However, two are not -- one is listless at the bottom of the tank but has no visible parasites or spots, the other is covered in white spots which I assume are Ick. I don't know what else to try, and am very frustrated seeing one die every few days. My question is should I remove the two sick ones in the hope of saving the others? I hate to kill them when there's a chance they can survive, but I don't want to risk the remaining fish.

Please help!

[O-man21]

It's always hard to decide that. It's pretty much up to what you think, if the other fish are healthy, then they might not be as susseptable to the diesease, but then again....

P.S. Welcome to AC!!

[VoodooChild]

I actually went through this not to long ago with some altospinosas, and the closest diagnosis I could come up with was blood flagellates, but I couldn't be sure without a good microscope. I've lost 2, with one remaining, and he eats fine, but no matter how much he does eat, he still looks emaciated and colorless. When your fish died, did they just die, as in you found them on the bottom or top in the morning, or were they barely holding on or undulating on the bottom or something to that extent? And these spots...how big are they? It could be velvet or some for of fungus. I don't know why they were gasping, any sort of ammonia or nitrite spiked would've happened much sooner than a week, but that's all I could think off.

[TXSlug]

Thanks for responding both O-Man and Voodoo.

To answer your questions, the fish that have died have not appeared emaciated, but their color is somewhat dulled. All of them have been on the bottom when I found them, but I wouldn't call it sudden...I've actually been dishearteningly good at predicting the next to go. I've also apparently been dishearteningly good at diagnosis.

On most of the body, the spots look very small, smaller than a grain of salt. Near the mouth, however, it looks more like what I guess fungus would look like--kinda like clumps. So maybe I should look into that some more. However, this fish is the first one to show these symptoms, the others who died did not have spots or anything, so I think they died of something else...

I've been testing the water regularly, and haven't detected any ammonia or nitrite.

All the posts about Ick I've read recommend continuing treatment for three days after symptoms are gone. QuickCure says to use for a maximum of 5 days. So does that imply that symptoms are usually gone in less than 2 days?

[Tightdog1]

by adding more fish (cichlids in particular) you have disrupted the fish chemistry and also added to the stress not reduce it, dependsing on what kind of cichlids you had/added sicne you didnt say what you had.


What kind of fish are in there right now?

[Tightdog1]

by adding more fish (cichlids in particular) you have disrupted the fish chemistry and also added to the stress not reduce it, dependsing on what kind of cichlids you had/added sicne you didnt say what you had. the LFS probably took advantage of you into buying more fish and not properly diagnosing the problem, IMO death as murder from cichlids reaching sexual maturity is total BS and i have never heard of it except in fish jumping out of the tank.


What kind of fish are in there right now?

[TXSlug]

The one with fungus/ick/whatever died last night, leaving:

1 electric yellow hap
3 red zebras
1 bumblebee
2 johanni
1 electric blue hap
1 cobalt blue
1 unknown

In defense of the LFS, they told me to wait a week and watch closely for any symptoms in the fish. I did, and didn't see any symptoms. I have also read in many places about the idea of crowding them to reduce aggressiveness.

The remaining cichlids seem to be doing ok now, and I just did a water change. However, since there was the one who died last night, I have not continued medication for 3 days after no signs of symptoms. I had used the Quick Cure for the recommended maximum of 5 days, and this will be the second day with no medication. Any thoughts on whether I should restart the Quick Cure or something else?