all suggestions welcome

IMO I wouldn't recommend celebes, Marosatherina ladigesi, for a beginner. They are not very hardy fish and pretty sensitive to water conditions. They are also schooling fish and a 20g is not big enough for a school -- they grow 2.5-3".

Other than that I can't really tell you too much about them as they are not "true" rainbowfishes. They actually belong to a totally different family than Melanotaeniidae or Rainbowfish family. They belong to the Atherinidae or Silversides family. It is thought that they are more closely related to Pseudomugilidae or Blue-eyes family.

Oh, I *can* tell you that they are not brackish water fish, although some have been found in BW. They are FW fish. I mention this because the minute someone says "Celebes rainbowfish" someone else will claim they are brackish

As for the Yo Yos, I'll leave that for someone else. I have no clue

HTH
Roan

And loaches arn't a bigner fish either.

they’re hardy and healthy eaters. BUT... Need lots!!!!!! of hiding places and will hide all most all the time and aren't that fun. I know from experience. They are afraid of you too. Sometime they will come out and chase each other around when they think no one is around, this can be fun, but you have to keep them in a pack of 3 -5 they grow quite large and you should not put anything else in that size tank, because of the bioload, they poop allot! They are an extremely social fish they love to lay on each other like sardines! lol Or hide with each other!

according to fishprofiles.com those kind of rainbows get to be 3.5" long

i know they are a schooling species but i'm not sure what the minimum number is

the loaches should be great

if the raindows don't have to be in a larger group i would think you could have 3-4

i am unfamiliar with their space requirements, waste production, etc.

so i would wait until RoanArt answers i know that she has rainbows and is very knowledgable about thier care

if they aren't suited to your tank i would consider a school of tetras 6-10 depending on size

tetras are little bit lighter on the biolead, will provide color and activity. I've never had loaches but b/c they have more meat in thier diet and have a thicker body type i would say thier waste production is on the high side.

when you do have the tank set up and cycled make sure you do weekly gravel vacuming and water changes - some say you can get away w/ 25%

but i do 50%- the fresher the water the better and once you've got everything out to clean the tank you might as well pull the extra water out it won't and more than a min or 2 to your water change routine

cheers
-Kyle

EDIT: he he Roan posted before i finished my rambling!


-Kyle

yo yo's are suposed to be more active compared to other members of the loach family i would get them- they're a facinating fish as long as you read up on cycleing and be sure to keep your water conditions very good i think you'll enjoy this fish emensely

i'd also recomend a fishless cycle it requires patience but it seems like you're doing well in that department

a forum search will bring up lots of info for you

Loches are fine

but they are bottom feeders, need adequate hiding room, and if they’re given it, they will use it as much as possible. If you think your son will enjoy a first aquarium with imagery fish that he has to take care of well go for it? And yes you must have a gravel siphon for those fish you will suck up more poop than you'll think. And to Kyle I may be new here but there is more than one person that knows a thing or two about fish.

i disagree with fish man the more hiding places you provide for your fish the less they use them

loaches tend to be nocturnal so he might enjoy a moon light on his tank

but there are a lot of loach keepers that report their pets being more diurnal

look at thier profile on www.fishprofiles.com

kyle3 said:

i disagree with fish man the more hiding places you provide for your fish the less they use them

Click to expand...

Kyle is quite right.

Lots of hiding places allow fish to feel safer. When fish feel safe, they come out in the open more because they can always get away if they feel threatened.

Same goes with many types of loaches and having more than one. Take clowns, for example: one clown on its own may be seen once in a while, however, clowns in a group are usually always out and about, day or night. Why? Because they feel safer in groups. Even more so if the group has a lot of places to hide.

Hiding spots = safer fish. Safer fish = visible fish. Visible fish = happy camper fishy keeper

Roan

switchcats said:

But I will take Roan's advice on the celebes...thank you. :bowing:

Click to expand...

Not a problem and I do have a suggestion.

If he could perhaps get a 20L, a long tank, 30x12x12, then he could stock a nice school of Pseudomugil furcatus, Forktail Blue-eye rainbowfish:

http://members.optushome.com.au/chelmon/Furcatus.htm

They're very pretty and only grow to ~2 inches. The 30" length of that tank will give the Forktails a decent amount of swimming space, and also benefit any loaches you decide to add.

Furcatus isn't an uncommon fish in the hobby. A lot of LFS do stock them or can order them. You might have to look around though.

Just a thought,
Roan