Confused!

M

mzaltadena

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Dec 12, 2006
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OK, I was the one that needed stocking information for my 10g....you all gave me some wonderful ideas, HOWEVER.... Today I went to two different LFS, I told the worker of one of the LFS that I was thinking about getting some neons to start my tank of after it cycled...he told me BAD IDEA.. neons are a very sensative fish that, and it is not recommened that I get them...he said this fish is so sensative that you can look at it and it might die...HUH? He also told me that he had experience of 10 years and that the people from this forum do not know what the are talking about.... he recommended that I get a molly, or some sort of African Ciclid.....

The second store that I visited, I ran into a man, that wanted me to convert my freshwater aquarium into a saltwater tank... he said that saltwater was easier to take care of and the fish are less expensive...HUH???

I currently have a female betta in my tank, to help start my cycle. I only got this fish because I know later that I can keep it in a small bowl by itself after I get my fish that will occupy the tank for life... I was also told that this fish will make the process longer, and I should have gotten a gold fish...HUH?

So as you can see, I am all CONFUSED on to what I am doing with my tank.

I just bought a nitrite/nitrate tester to go along with my amonia tester. The last time that I tested my amonia (tues) jt read .25.... I will test my nitrite/nitrate tonight after I feed the betta her first meal, since I got her last night... please help me people... I know everyone has their own opinions but DANM, fish keeping is starting to sound HARD!
 
My readings

Ok I just checked my tank:


Amonia .25
Nitrite/Nitrate..both at 0


Tank has been set up since Sunday added a betta female last night...and just fed her about 30 minutes ago.
 
I believe Neon Terras are sentitive fish compare to Mollies, Platties, etc. Last week I went to a LFS and stared at the tank full of neon terras. Right next to the tank, there was a big sign stated "NO GUARANTEE..."

If you go the fishy cycle route, a goldfish would have a much higher bioload compare to a betta and theortically helps you cycle the tank faster.
 
he is right about the neons. don't know if they die if you look at 'em, though.

as for SW... now that is a flat-out lie. SW is about 2-3 times more expensive than FW.
 
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if he said we dont know what we are talking about, invite him here to prove it. :) Neons are sensative, but I wonder how so many people are able to keep them alive for so long? It's from taking good care of them. If he is suguesting anything other than a shell dwelling african dwarf cichlid for a ten gallon, then it's pretty obvious whop knows best. Sure an mbuna or other medium sized african would live in a 10 gallon, but it would definatly not trive and show you its true nature. It would also be the only fish you could have in thier, as it would kill most anything else(if you had 2 one would kill the other eventually).

you are doing whats called a fishy cycle. basically you are growing bacteria that will break down fish waste. the more you feed them, the faster they grow. This is the reasoning behind suguesting a goldie, since they make a lot of waste. However, for one it will not be ok in that tank long term, and two, using a fish to cycle with is not good for the fish.

I'm not sure what you want in the tank, but if it's neons I would take the betta back and try a fishless cycle. Bettas are really not going to be healthy if kept in a bowl. They will live, but not live well. Read this about fishless cycling http://aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81388
 
sumthin fishy said:
if he said we dont know what we are talking about, invite him here to prove it. :) Neons are sensative, but I wonder how so many people are able to keep them alive for so long? It's from taking good care of them. If he is suguesting anything other than a shell dwelling african dwarf cichlid for a ten gallon, then it's pretty obvious whop knows best. Sure an mbuna or other medium sized african would live in a 10 gallon, but it would definatly not trive and show you its true nature. It would also be the only fish you could have in thier, as it would kill most anything else(if you had 2 one would kill the other eventually).

you are doing whats called a fishy cycle. basically you are growing bacteria that will break down fish waste. the more you feed them, the faster they grow. This is the reasoning behind suguesting a goldie, since they make a lot of waste. However, for one it will not be ok in that tank long term, and two, using a fish to cycle with is not good for the fish.

I'm not sure what you want in the tank, but if it's neons I would take the betta back and try a fishless cycle. Bettas are really not going to be healthy if kept in a bowl. They will live, but not live well. Read this about fishless cycling http://aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81388
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OK well like I said, people have there own opinions in this forum and I just went with the advise of another member on adding a fish to my tank. I only got the betta because I would not just toss it after it was done cycling my tank. I have owned many betta before and have kept them in small containers and they do just fine, and last a long time. As far as the fishless cycle is concerned I do not think I am going to take my fish out and let it finished.. to be honest... I am becoming fustrated on all the different information that is givin out on this board from different people. I am to the point were I just want to go and get some fish from Petco and see how well they do since they have a 14 day guarantee...HOLLA!
 
mzaltadena said:
OK well like I said, people have there own opinions in this forum and I just went with the advise of another member on adding a fish to my tank. I only got the betta because I would not just toss it after it was done cycling my tank. I have owned many betta before and have kept them in small containers and they do just fine, and last a long time. As far as the fishless cycle is concerned I do not think I am going to take my fish out and let it finished.. to be honest... I am becoming fustrated on all the different information that is givin out on this board from different people. I am to the point were I just want to go and get some fish from Petco and see how well they do since they have a 14 day guarantee...HOLLA!
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This isn't exactly true. When you PMed me, I highly highly suggested you do research on FISHLESS CYCLING. I said that fishy cycling causes permanent burns to the gills, and suppresses the immune system, possibly leading to ill fish. I don't believe you really read my messages, because the last one said "I took your advice and bought a betta to cycle with." What I said was, that the cycle process NEEDS to be initiated with SOMETHING: either fish food or shrimp (organic material), liquid ammonia, or the waste products of a fish. I never encouraged you to go out and buy a fish for this reason - as I mentioned above, I strongly encourage fishless cycling. I will present my information below.
 
Well touch wood I am using cardinal tetras in my tank that have been their since day 1 when I started my fishy cycle and they have all survived. I think they have also hatched a couple of babys as well. It was the platys that are having the trouble.
 
This is why it's a better idea to use the forum, rather than private questions...

mzaltadena said:
NeonJulie said:
mzaltadena said:
Well, I am not putting anything into the tank, other than the plants that I have and the water conditioner.. Tetra-Techs website advised me to get a scout fish to get the cycle going. But right now I have not put anything else into the tank. I did not know that you could get amonia actual to add to your tank to help the cycle process.... I am in the habit of going into different fish stores and asking tons of questions...
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Ok, but most LFS have no clue about things like fishless cycling, FYI. It probably goes against their business - they want to move fish, sooner the better. Do NOT trust every thing you hear from a fish store - come back and do some different searches on several forums, (this one, tropicalresources.net, aquariumadvice.com .) Word to the wise: Always get a second opinion - most pet store employees are sadly very misinformed, not paid enough to make the effort, or prevented by their store policies to keep the fish' best interests at heart, and your pocketbook.

The whole thing about cycling is allowing time to pass (along with feeding the tank) and waiting before the fish is brought home. You can create the same affect as having fish, by using liquid ammonia (do a search on the forum for cycling and ammonia sources, there is plenty there very easy to find.) Otherwise, if you choose to use a fish or two, you will need all of your test materials asap, and you'll need to be ready to do water changes whenever the water dictates, whether that's every other day, or 3x a day.

It makes sense to do fishless, but it is also frustrating, as I'm having, since mine has stopped progressing. In my case, I have long since passed the dangerous high ammonia level phase, and hopefully after the 5 weeks I've waited, will be able to add fish soon, and monitor the NitrIte with water changes.

This is one important fact I can't tell whether you know or not... but you HAVE to put something in the tank, to kick the cycle off. If you haven't added liquid ammonia, and you haven't added fish food, and you haven't put in a dead shrimp... you are not cycling your tank. The minor amounts of ammonia might be plant waste - it won't be enough, and your tank will not cycle, and when you add fish, it will not be able to biologically filter their environment. So make sure you get something in that tank!

See you in the threads.
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Wow thanks for all the great advise, so you are saying I need to get something in my tank huh... now when I put this fish in the tank, would he be considered a permanent resident? or is this just a fish that is going to get my cycle started....?
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NeonJulie said:
mzaltadena said:
Wow thanks for all the great advise, so you are saying I need to get something in my tank huh... now when I put this fish in the tank, would he be considered a permanent resident? or is this just a fish that is going to get my cycle started....?
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I would hope any fish you ever buy would be considered a permanent resident... but personally, most of the people on this site are not fond of using fish to cycle your tank. Unless you have a verified good batch of Bio-Spira (a semi-expensive refrigerated pre-packaged bacteria), the results are inhumane. Ammonia levels permanently burn the gills of the fish, causing scar tissue and a very good possibility of death. High NitrIte levels block oxygen from being absorbed into their organs and causing immune problems, meaning the fish could be sickly and prone to disease/parasites for the rest of whatever life it had. As I mentioned, it is possible to do this, if you never let any of the water parameters get above .25, and perform many water changes. But it could reach that when you aren't home, and I don't recommend this.

You're better off pretending you have a fish, and regularly putting fish food in the tank (which is messy), using a shrimp, or using the liquid.

I would hope no one would consider ANY pet they buy (even if it only costs 87 cents) to be anything other than a permanent resident, one you want to give the best care and home. (Whether or not it will become a meal for another fish later. Were it to become too immune-suppressed and stressed to fight off a disease, and your other fish were to eat this fish, it would also become infected.)

Do the search! Read the stickies on Cycling! PLEASE.
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And that's it. I'm sorry if something I mentioned confused you, I'm sure someone will correct me if I gave you information that said you should go out and find out if a bunch of Neons will work for your cycle.

And to answer that question... Neons are sensitive because of poor breeding and lack of care on the store's part to meet the high demands of this popular fish. If you know where they are coming from, if the store has good success with them, or you order them from a reliable source like liveaquaria.com, chances are good that they may be hardier.
 
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