IS THIS CO2 POISONING?

[odannyboy]

hi have a two foot community tankwith a few easy/slow growing plants( java fern and anubias) plants happy as well as fish. in an attempt to boost plant growth i decided to remove the venturi tube that bubbles air in via the powerhead( ugf) to reduce any loss of naturaly occuring co2.( not injecting any myself) anyhow pulled the tube out one morning and then went out.came home in afternoon to fin both my keyhole ciclids mouthing the surface along with the sae.all fish were high in the water and flapping there gills like crazy! imediattly put venturi tube back and also stuck in an air line from a pump.two hours later fish had come down from surface and were breathing slower.two hours after that all back to normal.
question, how can i remove the venturi, whould it actually make any difference at all to the plants, and why do my fish seem so dependent on 02? cheers dan

[Ghost_knife]

I wouldnt discount the fact that the Co2 had somthing to do with it. I would keep it where it was before

[Blueiz]

hi have a two foot community tankwith a few easy/slow growing plants( java fern and anubias) plants happy as well as fish. in an attempt to boost plant growth i decided to remove the venturi tube that bubbles air in via the powerhead( ugf) to reduce any loss of naturaly occuring co2.( not injecting any myself) anyhow pulled the tube out one morning and then went out.came home in afternoon to fin both my keyhole ciclids mouthing the surface along with the sae.all fish were high in the water and flapping there gills like crazy! imediattly put venturi tube back and also stuck in an air line from a pump.two hours later fish had come down from surface and were breathing slower.two hours after that all back to normal.
question, how can i remove the venturi, whould it actually make any difference at all to the plants, and why do my fish seem so dependent on 02? cheers dan

I really have no experience with UGF filters, but sounds to be like the venturi tube is there for a reason , also that you may have stopped some of your filtration by removing that tube. Did you check water parameters to see if you had an ammonia or nitrite spike?

Naturally occuring co2 will not be lost through surface agitaion. (SOmeone please correct me if I am wrong here). The surface agitation created when not injecting co2 helps the gas exchange between the water an the air in the enviroment to actually possibly increase/replace the amount of co2 in your water. This is only if you are NOT injecting co2.

Y0u didnt say what kind of lighting you have, thats one of the most important things in boosting plant growth. No need to add co2 unless you get into the 2-2.5 watt per g range of light. As you said, you have slow growing plants..theres not many things you can do to speed up the growth of a slow growing plant, hence the title slow growing..;).

[fresh_newby]

I really have no experience with UGF filters, but sounds to be like the venturi tube is there for a reason , also that you may have stopped some of your filtration by removing that tube. Did you check water parameters to see if you had an ammonia or nitrite spike?

Naturally occuring co2 will not be lost through surface agitaion. (SOmeone please correct me if I am wrong here). The surface agitation created when not injecting co2 helps the gas exchange between the water an the air in the enviroment to actually possibly increase/replace the amount of co2 in your water. This is only if you are NOT injecting co2.

Y0u didnt say what kind of lighting you have, thats one of the most important things in boosting plant growth. No need to add co2 unless you get into the 2-2.5 watt per g range of light. As you said, you have slow growing plants..theres not many things you can do to speed up the growth of a slow growing plant, hence the title slow growing..;).


You are 100% correct about gas exchange and surface agitation.
It is necessary, and O2 is not lost in the process.

[odannyboy]

ok so it seems that my ideas to boost plant growth are not going to work/not nessacery.but why did the fish react so badly /quickly to the lack of bubbles of air?

[ergo sum]

I would suspect what you were seeing had something to do with the bacteria’s reaction to the change and that in turn caused the fish some stress.

[Blueiz]

I think you had either an ammonia and or nitrite spike do to not enough circulation in the ugf. Did you test your water parameters?

What kind of fish do you have, and wha t is your tank temp? Could be the lowered amount of dissolved O2 in the water is why they were at the surface. The warmer the water, the less dissolved O2 there is in it. Some fish are more sensitive to this than others. Mainly coldwater fish which need lots of dissolved O2.

Blue

[Star_Rider]

is this a std ugf?

if it is the venturi adds air after the water exits the ugf tube. the flow of water should not be interupted by the removal of the tube feeding the powerhead.
if the ugf is the only source of filtration the venturi increases the aggitation and increases the gas exchange..if you have other filtration the venturis really have little impact.
I have a 55 with angels a ugf and quite a few plants the tank also has no added CO2 and a HOB AC filter..I have had the venturi tubes fall out for all day and never had any issues.

[5xevy]

This same thing happened to me a while ago with a faulty pump. Fish were all struggling to breathe, gasping at the surface of the water. And my one fish was already showing a red color at his fins. :( Unfortunately he ended up dying, so I'm really glad you caught your it early! How long were they like that?

See #5 here:

http://www.aquariumfish.net/information/signs_of_stress_and_disease.htm

Here's one on CO2 and tank pressure:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGGL,GGGL:2006-19,GGGL:en&q=aquarium+fish+gasping+at+surface+check+pump

[odannyboy]

got pair large keyhole cichlids,few guppys and few glowlights.id say the bioload is on the high side but i keep it pretty well maintained.venturi is after the power head,which manufactures say will pump more volume without venturi so dont think circulation is the issue.temp is 27 average water approx 6.5 ph.dont mind the air input but thought if i ever had to remove it id be stumpped!? i belived it was a drop in dissolved o2 but didnt think it would have such an impact.

[loaches r cool]

...and why do my fish seem so dependent on 02?

hehehe fish actually breathe O2, maybe you've heard of it?

Sorry, but your statement did make me chuckle. Seriously though, many heavily planted tanks dont have issues with lack of surface agitation since the plants themselves are created a lot more O2 than surface agitation could. However you wont get that without having co2 injection, fertilization, bright lighting, and a well balanced system. Even on many heavily planted tanks there is still need for some surface agitation, especially at night when the plants are consuming O2 rather than producing it. Without this venturi, do you have any ripples or strong current at the surface of your water? Air bubler? Without injecting CO2, there is little reason to stop surface agitation. The small amount of CO2 made by fish wil be less than the CO2 that will diffuse into the tank through gass echange.