Emperor vs. Magnum

[Cypherman]

What do you think? Both the Emperor 400 vs. Magnum 250 are $39.99 on BigAls...I need a main filter to support my AC300 on my 75 (yes I already know that isnt enough so dont bother saying so lol). The Emperor moves more water but the Magnum seems to "polish" it better. The Emperor has the biowheels, but for $25 bucks more I can get the Magnum 250 pro system that comes with a biowheel too. What do you guys think?

[NickH]

Owning both the HOT Magnum and the Emporer 400, I would say go with the Emporer 400. I think you get more for your money. The Emporer is rated for 80 gallons, the HOT is rated for 45 (I think). Although you can add the Bio-Wheels to the HOT Magnum, changing the media is a royal pain! Maintainence on the Emporer is a lot easier.

If you already had a solid bio-filter (like a big canister or a wet/dry), I would say go for the HOT Magnum and use the micron cartridge. However, the AC300 alone won't cut it for biological filtration on your tank.

[VoodooChild]

I guess it depends on what you keep. If you're looking for chemical filtartion Magnums really do polish it well. If it's biological....naw, I'd stick with the Magnum again and use the bio balls. The Emperor is a good one though. I'm just never too impressed with the bio wheel to make me lean in that direction. $40? I need to get over there. I think you'll be happy with either one. If you still can't decide, then the Emperor would be easier to maintain, so maybe that'll tip the scale for you.

[andruboz]

my magnum isnt up and running yet, but i have read that when polishing you may have to break it down a couple times a week to clean the micron filter. seems a little excessive to me. i thought i'd use it mechanically with carbon and the big fuzzy filter and have the
bio wheel do the biological..

[Cypherman]

Hm...1 for Emperor, and 1 for eithe way :D

2 more questions: I've heard Emperors can be noisy, especially when older, is this true NickH? Are Magnums noisy at all? And how do you change the media for the Magnum? I've read yo simply soak the micron cartridge when used once, but the main filter thingy...Do you have to replace that like any other cartridge? It seems kinda pricey from what I've seen
:(

And arent you only supposed to leave the micron on until the water is polished, then put on the normal cartridge?

[NickH]

Well, yeah, Emporers can be noisey. Noise can come from spray bars pushing the bio-wheels, the water return splashing into the tank, and the impeller. I had my last Emporer for about 5 years, and got rid of it because it got real crusty (I used it in a saltwater setup with sand for a while...not a good idea). I replaced the impeller, but it was still real loud. Still worked though. If you keep the impeller and chamber clean, it should stay quiet for years.

I've only had the Magnum for a couple of weeks. So far, it's been real quiet. However, the main seal does not work unless you apply the supplied silicon sealant. Hopefully I don' t need to add this everytime I crack open the canister, but I guess I will find out. Otherwise, it pulls air into the canister and never fully primes. Also, the main uplift tube has a small, clear plastic bubble extractor tube on it to pull air bubbles out of the filter. The only thing holding this in place is a gob of GE silicone. While reseating the media container, yeah, the tube broke free of the silicone. It sits in place for now but I guess I have to glue it back in there one of these days. I haven't even performed maintainence on it yet, this is just inital setup. Noticing a trend?

I picked up the HOT because I plan on getting another larger tank, and moving it between the two tanks for chemical filtration and polishing. I also plan on getting two Emporer 400's for the next tank for continious duty.

BTW, the micron cartridges are reusable. You just rinse them off. The regular filter floss should also be washable. Eventually, it will need replacement, like the cartridges in the Emporer. Changing the media requires pulling out the media basket, taking the lid off, etc. Not too complicated. Putting it back together is more, er, fun.

As I understand it, the Micron cartridge should be used until the water is as clear as you want. Then you empty the filter and clean the cartridge.

[NJ Devils Fan]

I have two Emperor 400s on my 72g and I love them. They are great. Other than the normal noise of water trickle, they are silent. Maintainence is so easy. All I do once a week is put the filter cartridges in the dishwasher on a rinse cycle and every few months, replace them. I also put carbon in the media baskets that are provided. I haven't tried the other filter, but I would strongly recommend getting the Emperor.

[BV77]

well , an Emperor 400 filters 400gph.....a 280 does 280 gph.......more is better

[NJ Devils Fan]

Not always BV, I could have an Emperor 400 and an AC 500. Just because the AC is 500 gph doesn't mean it's better than the Emp. Many things come into finding out which filter is better, like the kinds of fish that will be in the tank, etc.

[JP457]

I would go with the emp over anything. I run a 400 on my 46 gallon and it works great. My only prob w/ it is that it is SO loud. The filter is quiet but the water trickling could drive you crazy.

[Cypherman]

Man, so many ppl swear by the Emperors, its hard to resist. But I'm really concerned with the polishing effects. The AC's arent too good at that, but they do keep my water quality very nice. The Emperors may do the same, but I want something to really polish my tank. Will a combined Emperor 400 and AC300 do the job, you think?

[damion]

I have the Emp 400. To prevent the trickling noise, just fill the H20 to the rim. Never tried rising it in the dishwasher though. Probably save $$ on replacing the cartridge.

[Sumpin'fishy]

I think I can rate these two filters fairly well because I have both an Emperor 400 and a Magnum 250 Pro on my 55 gallon tank! I have found them both to be excellent filters. For your situation I'd suggest the Mag 400, not because it's better, but because it will do the job you need better, IMO.

One thing I would definately suggest with the EMP 400 is to buy 2 extra media chambers (the empty baskets for the second slot). This will give you a total of 4 media baskets. Now buy some Polyester filter batting (bulk) and cut it to fit into these baskets. I use this batting in both chambers on each side of the Emp. This way I get superior filtration for my buck! Use the inlcuded main filter pouches (with carbon) for when you need to clear up your tank (medicine, clarity, etc.) Don't buy any replacement filter pouches since they are so expensive! Just buy a bulk container of carbon and fill up one of your sets of media chambers (second slots) for a week or two, then put back in the poly batting.

I'm sorry to disagree with everyone but I really think people get carried away with water turnover and also with bio media amount. I had an older Mag 250 (given to me) which I used with ceramic noodles filled in the media basket and placed a pre-filter on the intake. I had a Wisper 300 as my main mechanical filter and things worked out fine biologically. I didn't have any problems with bioload. I upgraded because my fish are still growing and I already needed some better mechanical filtration. Remember the Magnum was a hand-me-down which didn't come with the micron filter, and I was using this for my bio. Of coarse your results may vary, but I think people go overboard loading up with this stuff sometimes! Your fish load makes the biggest difference!

My current setup uses the two biowheels on the EMP and the one biowheel on the Mag Pro setup. This is more than enough for my cichlids in this 55 and probably would work fine up to 125 gallons. My water is now crystal clear and I can always use the micron filter or stuff the media chamber with extra poly batting if I want! It already has a foam filter sleeve surrounding the media basket right now. I left it empty for now to maximize water flow.

Just for info, I haven't had to change out the first set of filter batting out of my EMP, yet. They rinse out very easily from the media baskets without even opening them up! You can open them for deep cleaning, though.....then throw away when needed! I just haven't had to yet.....about 2 months!

Sorry for such a long post!:rolleyes:

[JSchmidt]

I have several Emps and several HOT Mags, and they are both good filters.

The Emp is a good all-around filter. It has biowheels for biofiltration, and large filter wells that can accept a variety of media. (I've switched from the pricey and hard-to-rinse cartridges and pack the wells with AquaClear foam. Works like a charm.)

If you aren't getting ammonia or nitrite in your tank, you probably don't need to worry about extra biofiltration. If that's the case, I'd recommend the HOT Mag. These filters, particularly when outfitted with a foam prefilter, are outstanding mech filters. You can pack the media basket with floss or run the micron 24/7. The micron requires some extra fiddling to clean it, but it will really keep you water clean. It's just not real practical in tanks with messy fish, like cichlids. For straight mech filtration, I think the HOT Mag is superior than the Emp.

The reality is that both are good filters; both would probably serve you well.

Good luck,
Jim

[Cypherman]

How do you clean the micro, exactly? I assume its reusable since a new cartridge costs so much...

[Sumpin'fishy]

I run it under tap water and rinse off as much as possible that way then fill up a large container with 1 part bleach to 4 parts water and soak it for 24 hours. Next day rinse it real good, refill the container with clean water and some extra dechlorinator and soak another day (probably not necessary, but I do). Fully rinse it again, and let it completely dry out. It's then ready to be used again for about a week at average bio load. (this is a rough estimate!)

Just as a thought....you might want to pick up one or two extra micron cartridges when you buy this filter. I'm not sure how long they last (depends on gunk in tank and how often you use it.)

[AikidoGuy]

I have 14 Emperor 400s. Two on every tank. I use those and wet/drys on all of my tanks. I have two that are noisy and the rest are quiet. One of the two noisy ones i have to turn off everytime a do a water change on that particular tank so i guess from starting and stopping it twice a week for the last 4 years has taken its toll on it, and the other noisy one actually is the one that NicKH was talking about, i bought it off of him a while back. Still works great just makes a racket. I use the filter cartidges and i fll the grey media boxes with a fine filter cloth that is used on the drip plate to the Amiricle wet/dry filters. That combo works for me. Ive thougth about switching over to AC500 for the higher flow rate but i think the emperors have better/more filtering capabilities. I think the magnums are way to much work when it comesytime to clean and work with them. JMO..

[NickH]

I remember seeing the "official" flow rate for the Aquaclear 500 actually being 428GPH. Is that still true or has it been upgraded? If not, I don't think another 28GPH is anything to get excited about...

[AikidoGuy]

Is that so Nick! i did not know that! in that case i would see no reason to get the AC over the Emp400.( at least for my application) although if you run multiple filters then I guess the extra 28gph could start to add up but you would 3 or more to really make any difference.

[cpr4cpu]

I have been happy with the Emperors in my lineup too.
Easy maintenance, and when the parts need replacing it's a simple job that doesn't require taking the filter off the tank.

I guess I am up to 5 units now, and when I wanted higher flow rates, I added a second filter unit. I use two model 280's on a 55 gallon, and two model 400's on my 125 gallon, and a single 280 on my 29 gallon tank.

[AikidoGuy]

Hey Nick that convict still toughin it out with the midas or did they get the best of it yet?

[NickH]

Kevin, the Convict is actually THRIVING...

It sticks up to both Midas now. Mostly it tries to stay out of their way, but it's not afraid to get into a confrontation. Knock on wood, none of the fish inflict physical damage on each other, they just chase each other around a bit. The male Midas is twice it's size. The Convict is a chunky one though. One tough customer.

Say, does anyone know how to visually tell the difference between a male and female Convict? Just curious...

[AikidoGuy]

The female will have orange on her body the male will not. Older Males develop a hump on the head females are smaller and have a more rounded head. Male supposedly have longer trailing fins but i find that a bad way to sex because my female has very long trialers so out goes that theory. on the webpage in my profile you can look at the fish pics i have a pic of my 4 year old male convict. great color/nice hump/nice fins/ and hes very thick! this guy might see some show time at the fall NJAS show.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid60/p8ab015a9a68f0d2034bed843033c6172/fc542731.jpg

[NickH]

Cool, than I definitely have a male. You can see the hump clearly on yours in that pic. He looks awesome!

[AikidoGuy]

Thanks Nick. Ive had that fish since it was an egg. Its about 4 years old now. It has survived some TOUGH tank mates in its time. one of my favorite fish. poor convicts get no credit.. lol

[NickH]

Yes, convicts truly are the underdogs of the CA cichlid world....probably because they are way too common.

Inch for inch though, one tough cichild.