Yellow Tang vs. Bicolor Angel

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Iceman

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May 15, 2003
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Rhode Island, US
Hello everyone,

I have a question hopefully someone can answer. I just cycled through my tank, and have had a yellow tang (1) in it for about 2 weeks. I just purchased a bi-color angel, and the yellow tang is going after it, making the angel hide for cover. It keeps doing this. Is this normal? Do these two not like each other?

Any help is appreciated.
 

Boogiechillin

It's ok, I confuse my students too.
Oct 26, 2000
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Akron, OH, USA
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Tangs are pretty territorial, and I would have recommended that it be one of the last additions rather than the first. As it went into the tank alone, it's staked the whole thing as its territory, and the angel is an "intruder." Fortunately, fish aren't too sharp, and if you rearrange the way that the rock is set up, you can somewhat "reset" territories to give the angel more equal footing.

BTW, to house both of these fish, I hope that this is at least a 75g tank...
 

Iceman

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May 15, 2003
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Thanks for the info. I think you might be right now that you mention that. I think I've heard someone else say that.

My tank size is 55 gallons. Right now, both the tang and angel are pretty small. Hopefully it won't be a problem.
 

kreblak

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Mar 13, 2003
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Boogie is right, fish are decent learners, but they aren't real sharp cognitavely. If you rearrange the LR and other objects in the tank it will confuse the Tang, and while he is busy staking out his new territory the Angel can settle in unnoticed. Yellow Tangs are just very territorial animals.

How much live rock do you have in the tank? Adding some more could do wonders for the fish fights. Making the LR into a cave sort of structure can also help. Just make it so the fish have hiding places, and can hang out without fear of attacks.
 

Iceman

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May 15, 2003
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I went out yesterday and bought a couple of pieces of live rock. I set it up like you saidd (in cave fashion), and it seems to have helped. I only have two pieces right now. Can I continue to buy more pieces. I am just afriad it may cramp the tank.
 

kreblak

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Mar 13, 2003
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In a 55 you shouldn't have too much trouble with space cramping. The rule of thumb with live rock is 1.5 - 2 lbs per gallon to achieve full biological filtration. Try to get small rocks (one or two pounders) and stack them. If your LFS only has the big boys (ten pounders and up) then just try to make sure that you don't place them in such a way that it takes up all the swimming space. The best stacking I have seen usually involves the LR in the center of the tank, stacked into caves, with a "racetrack" created around the edges of the tank. This allows fish to swim as much as they want, and still hide at a moments notice.

There are some good pics illustrating this over in the General Marine Forum.

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10809


http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10146
 

OrionGirl

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Aug 14, 2001
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Having adequate hiding places for the fish is very important. Even fish that swim as much as tangs need to have many hiding places to be comfortable and thrive. Forcing fish to stay out in the open will stress them, and cause many problems, including the aggression you've witnessed.

I urge you got lots of rock--even if it's not enough to be your primary filtration--but to provide a comfortable home for your fish.
 

Iceman

AC Members
May 15, 2003
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Rhode Island, US
Thanks for all the tips everyone. I initially thought I'd run a fish only tank (which I guess means no liverock?). By adding all the liverock, am I in essence creating what they refer to as a "reef system"?

It seems from what your telling me, there is definitely more benefits to go this route. I think I will continue adding smaller pieces, although I wonder about:

(1) what to do when the live rock dies. Doesn;t it eventually turn brown, meaning it's pretty much dead? I would then have to continually change the rock (not that its a probelm...)

(2) are there any other requirements I would need to change in my setup if I continued to go this route? (i.e. lighting, etc...)


Thanks
 

kreblak

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Mar 13, 2003
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Live rock is "alive" in that it is teeming with millions of nitrifying bacteria that provide your primary source of amonia and nitrite breakdown. LR also comes in with hitchhikers that are usually good for your tank, such as corraline algae and various types of worms.

When purchasing LR, it is important to know whether or not it is "cured" or "uncured" rock. The difference is whether or not the LR has undergone sufficient die back. When the LR is in the ocean, it is covered with living things. When it is harvested, many of the things on the LR die off, increasing ammonia levels. If the rock has been cured, then it has already experienced enough die back to be placed in your tank and not cause any ammonia spikes. Uncured rock, on the other hand, has not experienced sufficient die back, and will produce an ammonia spike when added to the tank. Uncured rock is often used for tank cycling because of this.

Seeing as there are fish already in your tank, I would very much reccomend using pre-cured LR, as you do not want to cause any ammonia spikes that are going to harm your fish. To answer your questions, no, you will no need to replace the live rock and it will not turn brown. If you are trying to grow caulerpa or other photosynthetic marine life then you'll need upgraded lights, but for regular LR your existing lights should be fine to keep the good algae growing.

It can seem pretty overwhelming at first, but that what these boards are for. Keep asking questions, and keep learning, your fish will thank you!
 

OrionGirl

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Aug 14, 2001
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Having live rock is not the same as running a reef. Reef tanks contain live rock, in addition to corals and a multitude of crustaceans. And no, you shouldn't be replacing live rock, ever--though you can add to the stock. It should remain alive in your tank, even if the hitch hikers die off or are killed. We have live rock in with the aggressive fish, including a trigger. There are many macro algaes, small corals, and sponges thriving on this rock, despite the occassional nibble from the fish.

Live rock contains some external life, but the primary benefits are the cover it provides for your fish, and the area for bacterial colonization. Live rock will also import many beneficial organisms, such as copopods and bristle worms. The same conditions that you test and maintain for the fish (ie, pH, alk, salinity, nitrogen metabolites) will allow the live rock to function as a filter, though you may lose some of the macro algaes and corals. Supplementing calcium will help, as would more light, but it is certainly not a requirment.
 
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