gold fish bump ??? what is this

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Kashta

Always Niko's fault.....
Jun 24, 2008
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Susan
Hi Aces.. thanks for getting the photo posted.

Inka4040, 247plants, DeeSeven, and I spoke with Aces in chat a little earlier about his goldfish, so I'll add the details about this that we already have.

This is a common goldfish that measures 4 inches long at the approximate age of 2 years. Tank size is 10 gallons. Aces described a mass that is growing along the right side as being under the skin.. like it's a big bubble inside.. and the scales in that area are being pushed outward. It's also red and looks to Aces like it's filling with blood.

At this point, we talked about growth and stunting... and the possibility of upgrading to a larger tank size. Aces told us he can't do that.

So this is where we are -- At 2 years of age, the goldfish should have grown already to around 8-10 inches long. As a fish grows in a tank that's too small, it naturally produces hormones that keep it from getting bigger. Unfortunately, this only does that to the body.. the eyes and the internal organs continue to grow normally, despite being compacted by the restricted size of the abdominal cavity.

The mass causing this bulge could be a few things. Given the circumstances from stunting, the internal organs are likely being pushed outward and have reached a point now that it's caused this bulging on one side. There's also a possibility of a tumor inside. This could also be swelling due to an internal bacterial infection.

Aces... now that you've figured out how to post photos, would you take a few more pics for us to see? I know it's hard to get goldfish to sit still long enough to take pictures, but this would help us see better. If possible, try to get a photo of him from a side view. Another one looking down from above would also show us more about the bulging.

Other than the stunting and this mass, I don't see any other signs of illness in this photo. There's a nice wall of bubbles behind him that shows the tank is well oxygenated. You've clearly done a good job maintaining this small tank as well as you could. Over the last two years, you've managed to avoid a whole range of health problems that typically happen when a fish is overcrowded this badly.

Even so, your 10 gallon tank is not going to cut it. He has overgrown inside and is not going to survive where he is anymore. The stunting is so severe that it may be too late to save him at this stage.

Your only real chance to do anything for him is to get him into a bigger setup, keep the water quality pristine, and feed him a very high quality diet. You may not be able to get him into a brand new aquarium, but you could surely find a 20-30 gallon used tank on Craigslist for very little money. You could also get a huge Rubbermaid storage tub that holds 30+ gallons of water and set that up on the floor somewhere with an air pump and filter. You really need to explore these other options.

There's still no way to be sure this will save him, but if he gets into a larger environment and stops producing growth inhibiting hormones, over a long period of time, he might be able to grow enough to relieve the internal compaction. Only time and adequate housing for him will tell us that.
 

Kashta

Always Niko's fault.....
Jun 24, 2008
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Susan
Thought of something else that for you to consider, Aces. And a few more questions to ask about. I wish we could see the actual location of the swelling better. That will give us a better idea whether this mass is positioned more where there is well muscled tissue or if its more an internal/abdominal problem .... but you should be along soon to post updated photos.

Something else you could do to find out more on this would be to net the fish or cradle it gently in your hands... holding him just below the water's surface. Take a very close look at that swollen/distended area. Then (VERY gently) touch it a few times. Don't go poking around or handle him a lot. Obviously, this would be painful for the fish, who'll probably be rather distressed anyway. But let us know how the mass "feels" ... whether it's hard and firm or soft and squishy. If the bulge feels rather firm, this would indicate an actual tumor, other type of growth, or something that lies beneath the flesh/muscles. If it's soft or squishy, it's more likely an abcess under the skin that could be drained (maybe) or a herniated portion of the side that allows part of the internal organs or some internal growth to shift outward to this spot.

Along with this, please tell us the general disposition you observe. Is he still active, swimming around, and eating normally? Does he hang out at the bottom, hiding among and behind plants/decor, and are his fins clamped? It would also be helpful to find out what the gills look like underneath the gill cover (operculum). Are they reddish in color, medium pink, or pale? A large tumor or similar growth inside usually draws a substantial amount of the goldfish's blood supply away from the rest of the body. As that becomes more severe, you can tell this is happening because the gills will become abnormally pale.

Another photo taken of the fish from underneath would help, as well... if you could manage to do this while holding the fish upside down. Something else to find out would be whether or not the anal vent area appears to be distended in any way.

I realize that a lot of these possibilities and the sort of questions we've been asking you must sound quite scary. I certainly don't wish to alarm you unnecessarily... we're just doing the best we can to help you identify what's wrong as accurately as possible. I also still believe the most likely concern now relates to a problem caused by the severe stunting we already know exists. However as other possibilities do exist, the best thing for us to do is consider everything we can.

Hope we can see the other photos you've taken very soon.
 

WaterBaby

Senior Member with Senior Moments
Sep 23, 2002
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bump

I bumped this because I am curious as to the outcome of the fish. I am having a similar problem with one of my shubunkins. He has a mass larger than this on one side, and a smaller one on the other. It is certainly filled with blood, but I haven't had the nerve to try to lance it because I'm afraid that he's going to explode. Currently I'm treating with metro (in the water, because he has stopped eating) and I really don't think he's going to make it. I have finquel on order and am waiting to either put him under and try to draw some of the liquid out or euthanize him if it doesn't work.

I've never seen anything like it. He's not stunted in any way. He's in a 90gal with 2 other shubies and 2 comets.
 

WaterBaby

Senior Member with Senior Moments
Sep 23, 2002
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Here's a pic of my shubie. The picture is very fuzzy, but you can easily see the large lump.

DSCN0826 (3).JPG
 

Lupin

Registered Member
Sep 21, 2006
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Hi WaterBaby,

Have you by any chance already read this? It's about Wendylove getting her problem sorted similarly as you planned.
http://thegab.org/Articles/CystAspiration.html

I would not risk doing any operations unless you are confident you can do it. Perhaps ask a veterinarian to assist you on this one but you need to make sure he/she knows exactly what to do here.
 

WaterBaby

Senior Member with Senior Moments
Sep 23, 2002
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Florence, New Jersey
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Ha, Ha Lupin,,,,

I am also a member of the GAB forums, and currently have a thread going about this problem there:

http://72.36.167.186/~thegab/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=18339

I just posted a reply saying that I think the lump looks smaller today. He's eating some medicated food now (a little), but he's still weak and has lost some weight.

Wendylove's goldie looks to have had a water based cyst. The fluid in my shubie looks to be bloody (but not as much today).... I don't think I could have "stuck" him anyway :headshake2:

Hoping,,, always hoping...

Thanks,
Michele
 
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