Strange Bump Picture Inside

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bradlgt21

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First off water parameters are fine 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, 5 ppm Nitrate. PH is 7.6-7.8 temp 78. My German Blue Ram gets harrassed by my Dwarf Gourami very bad. Chased in circles around the tank at times. I am thinking this is probably a wound but want to be sure. It is a small bump I would describe it's appearance as a wart on a human. It's on his gill plate but not near the opening more like on the cheek. He hasn't been scratching, hiding, not eating etc. He acts completely normal and like nothing is wrong. I put him in a QT tank with Macryn-2, that is why his color is all washed out. He seems to be doing fine eating and not even hiding that much in the QT. I am thinking about relocating the Gourami because he picks on some other fish to but hates the ram. Could this be something worse then a wound, maybe a tumor or disease and if so how do I treat it. Here are the best I could do with pictures, as you can tell it's a little swollen but still small. I think the swelling has gone down this is his 3rd day of treatment. The wound has kind of turned the color of the meds to I think it's helping a little. What you are looking at is the redish spot under his eye almost near the bottom just a little in front of the gill opening.

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NeonFlux

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He looks like he needs a breather for a couple of days. His color will improve over time. I think both gourami and the ram need to establish their territories firsthand. Or they just don't mix up well.
 

bradlgt21

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I have had both fish since March. I think they have established territories already. Gourami thinks he owns the whole tank even the caves. I am not worried about the Ram's color I am worried about the bump under his eye. I know it's hard to see in the pictures but like I said it reminds me of what a wart looks like on a human. I always thought wounds caused a indent not a bump.
 

bradlgt21

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Since he is eating, breathing, acting completely normal am I to assume he is fine and this is just a wound of some sort. I ask this because there is a fish swap this sunday and I was hoping to pick up a couple syno's. So I figure I have 3 options.

1. German Blue ram goes back in main tank, synos go in QT tank
2. Syno's skip QT (they will be from a local breeder at the swap), Ram stays in QT tank under observation.
3. Syno's and Ram share QT tank and hope neither get the other sick.

I really don't want to lose this guy, he is like my favorite fish, Follows my finger on the glass, eats blood worms from my hand, comes to the glass when I am nearby. Is nice to everyone else. Just a great all around little guy.
 

bradlgt21

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After looking at some anatomy pictures and trying to figure how to explain the location and problem better I found out that the location is the fish's operculum. It's like a boney plate that covers the gill it opens and closes to maintain pressure in the fish's gills. It looks to be inflamed with the bump on the bottom corner of it. In this picture it would be Number 1. Maybe he has something inside his gills like gill flukes?

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bradlgt21

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Just wanted to update this it has been a week and his gill area still doesn't look to great. The bump is still there and I can't really tell if it has gotten any better. I don't think he is eating very good anymore as he looks to be getting skinny and he gets excited when I feed him but ends up spitting like everything back out. How long do fish take to heal?
 

Cerianthus

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W/o knowing all the facts, cant make recommendations.
But if you think it is due to DG harrassing ram, how about isolating DG in home made Penalty Box w/i the tank until Ram recovers from injury and/or regains strength to fight back. Ram should be able to handle itself from DG and even other common larger gourami.

You can use any clear plastic jars (must punch lot of small holes for water circulation) or LARGE breeding trap as timeout/penalty box for isolating bullies.

I had great success withthis method when introducing new fish (give extra time for new fish to adjust to new tank w/o any harrassment & also let them see each other) and/or isolating bullies whenever needed. This extra effort given to fish always yielded higher survival rate.

Hope ram recovers soon!
 

bradlgt21

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I have ram in a QT tank but I do have a livebearer box. It's supposed to float on the top of the water with a lid on it. I am more concerned with him being healthy and not spreading anything before I decide to put him in the main tank. But when the time comes I will try that for a little bit.

I know what you mean about the ram sticking up for himself. It's weird I had 2 rams in there and they both grew up and were males and this was the more dominant one. I brought the weaker one to a fish store and yet the stronger one runs away when the DG comes by. The lady at the fish store corrected me saying you mean the Ram was chasing the DG. She said she never heard of a DG chasing a Ram.
 

mel_20_20

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I'm going to stick my neck out here and make a diagnosis and recommendation.

I believe that your fish has an infection in the tissue there on the gill plate, and it could possibly be causing swelling of the tissue internally, possibly extending into the nose, throat and/or mouth.

It may have started with an injury to the skin that opened the way for bacterial infection. The stress of the aggression from the DG could have weakend his immune system, making him more susceptible.

If you haven't noticed breathing difficulty then probably the gill may not be affected.

I am concerned that this is an infection. I base this on the fact that he wants to eat and seems hungry, but spits food back out and he's losing weight. Though the bump does not appear to be larger, the swelling may be extending internally. His behavior has changed, as well.

I enlarged your photos and looked closely and could see the bump fairly well. It looks disturbingly like the bump that was on another fish I've seen not too long ago.

Another AC member, can't remember his name, had a Celestial Pearl danio that had a bump on his head, forward and just below his eye, that started out like this.

The bump got slightly bigger during the illness, but not much bigger externally.
The fish gradually went downhill, though at first the fish seemed to be not bothered much, just as your fish.

A post mortem photo of the CP danio showed the bump had come to a head, actually two pinhole sized points, though didn't rupture, and the whole area was slightly reddened. It looked to me that the swelling had affected mouth and throat area, internally, preventing the fish from eating.

The fish didn't develop other signs of external or internal infection, such as; red streaks on the body, red blotches on the body or at the base of the fins, or red streaks in the fins. He just couldn't eat, looked like he didn't feel well, and he finally succomed to the illness.

I would get Furan-2 if possible and begin treatment with that in the hospital tank. Binox, also, is a very good, strong antibiotic that would be a good choice if you can get it. I would keep his water pristine. Most meds can be dosed, then 24 hours later you do a big water change and dose again.

Furan 2 and Binox both contain Nitrofurazone. Nitrofurazone can be combined with Kanamycin (Kanacyn) for an extra strong attack on this.

You could just watch the fish for a few more days, keeping his water absolutely pure in his QT, but I believe that jumping on this quickly will give him the best shot at recovery.

Another antibiotic, if you can't find the others, would be Maracyn II. (Not plain Maracyn)

There's a chance this could be a parasitic worm under the skin, but nitrofurazone would also help with that if this were the case.
 
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