Gourami infected wound - Help please!

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fabiobruno

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Oct 3, 2009
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Fabio Bruno
Hi guys,

First of all apologies for any silly questions I may ask, I'm very new to the hobby (but I'm trying hard to catch-up through book, internet and this great forum).
I think I've got a problem with my female dwarf gourami, I'd like to be optimistic and assume this is just a wound that will heal with a bit of help.
I've got the gourami on Saturday, I hadn't notice the wound when I bought it, but I'm sure it was a netting generated one (or maybe during the trip back home, but I doubt because it is a 10 minutes trip and we put extra care on it...). I wasn't using any coating product in my tank (~25 gallons planted, fully cycled a couple of weeks ago) but on Sunday the LFS shopping assistant suggested me to add "stress coat +" so since that day I'm using it. I added the dose for the 25 gal. and now I'm just conditioning the ~30% of water I change every 2 days. I'm testing the water every day and I have 0 ammonia and nitrite and ~10/15 Nitrates, the PH is 7.8.
Now the silly questions:
Should I increase the water changing rate?
Should I add more conditioner?
How long should I leave the new conditioned water before adding it to the aquarium?
Is the clorine removed immediatelly when I add those products?
Do I need antibiotics? Which one?
Here I have a few pictures of Lucy (not the best quality one but hopefully the one showing better the wound):

Sunday night (see old post, posted in wrong place...):
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forum...9&highlight=dwarf+gourami+disease#post2158119

Today (Thursday):

Thanks a lot for your help!:1zhelp:

gourami.jpg gourami_side.jpg
 

mel_20_20

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Sep 1, 2008
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Deep in the heart of texas
Sorry... I just noticed this post... I'll bump (move to the top) for you. I have to run out to work, but I will check back when I get home around 5pm.

Hopefully someone else will have checked in to help. Oh, by the way, no such thing as silly questions. :)
 

fabiobruno

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Oct 3, 2009
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Fabio Bruno
Thanks Mel!
I guess the problem is that I post with UK time and it is a bit too early over there for people to notice the other side of the word posts :)
Back to Lucy I'm worried that the situation is getting worst, I can see what it looks like a bacterial infection to me (cotton like on the wound), and she hasn't been eating a lot today. I'll post a new picture later (after I help my wife in putting the kids to bed), if I manage to get a good one.
 

mel_20_20

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Oh, Fabio, that sure looks bad, doesn't it. Before looking at the photo I was leaning towards Columnaris, a bacterial infection, but this looks like a fungal infection.

Fungus infections can get started at the site of an injury.

There are several options when it comes to treating fish fungus. . I don't know what all is available in the UK but if you can find Malachite Green or Potassium Permanganate, which are usually available from aquarium fish stores, and follow the direction usage indicated on the bottle.

On top of that, you can also combine treatment adding 0.5% salt to the water. Monitor the water temperature at all times to ensure that it doesn’t go above 25degC so that it will help in the recovery process.

I hope other AC members will check in on this to confirm my diagnosis, because Columnaris does have a cottony look, but that has the hairy look of a fungus. Also, there's a lot of redness around the area so there may be fungal and bacterial infection involved.

What kinds of antibiotics are available for fish in the UK?

I have to leave for a bit, but will be back in about an hour.
 

fabiobruno

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Fabio Bruno
Thanks a lot Mel!
I don't know what antibiotics are available, I will surely ask tomorrow morning at the aquarium shop.

How do I apply the malachite green? Directly on the fish or in the aquarium? (I don't have a quarantine thank, so I guess the other fish and the plant will be treated too).
And what about the salt (aquarium salt?) would the other fish have a problem with that?
How does a not infected injury looks like? Because I guess it is difficult for a wound to heal properly under water...
What would happen if a fungus is not treated?

Have you heard about the dwarf gourami disease? Could be that instead? I would love to give Lucy a companion gourami but I wouldn't like to risk the contagion.
Should I keep on changing 30% of water every 2 days? Is Api stress coat + useful in this case?
 

mel_20_20

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Sep 1, 2008
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Stress coat is fine. Your water change routine has been good. What testing equipment do you use to test your parameters: strip or liquid test kit? Strips are very unreliable and more often than not give inaccurate results. A good liquid test kit, such as the API Master Liquid test kit will insure that you are gettting accurate readings.

Regards to the use of Malachite green or Potassium Permanganate: You can apply Malachite green or Potassium Permanganate to the affected area. You have to use caution when using Malachite green, as it is a toxic substance, but by following the directions carefully you can safely use it. Care must be taken to avoid the gills and eyes when applying it topically, so it could be dicey trying to dab a bit on the area, so close to the gill.

It would be good if you could separate the Gourami. I bought a "Sterilite" plastic container that cost around $5 or 6$, about 10 US gallons in size, that I used for a hospital. I have a little Whisper 5-10 gallon filter I got from WalMart and a heater. The hospital tank wouldn't be cycled, of course, so you would have to monitor the params every day and do water changes to keep ammonia and nitrites at 0 ppm. I threw in a silk plant, aquarium safe, for the fish to hide under and feel safe.

I know it's an added expense, but it would be good to have on hand for future problems and you could use it as a quarantine tank for new fish, as well.

Try to find Prime, by Seachem, a water conditioner that not only removes chlorine and chloramines, but it also detoxifies ammonia and nitrites. Prime is helpful in the hospital tank as ammonia can begin to appear during treatment. Prime would help take care of traces of ammonia in between water changes. (works for appx 24 hours)

Furan 2, if available, is supposed to treat true fungal infections and bacterial infections as well, according to the maker. I've heard of good results with it here on AC.

Jungle Labs Fungus Clear is another; it is fairly inexpensive and, according to the maker, treats bacterial and fungal infections, and though I've not had a true fungus infection in any of my fish I have used it for bacterial infection.

In regards to salt, table salt is fine and much cheaper than aquarium salt. I've learned from the fish gurus here on AC that the traces of iodine and anti-caking ingredients in table salt are inconsequential.

I don't know what you have available there. Hopefully the aquarium place will have what you need.

Fish have remarkable recuperative powers when their water is kept pristine, and wounds very often heal quickly in clean water, but once a bacterial or fungal infection has taken hold, as it has in your fish, it needs to be treated with appropriate medications. Probably the stress of netting and the trip weakened your Gourami's immune system a bit.

I would definitely keep the water as clean as possible. No ammonia, nitrites, and keep nitrates 20 or less. I think I would up the volume to 50% every two days for now; reducing levels of dissovled organic compounds as well as traces of ammonia and nitrites.

ADDENDUM: It is very late and I'm extremely tired so I haven't edited for typos, spelling, or other grammatical errors or sentence fragments, so I apologize if there are any. I'm nearly crossed eyed from sleepiness.

I'm wishing the best for you, and sincerely hope that your poor little fish gets better. Please keep us posted with her condition, and let us know what you find in the way of medicines at the aquarium place.
 
Last edited:

Jennie Beth

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Feb 20, 2009
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fabiobruno,
I had a pond type fish with a similar injury this summer...damage to the gill cover, as well as one fin. I treated the tank rather than just the fish while it was in quarantine, dosing with the malachite green at 1 drop per gallon.
I've added a link to the thread...there are alot of photos, some with similar fuzzy fungus like your Lucy has. It is a long thread, but there might be something there that will be helpful.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196670

Best of luck with your little one,
Jen
 

mel_20_20

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Sep 1, 2008
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Deep in the heart of texas
Jennie Beth! I remember about Indigo, but I forgot that she had fungus along with her injury.

Fabio, that is a great link that chronicles the injury and recovery of her beautiful fish. Part of Indigo's gill cover was even missing, but she recovered.

One drop per gallon would certainly be easier than the application of Malachite green topically, which requires a stronger concentration.

You could try that in your exisiting tank and watch for a few days to see if there is improvement in the redness around the injury site, keeping close eye on the area to see if there is a concommitant bacterial infection along with the fungal infection, which may need an antibiotic as well.

The redness could be merely due to the injury and fungal infection, but often bacterial infection is present. Hopefully the Malachite green will be all you need for your little girl.
 
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