DIY LED parts list for 6 foot long planted tank

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bigwave

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Jan 23, 2008
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Reading around here, I kinda came up with a plan. Looks spendy, and I don't want to buy it if things won't work out well. I was also hoping to get approval by someone who has done this before so I don't waste money / time.

The tank is a 180 gallon planted, and I am wanting pretty good growth. 6 Feet long, by about 2 feet deep and wide.

Previously I have ran a 75 gallon with 4 x 55 watt PC, CO2 and Liquid fertilizers. Also a 95 gallon corner tank with a 150 Watt MH.

Hopefully somone with LED experience can help me out here, and make sure my parts list is correct / adequate for the size tank.

LED: CREE XM-L Cool White T6 ($9.19) x 36
http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/products/CREE-XM%2dL-Cool-White-T6.html

Driver: Meanwell LPC-35-700W ($18) x 3 (Should drive a 2 foot section with 12 LEDs.)
http://www.rapidled.com/servlet/the-3/driver-700ma-48v-drivers/Detail

Heatsink: 4.23" Wide, by 22" Long ($29.33) x 3
http://www.heatsinkusa.com/categories/4.230"/

Total Price: $475 :eek3: (And that is before shipping, and before the wood to make it pretty)

All this will be wrapped in a custom wood frame, open on top and bottom, probably just a 1 x 4, stained to match the aquarium stand, and lifted up to the appropriate height. The 180 is basically divided into 3 sections, on the top, and this will give me a set of lights over each section.

Additional Questions:
Is this enough LED lights?
Should I save some money, and go with the CREE-XM-L-T5, which would be a $3 saving per LED, but 20 less lumens?
If I do go with the T5, would it be better to get another 12 LEDs and a driver, for a total of 48 LEDs?
Is this a light enough load I can get away without fans?
Any ideas on equivalent florescent wattage? ( I know that is a bad way of measuring, but it is what I understand :) )

Sorry if this seems like newbie questions, but I havn't done a lot of LED work yet. I have built a couple light hoods, and liked them plenty, but those were all Power Compacts. I have Radio Controlled planes, and am comfortable with soldering everything together, so that doesn't worry me.

Hopefully someone with some knowledge can fill in my gaps, and if you need more info, let me know!

Full build thread is here, to see the tank setup and eventually the finished product: http://www.aquariacentral.com/forum...Basement-with-180-gallons-125-gallons-75-Sump

David
 

bigwave

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Jan 23, 2008
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And 1 thing I forgot, lenses:

Probably 40 degree, ($2.50) x 36 for another $90. I could go with 60 degree, or maybe a mix of some 40, some 60?
 

Ace25

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IMO, fans are always a good idea. Heatsinks will pull the heat away from the LED but the heat gets trapped in the fins of the heatsink and acts as a hot blanket if you do not have any airflow over the fins to push the heat away. It takes just a small amount of airflow over the fins to push the hot air away, so you don't need a big/fast/loud fan for the job.

How high off the tank are you planning on mounting the light? That will determine which optics to go with. If your going 20+ plus above the water line, then 40's, if you go 12"-20" go 60's, 4"-12" go with 80's, and if you set the LEDs right above the water line, no optics.

Since this is a planted tank, I think going with XM-Ls is serious overkill. I think you could get by fine with XP-G cool whites in the same number your thinking (36-48). I run 48 on my 75G tank, but it is reef so it needs the extra light, planted tanks do not. They are the "best of the best" today (XM-Ls) but you pay a big premium for them and I don't think you get your moneys worth out of them right now because they are so new and pricey compared to XP-Gs. I think going with just cool whites is fine on a planted tank though, unless you want more yellow/reds in the tank, then maybe put in a few warm whites scattered through out. Any blues though are not needed at all on a planted tank and would probably make it look very weird and unnatural so it is good to see you didn't even consider that for your tank.

For general comparison, I think 9w of LEDs (3x 3w cool whites) is equal to the output of a 65w CFL 10k bulb as far as the plants are concerned. I think it takes about 9 LEDs (27w) to equal the output of a 54w 4' T5HO 10k bulb. Just a general comparison since it is a little hard to compare such different styles of lighting (small intense points of light vs long tube of light).

I know it cost more money up front, but going with dimmable drivers and a dimmer kit really is worth it since you can "fine tune" the output of the LEDs. If you go with a constant current driver like you mentioned (I use those on my sump) and the light ends up being to strong for the plants there isn't much you can do except take the light down and remove some LEDs. With dimmers, just turn a knob slightly and all set. I would not build a display LED light without dimming capabilites myself, especially after building a few and seeing how I went way overkill on my builds (I had them turned up 3/4 of the way, so 750ma on my reef tank, and nuked my corals from too much light when I initially installed it).
 

1oooop

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IMHO, the heatsinks are a little overkill. You can screw the LEDs onto a sheet of aluminum or something and it will cool them down sufficiently. That, or if it doesn't, you can always mount little active heatsinks onto the aluminum sheet.
 

bigwave

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Jan 23, 2008
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Ace, thanks for the opinion on the lights.

Looking at another post I saw the reef-angel, and am thinking I might get it, and use the pwm controls on it, especially if I get the pwm expansion module.

I think if I do that, I can get the lower end XP-L's the T-5 version which will save me lots of money, and combined with PWM, I should be able to dim it down to the XP-G equivalent. About $2 difference per LED, and it still gives me a lot of flexibility. I really worry about not having enough lights, because to get the nice red plant colors, the extra light really comes in handy.

Mounting height, will probably be about 4-6" off the tank. So I guess the 80 degree optics would be best. I plan on mounting the lights a little 1/3rd of the way from the front of the tank, and leaning it back, so the shine is away from the people watching the tank, and focused on the tank floor plus my taller plants in the back. I will have to get out my little construction 'square' and measure and 80 degree angle and see what results I get from that location.

1oooop - I do think the heat sink may be overkill, but I prefer to build that way! Also that would give me the option of adding more LED's in the future. I actually even considered a flat aluminum bar, and water cooling it somehow, but that would start to get complicated!

A final question for the experts, how do I attach the LEDs? I see some people say screw, other say heat epoxy, I was looking at http://www.heatsinkusa.com/products/Arctic-Silver-Thermal-Adhesive.html
Would it do the trick? Is there another easier/better way to attach them?

Now I am off to learn more about Reef-Angels, and how to program them. I have use Arduinos before so it shouldn't be too difficult.
 

Ace25

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If you were talking about 1w LEDs, then an aluminum sheet may be sufficient to cool them, but when you get into 3w LEDs there is no way that would suffice. Even a good heatsink with fins is no were near enough to cool 3w LEDs without a fan (I used a 23"x4.5" heatsink on 24 LEDs on my 29G tank and you would burn your fingers if you touched the heatsink after 30 minutes of use without fans on it).

As far as mounting, the thermal epoxy is probably the best, cheapest, and easiest method to mount them. I used the thermal pads but they are expensive and I don't think they work as well as epoxy (LEDs don't stick as well). Screws work but that is a big pain in the butt drilling and tapping that many holes.

If you have previous Arduino experience and feel comfortable with it then the Reef Angel is a great product.. for the masses though that are afraid of programming I would probably recommend something else like the Apex Jr instead (you can do dimming control with any modern controller, Adruino needs the -P version of drivers, the Digital Aquatics and Neptune controllers can dim the -D models).

Yes, for 4-6" above the tank I would recommend 80s, anything tighter than that at that distance is going to give very noticeable light bars in the water. I recommend starting on the low side of the amount of LEDs you think you will need and add more if you think you need them, vs the route I went, which is put 2x as many LEDs as I found out I actually needed because they are much stronger than I thought before I started building them. I probably wasted $300-$400 on my original build because I went way overboard. If you got the $, nothing wrong with that because you just turn them all down and they will last a lot longer, but the reality is, if they last 5 years at full power or 10 years at 1/2 power, I will more than likely be replacing all my LEDs in 5 years anyway because there will be MUCH better LEDs on the market at that time and probably cheaper than what I paid today.
 

bigwave

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Last year I bought an arduino, and temperature sensors, a few tilt sensor and a 12 AC relays, to build myself a whole controller from scratch. However I think buying a working Reef-Angel is more likely to get done, since I have 2 kiddos who also get large portions of my time.

I'll get the silver thermal adhesive, and actually I think I will just get 1 70" heat sink. Maybe as short as 64' but I will have to measure that out at home, to see what exactly I want. Then the heat can spread across the whole thing, and I will have a little more stability. The three smaller ones sounds like a nice idea, but I also figure I can cut the big one up into 3 small parts if I want to later.

Adding the -p drivers, and lowereing the price of the LEDs seems to keep the price just over $500, which is acceptable to me (The wife on the other hand is another story!).

Another quick question:
Will these 80 degree optics work on the XP-L, or no? They are listed for the XP-E.
http://www.rapidled.com/servlet/the-44/80-Degree-CREE-XR-dsh-E/Detail
Alternatively where can I find good 80 degree optics?
 
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DoctaQ

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i dont think 80 deg optics exist for the xm-l, and the optic for the xp-e is not going to fit, optics are an easy addition however
what is your source for the leds?
ledgroupbuy.com is pretty cheap and the t5 bin (which is enough for you) is going to be enough, but if the xp-g is any cheaper you might as well do that since at 700ma the output is going to be about the same, you dont see much benefit between the xp-g and the xm-l until you get over 1000ma at least iirc

another way to cut down on cost is to get bigger leds, like bridgelux (which you definateley want to drill and tap for) and use less of them, either that or get higher powered drivers, and continue to use the xm-l, raise the array and increase the current, at 2000ma its still very effecient and will still blow any other light source out of the water
 

Ace25

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Forgot to touch on one point that you mentioned.. "I really worry about not having enough lights, because to get the nice red plant colors, the extra light really comes in handy."

I bet putting in a few of these would really help both the "red plant colors" and overall usable light for the plants since they are 660nm, perfect wavelength for plants. I would guess 6 on your tank, 1 every 12". Then put in a similar amount of warm whites, so one driver will have both the reds and warm whites on them which you can dim separately and give you some control over color of the tank. Put optics on the warm whites but the reds do not need optics since your using them to add color to the tank, you want the color to spread out as much as possible.

http://www.rapidled.com/servlet/the-172/Osram-660nm-3W-Red/Detail
 

bigwave

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How does that red LED differ from the CREE version here (the nm are really close)? http://www.ledgroupbuy.com/products/CREE-XP%252dE-Red.html
I would be tempted to keep all the same brand if I could, but I do like the thought of throwing a little red in there.

Also can the optics from an XP-E and XP-G be interchanged? The 80 degree optics are only for the E (which are blue and red), whereas the LED I will probably get are the cool white XP-G. I like the looks of the 'Black' optics.
 
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