Synos and ich? Help please!

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dani_starr

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Dani :)
I have 6 smaller then 1" syno petricola I got a couple weeks ago from someone on here, and they mananged to get ich when it spread in my main tank from my gourami. I've had the temp at 89/90F since Monday, and my tetras, gouramis, and betta are free and clear. My plecos only have a few spots left. But my synos are still fairly covered, prob 10-15 spots on each.

The guy I got them from said not to use salt nor malchate green, because they are very sensitive to it. They are active and eating, but I'm worried given it's been almost 5 days and it is still on them?

What should I do?
 

Jannika

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Hi dani
What does the seller suggest you use? Catfish salt-sensitivity has been overblown, imo. To treat Ich you should use 2-3 teaspoons per gallon for a couple of weeks. The amount is actually quite small compared to sea water, for example. 3 teaspoons salt = .75 oz. Sea water contains 4.75 oz salt per gallon. They should fine for that amount of time, much better than having ich. Good luck!
 

platytudes

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Copper is what they are most sensitive to, so things like Mardel's Copper Safe and Aquari-sol are out. Copper is strong stuff which I prefer not to use in any situation!

You can safely use Rid-Ich or Quick Cure at a half dose, it's formalin and malachite green based. Scaleless fish need a half dose...but other than that, it's safe and fast acting.

Acriflavine should also work, but it might dye your silicone seals blue.

When medicating, you should slowly bring the temp back down to something like 82 or so. 90 degrees is very hot, and medication lowers dissolved oxygen levels in the water, so you could create asphyxiating conditions by medicating AND keeping the temp up that high.

Make sure you run all the airstones and/or powerheads you can, keep the top uncovered at least a crack by wedging something in between (perhaps blowing a fan along the top of the tank, ideally) and lower your water level so the filter makes more splash. This will help greatly :)
 

dani_starr

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Hi Jannika,

I wrote them, and they said not to use salt. I told them that before I wrote them, I put about a total of 5 tbs total of aquarium salt in there, and he said "I would stick with high temperature. Syns are super sensitive with any ich medications and with salts as well. Ich would die off fad st ansoon at 88 degrees. Keep me posted."
 

platytudes

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Many LFS keep them at a salinity of 1.005 because that is what they run all their tanks at, as a preventative measure.

They could probably tolerate more salt, but salt is an unreliable ich cure. You need a TON of salt for it to really work.

I am really surprised your LFS mentioned malachite green and salt, but not copper. As long as you are careful, it is safe to use. For example, calculate actual aquarium volume, a 55 gallon will have water displacement due to decorations and substrate, so probably only has has 50 or so actual gallons. Use 1 drop per 2 gallons instead, so about 25 drops.

The only other real alternative besides dye based medicine is a salt bath, which will be very traumatic...more for you than the fish. Fish hate an aerated salt dip, but it is effective. You will feel like you are killing the fish though, that's just how it looks.
 
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dani_starr

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Dani :)
Copper is what they are most sensitive to, so things like Mardel's Copper Safe and Aquari-sol are out. Copper is strong stuff which I prefer not to use in any situation!

You can safely use Rid-Ich or Quick Cure at a half dose, it's formalin and malachite green based. Scaleless fish need a half dose...but other than that, it's safe and fast acting.

I have doubts about this, I did that for my tetras, half dose of quick cure, came home two hours later to find 3 dead, moved the last 3 back to my 55 gallon, 1 died over night, 1 died in the afternoon, only my female is left now. I'm worried same thing happening to my synos

Acriflavine should also work, but it might dye your silicone seals blue.

When medicating, you should slowly bring the temp back down to something like 82 or so. 90 degrees is very hot, and medication lowers dissolved oxygen levels in the water, so you could create asphyxiating conditions by medicating AND keeping the temp up that high.

Make sure you run all the airstones and/or powerheads you can, keep the top uncovered at least a crack by wedging something in between (perhaps blowing a fan along the top of the tank, ideally) and lower your water level so the filter makes more splash. This will help greatly :)
Both powerheads are full flow creating a lot surface agitation, like water boiling. And my top isn't fully covered either, I have a HOB power filter, and a couple inches of the plastic things lining the glass broke so there is a good couple inches exposed, but not big enough for a fish to commit suicide easily. And the filter as well, water is about an ich or so. No one is gasping at the surface though, so at least I'm good there :)

Thanks Platytudes! :eek:

Also, now at the base of Izzys fin (my long fin blue eye pleco, only 3" long) has gone red too, ammonia and nitrite 0ppm, nitrate about 30ppm. I'm doing a 50% water change, anything else I should do?
 

platytudes

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Oops, sorry...just realizing that these are TINY fry! Yikes.

Well, fry are more sensitive to medication. Perhaps do 1 drop per every 5 gallons...and definitely no salt dip for them.
 

platytudes

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Other than the water change, there isn't much else you can do. Vacuum the gravel, though, when you do the W/C because the fewer organics in the water, the better the medication will work if you need to use it.

Normally I would say to run carbon if a fish has redness around the fins (to optimize water quality) but you're about to medicate, so don't do that. Hopefully she will get better on her own! Sounds like this tank is a bit unbalanced right now, but things should settle down once the ich clears.
 

dani_starr

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Lol yep, they are just wee little ones. I wouldn't of subjected them to it either, couldn't handle it with my itty bitty babies! ;)
(That is how I treated my gourami though, she had no reaction, and I put a LOT of salt in there, but she's cured now, so yay!) And I should of said this earlier, but I got them from a seller on here, not my LFS. So given he said their highly sensitve, I'm guessing he doesn't keep them in salt at all. My filter catridges have carbon, should I put fresh in? I haven't changed them in about 2 months probably..is that bad? :( I know I'm not supposed to touch the bio wheels, and only rinse out the other things, alternating each month, in dirty tap water.

I'm really worried about medication, could I just hold off and see if it clears and medicate as a last result?
 

platytudes

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That's strange, I have used Quick Cure many times over the years and never had any issue, including with tetras and blue rams. Many people use it prophylactically also (although it's not something I like to do). Quick Cure is mostly formalin, by the way, very little malachite green.

On the one hand, 1" fry are going to be delicate...I've more commonly seen these sold at 2 inches or so. On the other hand, 5 days is a while to be showing spots still. I personally wouldn't wait much longer past a week to try something, even something homeopathic (like Herbtana, which you can Google) or add more salt. The good thing about salt is you can always dilute it if the fish seem stressed. Kosher salt can always work instead of aquarium salt. You can put it in a plastic container with some holes poked in it so that it dissolves more slowly (this is what the pet stores often do, especially Petco it seems).

I would put in new filter pads, yes, if you want to keep using disposable media. You might be better off to try some AquaClear media such as the foam sponge and Biomax - rinseable and reusable, and there is bound to be a size that fits your filter (even if it's not an AC). Otherwise, if you're just rinsing the cartridges, the spent carbon is acting as biological media (to an extent...ceramic media is much more effective) and that thin layer of floss is really not doing much of anything, since it can't be cleaned very well on the grid. I am not a big fan of cartridges, myself. Wasteful, expensive, and not very efficient if you ask me! I use AC media in all of my hang on back filters....however I do keep carbon and a filter sock on hand in case of emergencies.

Good luck! Hopefully they'll begin shedding their spots soon. When that happens, gravel vacuum and do another big water change (since the ich parasites attempt to breed and multiply in the substrate once they detach from their host). By the way, this is a helpful article on treating ich:
http://cichlid-forum.com/articles/ich.php
 
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